No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

I live in the middle of nowhere, with the closest RC clubs, trainers, and airfields being over 3 hours away. I recently built a Kadet Seniorita as a trainer, only to have it destroyed by the family dog while I was away on vacation (far beyond repair). I had just finished covering it and hadn't even gotten a chance to fly it yet - not a happy man to say the least. So now I've just decided to look for another trainer. At this point, I'd just prefer an ARF. I already have a .40 OS engine and radio, so something in that size range would be ideal. Since I have no choice but to learn to fly on my own (yikes), I'm looking for the most durable, forgiving trainer. Also, my guess is no matter how tough the plane is, I'll probably still destroy it at some point while I'm learning, so something that is reasonably inexpensive is a bonus. I don't have the catalog in front of me, but I saw a few ARF trainers in Tower Hobbies that resembled the "Stik" models, but are made by a different company. They were only about $60 I think and supposedly bomb proof. The Seniorita I built was recommended to my by a friend who said it was a relatively easy plane to learn to fly with (only rudder and elevator - no ailerons), but even if it hadn't been destroyed by the dog, I was still a little nervous about flying it because the construction seemed kind of "delicate."

Any advice on really tough, good trainers that can handle some abuse?

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Get one of these, they're damn-near indestructable:

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXK965&P=7

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Just my 2cents worth, get your self a foamy. I know it will take some additional outlay for chargers and such, but they are somewhat more forgiving than a balsa/glow powered trainer.

You chances of crashing your plane on the first flight are about 100%. I've got probably 30 to 40 flights with an instructor, and I crashed mine on take off Friday. It's repairablem but there was some major damage.

You need an experienced pilot to check out the plane befor your first hands on. Things like balance and trim, problems that become obvious only in the air, need to be under control before you have a chance of getting the plane in the air and back on the ground in one piece.

In my case, using a simulator didn't do much for my actual flight skills. Things are just so much different when you are standing there with the transmitter in hand and the plane heading down the runway, and that is the easy part.

Don

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

skelrad,

Since your kinda stuck with having to be self taught, you're going to have a hard time finding a plane that would be good for you to teach your self on without risking a 5 second flight. You'll probably have to think quite seriously about going to a park flyer or powered glider to have the best success. What part of the country are you in? Winds in various parts can be a problem.

I'm in the process of building a little ARF to use for park flying/thermaling. It's sold by Hobby People and called "School Boy". It has a 50" wing span, and I'll be using an OS .10 on mine. I'll let you know how it does after it's finished and flown, but it appears by the nature of the design it should be a gentle flyer.

A .40 size plane that is really tough and uglier than butt ugly (but its a kit), is the Balsa USA Stick 40. If you build the fuselage with epoxy and the wings with carpenters glue, it's an extremely tough plane. I've had several and it will fly on an engine as small as an OS .25 LA. Your .40 will have a bit more power than it needs, but you can also throttle back. It can be build 2 or 3 channel. IMHO, in you situation and if you want to stay with a .40 size, I highly recommend you go with this plane. Since you already some building experience it won't take you long to build it up. I can get a picture of it's smaller brethern, the Stick 30 tonight (I have one framed up) if you want.

Hogflyer

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

You may not be aware of them but it appears that there may be clubs in your area.

http://www.ama-dist-8.org/Clubs/Locator.php

I used 25 miles from Fort Colins and got four results.

FRONT RANGE AIR SHOW TEAM......RC......FORT COLLINS CO 80525
LOVE-AIR R/C INC...............RC......LOVELAND CO 80538-1781
ROCKY MOUNTAIN MODELEERS.......RC......FT COLLINS CO 80525
VALLEY VIEW FLYERS.............RC......LOVELAND CO 80538

There is contact info listed also. Before heading out on your own, please try to contact some of them.

A good, inexpensive ARF trainer is the Tower Trainer 40:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXCAS2&P=0
65 bucks

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Thanks for the quick replies. I evidentally haven't updated my profile - I'm no longer near Ft. Collins. I live up on the side of a mountain in the Rockies. I have a nice big hay meadow to learn to fly in. Thankfully, in the mornings there is almost no wind on most days.

