Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

With the new season approaching, our club instructors are concerned about the possibility of new students showing up for training with spread spectrum radios.
Our club has buddy boxes for Futaba, Hitec, JR, and Airtronics, along with the cords for each.
Is anyone familiar with their compatibilty with the new spread spectrum radios from the current suppliers?
Will special cords be required, or a special buddy box?
Thanks for any advice.

Mike

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

We do to (have those buddy boxes) but I beleive the new Spread Spectrum radios are not compatible with the older technology.

The Spektrum, for instance, will buddy box with another Spektrum but I don't think with anything else. You may want to do a little more research from the manufacturers of the specific radios in question to see about compatibility.

The Airtronics RDS6000 looks just like the RD6000 radio and may be compatible, but I am not sure and will have to check on that one myself.

As for Futaba and JR.. well, I just don't know.

CGr.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

I was interested in the compatibility of the new 2.4 GHz transmitters and got this response from Futaba for the 3 questions I asked. It appears that the only restriction is that the buddy box have the square connector.

Regards,
Jerry

Thank you for your recent e-mail.

1. Yes, the 6EX will work as the master with a 4YF as the student.

2. No, it will only be a standard 4 channel setup with no mixing or programming available.

3. There is a one second delay going from the 6EX to the student transmitter but not back to the 6EX.

Sincerely,
John G.
Product Support Lead Technician
Futaba Programming Technician
Great Planes Model Distributors
www.realflight.com
NO AUTORESPONDER


I have 3 questions. Will the 6EX-2.4 GHz work as the master with a T4YF as the student box?

Will any of the program setup for the model be available to the student? I.E. end point adjustments, expo, trim, etc. Or will these be inhibited? The manual states that when the trainer function is enabled one must select which model is to be used. This implies that these will be available but I'm not sure.

The manual also states that there is a one second delay when the instructor initially depresses the trainer switch. Does this occur each time or only the first time? Also is there a delay when the instructor takes control? If so how long?

Thanks in advance.

Jerry

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

That's the way it usually works.. the master is the 'better' TX and the slave is the lesser model or the buddy box. And, yeah, the Futabas do have a round and a square connector. We have both in our club so we're good. Thanks for posting that information from Futaba. That will be useful. There is also a round to square adapter for the Futabas.

Usually, when working with plain jane buddy boxes, any computer setup on the master will not work when in the buddy box mode. It will usually work if BOTH transmitters are the same, ie. both computer radios AND both set up exactly the same.

The delay is each time you press the button. That one second should not be a factor in determining if to use one.... just make sure the student is at least "3 mistakes high" in altitude, meaning plenty high up there.. :D and that the plane is in trim and the student is ready to accept control. Say to him or her.. 'YOU HAVE THE AIRPLANE' before pushing the button.

CGr.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

With everything that is currently out there you can use the older buddy boxes with no problems. At least with the first releases of 2.4 GHz radios all most of the the manufacturers did was update the transmission circuits inside the radio, but the rest of the functioning of the radio is identical to it's 72 MHz counterparts. So yes, you can use your old buddy boxes.

Spektrum 2.4 can use a Spektrum or JR buddy box
Airtronics RDS8000 can use any Airtronics but the Quasar
Futaba can use any Futaba that you have the matching buddy box cord for
JR can use JR or Spektrum

Ken

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

There ya go! And from an authority! And you can take that to the bank!!!

Thanks Ken.. I also needed that info for this upcoming season as we have all sorts of buddy boxes lying around.

CGr.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Thank you all for your help.

Mike

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

One thing to check ....on the Spektrums.. the trainer function must be enabled. They can be set for student, trainer, or inh.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Same thing on the JR X9303. You have to turn on the trainer function as well. It's done on the JR so that they switch can be reused for other functions when not in a training situation.

Ken

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

[/quote]

... so that they switch can be reused for other functions when not in a training situation.

Ken
[/quote]

Ken, probably a dumb question considering the Spektrum is basically a JR, but does that also apply to the Spektrum?

CGr

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

CGr,
That I can't answer that because I've never used a Spektrum radio. I just did a quick scan through the online manual for the DX7 and didn't see anything saying that you could reassign the trainer switch, but please don't take that as gospel as I could be mistaken.

Ken

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Hi Ken.

Ok.. I can check it if needed. What I DO want to do is reassign one of the switches to an engine kill switch. Someone on RCU said how to do it, but I can't recall, and that was when I first got the radio and all the tech stuff sounded foreign to me because I was just not up to all the lingo of the mixes and so on for that radio.

Thanks again.

CGr (Dick).

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

CGr,
The new RDS8000 has a dedicated throttle cut button right on the front of the radio!!! ;););)

Ken

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Yeah.. as does all the airtronics RD series transmitters. The RD6000 as well as the RD8000. And I miss that little ditty. Not sure why JR/Spektrum did not do that. I have to hold the trim to 0 throttle to shut down every time I land, which is a little bit of a pain as compared to the good old throttle cut button on the Airtronics... grrr.. :D

Especially considering that if I forget that I went to 0 throttle trim, on the next flight, after refueling, starting can be a sort of a pain if I forgot to go back to the center of travel for the trim.... I've opened up the throttle a few clicks to start, then after starting, go back to 'idle' and the engine shuts down. I say.. what's going on here until my little pea-brain begins to function and I realize that my idle trim is at 0.... duh.. :eek: so I move it to mid range and restart. Not necessary if it had the throttle cut button as on the RD's.

CGr.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

CGr,
Oh yes, I know exactly what you mean. That is one of the first things I noticed about the JR X9303 when I reviewed it. [:@] I assigned the trainer switch the throttle cut, but I would have preferred if it had been a dedicated switch like the Airtronics.

Ken

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

when engaging the trainer switch there is a one second delay for the student to get the plane but when you release the switch the instructor has immediate control

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

I'm pretty sure that with Futaba both radios will need to have the square micro plugs.

From the 6EX manual:
If connecting the 6EX-2.4GHz to another 6EX-2.4GHz with the small, square “micro” trainer jack, use the “Micro to Micro”
(MM-TC) trainer cord (FUTM4415). Never connect the T6EX-2.4GHz trainer system with Futaba radios that have the
large round "DIN" connector type as it will cause your T6EX-2.4GHz to malfunction. The T6EX-2.4GHz transmitter may be
connected to another T6EX-2.4GHz, or any T4EX, T6EXA, T7C, T9C, T12Z, T14MZ, FX-40 series transmitter.

From the 7C manual:
Trainer cord - the optional training cord may be used to help a beginning pilot learn to fly easily by placing the instructor on
a separate transmitter. Note that the 7C transmitter may be connected to another 7C system, as well as to many other models
of Futaba transmitters. The 7C transmitter uses the newer rectangular type cord plug. Both new-to-new and new-to-round plug
style trainer cords are available.

To me that reads like BOTH radios can connect only to square connectors but be careful as both kinds (sq to DIN) are available. Avoid DIN radios.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

... so that they switch can be reused for other functions when not in a training situation.

Ken
[/quote]

Ken, probably a dumb question considering the Spektrum is basically a JR, but does that also apply to the Spektrum?

CGr
[/quote]

On my Spektrum DX-7 Heli version... the trainer switch becomes the "Hover Pitch" adjustment when not in trainer mode. Not sure what the plane version calls this switch....but it does the same thing.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Ok.. thanks for the info.

CGr.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

A new member brought his Avistar and Spread Spektrum DX6i radio to the field yesterday. I brought out the club's JR buddy box and cord. The buddy box was charged up.
I connected the cord to the Spread Spektrum radio and to the JR buddy box. The volt meter on the JR buddy box went to the green without turning it on.
The Spread Spektrum radio was sending signals to the receiver, but when the trainer switch was toggled the JR buddy box did not work.
The Spread Spektrum instructions were vague regarding the trainer function. It did mention that the buddy box needs the same capabilities as the master transmitter.
Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Will the new member have to buy another Spread Spektrum transmitter?
Thanks,
Mike

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

CGRetired,

"The delay is each time you press the button. That one second should not be a factor in determining if to use one.... just make sure the student is at least "3 mistakes high" in altitude, meaning plenty high up there.. and that the plane is in trim and the student is ready to accept control. Say to him or her.. 'YOU HAVE THE AIRPLANE' before pushing the button."

I just want to mention something here from my experience. I have Futaba 6EX 2.4 and my 12 year old son's is 6EX 72. I have buddy boxed with him a couple times. When I toggle the trainer switch, that one second delay can be a little bit strange. A couple times I have said "you got it" and he says "no I don't", and then a second or two later he will say "OK, I got it". I have checked with Futaba, and they say it's normal. What has worked best for me is to show him while on the ground and no engine running EXACTLY what is going to happen when I toggle the switch. An easy way to do this was to hold one of the control surface sticks on the "master" box in a postion different from the "slave" box. Then when I hit the trainer switch, he could really see that "one second delay". I am just mentioning this because it scared him the first couple times.[X(]

On another note, we were out flying yesterday, and my boy sure loves that Tiger 60.:D

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Don't know, and a buddy box does not have to have the same capabilities as the master just the same brand. Buddy boxes typically are non computer 4 channel radios.
Here is a compatable box for all Spektrum radios (according to Horizon anyway) http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...rodID=JSP98140
Another thought? It may be possible that the trainer switch on his DX6i is not working?