I do have a question regarding the "Sturdy Birdy" mentioned. On Tower's website it says it can take up to a .40 engine, but in the manual it says not to exceed .30 due to weight. Better to go with a different model, like the Duraplane Trainer that is built for a .40 size engine, or do you think the Sturdy Birdy would be okay with the bigger engine? By the way, I'm at 9000 feet, so as far as power goes, the bigger engine the better.

Thanks for all the help.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Try this, i'm self taught on this plane three years ago. Maybe 10 bux in the air frame. PM me if you need more details. I can give measurements and such if you need it. The "fuse" is a 3 foot piece of 1/2 inch square poplar from Home Depot or Lowes. The "wing saddle" is mahogany or sheery from the hobby store, and the up rights are 1/2 inch hard balsa. You can make the whole thing out of balsa, but then it's kinda frail. Wing, horizontal stab, and vertical stab, are 1/4 inch blue foam core. Three channels, throttle, rudder and elevator. Flys with a 350 brushed GWS motor on a 5.3 or 6.6:1 ratio gearbox. And slow enough to walk next to. I dorked mine into the ground several times. Lotsa fun though, I still have mine at my parents house. Not enough room here at my apartment.

Oh yeah, get a simulator. I has saved me thousands. No joke.

PS: the wing is baked in the oven for 20 minutes in a form I made from plans at foamfly.com

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

My brother and I taught ourselfs with the Multiplex EasyStar. Yes it is electric, but the thing is almost indestructable. We did climb alot of trees at first, but after about 3 weekends we didn't have any problems. Great way to learn the basics. I am now getting into nitro. The EasyStar was a great first choice for us. Hobby Lobby RTF for 269.00 or just the plane for $59.00. Good luck!
chopper man

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Skelrad,

At that altitude you'll need a light wing loading for .40 power. I'd suggest rebuilding the Kadet, but the structure is not the most rugged (that's also why its so light and flies so good).

In your case of teaching your self to fly, keep with a 3-channel plane - Rudder/Elevator/Throttle. You'll have to learn to trim it out by your self, and the less controls to mess with the better. You can upgrade to ailerons at a later date after you learn to fly. You will also be battling the issue of density altitude where planes just don't like to perform. At 9000' even a .40 will struggle to develop power on these planes. With the altitude, the plane will still want to fly at say 40 mph airspeed, but the ground speed will be quite a bit higher compared to being at 500 ft. I think you really need to take a very close look at an electric powered glider. It has the wing area to help carry the weight yet keep the speed down. They are very gentle to fly and react slowly to control movements. When they stall, the don't loose very much altitude (your biggest enemy). And the motor will not care about density altitude, only the prop will (others who fly at high density altitudes may be better at helping you with props, but I think a larger dia may work better also).

The Duraplane has a span of 50" and weighs 5.25 lbs., the Hobbico Sturdy Birdy has a span of 53" and weight 4 lbs. Quite bit less in the weight department and a bit more wing area.

By comparison the BUSA Stick 40 has a span of 60" and weighs 5 lbs. It has a lot more wing area. http://www.balsausa.com/kits/kit.htp?id=36&shopperid=
A bit more weight than the Sturdy Birdy, but a much larger wing for a lower wing loading.

What every you do, take your time and do your homework. You're flying at an altitude most people will never see. I know when I fly full scale that the climb performance at 9000' has really degraded to a crawl. The same happens to models.

Hogflyer

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

I'm leaning towads the Sturdy Birdy II, but don't know if it's smart to go ahead and put the .40 engine in it versus the .30 max that the manual recommends. ?? Is it okay as long as I get the CG right, or will the flight characteristics change enough that I'll have a tougher time handling it?

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Try to talk to somebody at Hobbico first. You need to expalin to them that you think you need to fly with a larger engine due to the density altitude you'll be flying at - let them know about that 9000'. Last thing you want is to find out your plane will fly at 60 mph ground speed, and just mush along.

I haven't read the assembly manual, but per the Tower web page, it should work if you something like a .40 LA. They warn against the FX engine which has ball bearings and will weight a lot more and power.