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Thanks for your thoughts Missleman.
The trainer switch was held for up to 30 seconds each time we tried it so I don't think it was the delay factor.
Unfortunately, if the problem is with the trainer switch, it will only be determined by having a tried and true buddy box hooked up to it.
I'll have to check and see which model the JR buddy box is. It's an old transmitter that we took the crystal out of. Could this be a factor?
Mike

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

CG,

Theres a throttle recovery feature available on the DX7. You have to activate it for each airplane then the box will remember where your throttle trim setting was before you trimmed down for engine shutdown. Just bump the throttle trim switch one click, and it will reset your idle setting. You can do this just after shutting down or when you turn the TX on for the next flight works either way.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

The trainer switch is set to work the timer by default. In this mode, the trainer switch would not work unless there is a delay like other Spektrum radios use.

Go into the setup for the timer and move it to another switch, There are only two available, one os the trainer switch and the other is the throttle cut, that may help out. I've used my 6i for helicopter training and I had to remove the switch from the timer to make it work correctly

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

We have the same problem...

My son took his brand new DX6i to the local club Tuesday night for his first flight. The instructors were unable to get a JLine Quattro to act as a slave. The DX6i ran the servos fine, but when the training switch is pulled there is no response when the Quattro controls are used. The club experts were baffled, even one who had a DX7. Nearly an hour was spent twiddling with the settings (yes, we made sure the timer function was not connected to the training switch). Also, a second buddy box (also a Quattro) and cable were tried with no success.

The manual is unclear as to any settings that may need to be made, and only mentions that if you are using another DX6i, the settings must be the same.

We want to try again this Tuesday. Is there some secret to making this work?

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Not sure about the DX6i but on the DX7 the trainer mode needs to be enabled seperate from the trainer switch. I'll check the manual in a sec.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

Couldn't find that but did find:
MASTER
The transmitter can be used as a master but the slave transmitter must have the same programming (i.e. reverse,
travel adjust, dual rates, mixes, sub trims, etc.) as the master.

This tells me the Quatro can NOT be used. Hopefully someone will point out that I am wrong. Good luck.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

I hope there will be a simple answer. This is the first time I have seen a computer radio that requires another computer radio, programmed the same, to buddy box with. If this is true it will be very difficult for alot of new pilots to get hooked up with an instructor.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

futab 9c computer radios can pass on mixing and dual rate capabilities to the slave but the switches to select these modes can onlybe selected on the master so that even a four channel radio may access these functions.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

But we are not talking about a Futaba radio so irrelevant.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

I had always been led to believe that the programming had to match, so that when the trainer switch is pulled, the controls don't go crazy. I didn't guess that it would prevent any function whatsoever.

Which of course leads to the question: Which transmitters have the same programming as the DX6i, and can therefore be used as a slave? Only another DX6i, DX7, and a few JRs?

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

In most other radios this is not true because most buddy boxes are not programmable. The buddy box only supplies stick input any special mixes, dual rates ect.. are done in the Master only. You only have to assure servo direction and trim switch settings.
It appears that Spektrum radios do it differently. A strike against them.

RE: Spread Spectrum Compatibility With Old Buddy Boxes
 

I entered a request on the Spektrum website, and received an answer. It appears that the Spektrum DX6i can act as a master to any JR or Spektrum transmitter EXCEPT the JLine Quattro and JR Sport S400.

Hope this helps all of you coordinating training at your clubs!

Ken,

Thank you for your recent email. You are correct, the S400 also will not
buddy box with the DX6i. The DX6i will work with all other Spektrum and
JR transmitters.

I hope you find this information useful. If you should have any further
questions, please reply to this email or give us a call at
1-877-504-0233.

Thanks,
Matt "Mac" McCarty
Product Support Team Member

-Original Message-
From: kenwhipple

Comments: What units will work as a slave to a DX6i?

My son got a DX6i for his birthday, but when he took it to the club for
his first flight, the club experts were unable to get a JRline Quattro
to work as a buddy box. See
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=7487248

Should the Quattro be able to act as a slave to a DX6i? If not, please
provide a list of what will!