Hogflyer

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

How about a flight sim, I've got old G2, and it's got a instructor mode in it. Ive heard more times than not, "If you can take off, fly and land the simulator, with out crashing, you'll be able to fly the real thing." I still play with it, just for fun, and if you do crash, it cost $0 to hit the reset button.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Completly off topic. but do you think that could work as a speed plane they suggest a .25 la what do you think a tuned .61 would do to it [sm=confused.gif]

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Nah, you'll rip the wings off or fold them in half.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Look at the recent " simulator " thread in beginners. An FMS download is free and a cord for your transmitter is available under "links" on the site for about 40 - 50 bucks. You'll be glad you did. No one builds a trainer to withstand a crash.

Good luck.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Look at a SPAD Debonair (http://www.spadtothebone.com). Build the wings longer than the plan, and add 1/2 inch to the chord. with an OS 46 ax and the slightly lower wing loading, you should be ready to go. And you'll have a plane that is truly designed to take a beating.

Brad

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

It depends upon which .40 you have.

If you have the .40 LA then it will work fine on the Sturdy Birdy as the .40 is more like a .25 FX in weight and power.

If you have the .40 FX, then yeah go with something else.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

For what its worth, I taught myself to fly over the past few months with a Hobbico Superstar .40. Its a pretty big plane that flies well. I bought a simulator and flew it for 2 weeks every night. Weekend of the 3rd week, I took to the air and flew pretty well (for a newbie). Once I got over the first couple of flights I relaxed and have been just fine. I could be better at landing, but I have only bent up one set of gear so its not that bad. I also flew a Goldberg Tiger 2 that I liked. I am a firm believer that you can teach yourself to fly if done right. Others may disagree, but I thought it was fun and am proud to be a self taught.

Edit to add- I firmly believe the simulator was the only reason my plane did not end up in a pile of sticks after 5 seconds. They are worth their weight in gold.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Skelrad,
I think I have found the perfect plane for you. Its the U.S. Aircore 40 Trainer. It is a plastic, foam, and wood airplane that is "indestructable" It is selling on tower for only $70 [link]http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXKH24&P=7[/link] I have also posted a pic of an add that was in MA a few years ago. It may be a bit blurry and hard to read, but in the lower right hand corner in the blue box it says, "If you crash and destroy your U.S. Aircore 40 Trainer before you learn to fly, we'll replace it - FREE!" I admit I have never flown this model, but I have seen it fly. I also know people who have crashed theirs several times without destroying it. But with a free replacement guarentee like that, I don't see how you could go wrong.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Unfortunately the guarantee also states the following.
Success Guarantee: You will learn to fly with this trainer or
US Aircore will replace it with another US Aircore trainer.
All this is assuming that the modeler learns to fly under the
supervision of a club designated instructor at an AMA-sanctioned
field. This is also assuming that the airplane is assembled as per
the instruction manual. This guarantee is effective for 60 days
after kit is received.
If you don't have an instructor it doesn't do you any good or fly at a sanctioned field.
Still looks like a good bird.
chopper man

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Thanks for pointing that out chopperman. I should have gave the warranty a closser look. Yeah, I was thinking that deal sounded too god to be true:eek: I still think it would be a good choice though. It is without doubt a tough plane for a great value.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

You mean there is nobody in Colorado Springs that fly's r/c?

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

I wouldn't recommend the U.S. Aircore Trainer. I had one and it was too heavy. If you already knew how to fly it would be fun but I would suggest something like the Kadet Senior to learn by yourself. I think you want something slow and stable where things don't happen too fast.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Slow and stable would be the electric foam trainer I posted earlier. A lot of guys have learned on something similar to it at the feld I fly at. Plus, building it is a snap and allows you to learn a little about building in general as well.

RE: No Instructor - Need a Sturdy Trainer!
 

Consider the Hobbico Nexstar. It comes with a basic flight simulator. It is almost RTF and you can spend hours on that simulator to get a lot closer to flying without disaster. Good luck in whatever course you take. You have a lot to choose from here.