Noob Radio Questions
 

I'm very new to the hobby but enjoying it very much so far. I've got a Piper Cub with an OS .46 and a Futaba 4 channel that I picked up used. I'm still very much in the noob learning phase, but I'm already looking ahead to my next plane, radio, etc. And I'd love to get the advice of all of you experienced pilots when choosing my next radio. I know this 4 channel won't suffice for long, and I plan on upgrading before or when I get my next plane. (Looking at the Ultra Stik with the quad flaps possibly for 2nd plane)

From what I've read and what I know about radio (in general, not necessarily just in R/C), 2.4 is the way of the future and the only way to go if buying a new radio. So, in this debate, let's take that as a given. I know that the best answer as to what radio will depend on what I plan to fly in the future. But honestly, I don't know the answer to that at this point in the hobby. After some initial (and limited because of my experience) searching, I've found the Futaba 7-channel 2.4 GHz for $280 (at Tower Hobbies) and the Airtronics 8-channel 2.4 for $230 (same place). At first glance, to the uneducated eye, it would seem that the Airtronics is the no-brainer, with one more channel and $50 cheaper. However, Futaba wouldn't still be in business if there weren't a reason they can charge more for a radio with fewer channels. Also, I'm sure there are others (JR?) that I haven't even researched thoroughly.

Or... Should I be looking at something with more channels? Would the two radios I mentioned even work for the Ultra Stik with quad flaps? And if it would, when in the future would I start being limited by 7 or 8 channels?

I still have some time before I'm planning to actually buy. I'm still learning to fly with my cub. So that gives you guys some time to rant and debate! (and for me to learn by listening :D )

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Both radios will work and although I don't fly the 2.4Ghz models I do own and fly both Futaba and Airtronics and I like both brands.
Some people swear by JR or Hitec and both of them are perfectly fine.
It really is a Ford vs Chevy vs Toyota issue.
I have actually found the Airtronics just a tad easier to program.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

I fly a spectrum DX7 and I love it. The advantage to the Spektrum/JR line is more receivers to choose from. You can pick up RX starting at 65 bucks on ebay--that's a fully functional, 6 channel RX that comes with the sattelite rx. Of course, if you want the 7 channel, you pay about 20 bucks more for that. With the Futaba (it is my understanding) you are locked into one 100 dollar RX for now, as that is all they offer. However, I would imagine that it won't be long before they offer a cheaper alternative to keep up with Horizon.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

The Spektrum DX7 is a great choice. The new Spektrum DX6i is another lower priced option. As 2slow said, Spektrum has lots of receiver options.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Here is the basics difference between[link=http://www.hooked-on-rc-airplanes.com/spread-spectrum.html] futaba's and spektrum's technology.[/link]



MissleMan is correct with the car brand analogy. Since 2.4 is relatively new, there is really no distinct differences between the two technologies that have been discovered that would allow you to say one is necessarily better than the other.

I think 6 channels would be more than plenty for your 2nd, 3rd, 4th plane etc. I have been flying for years with only a 6 channel radio. Why spend more money on extra channels if you don't intend to use them?

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

I have used both the Futaba and the Airtronics radio systems. Both are fine. But, with my experience, the Futaba was a basic four channel system, where the Airtroncis was the RD8000 which is what the RDS8000 is based on. It is a very nice radio and does the trick.

I also have the Spektrum DX7 radio. Although this is more expensive, I can vouch for the fact that it too is a fine radio system, 7 channel, though.

Take a look at the radio systems available at Horizon Hobby and see what they may be offering. Not that I want to discourage Tower Hobbies, because I use them often, but Horizon Hobby also has a good selection of radios and good ones on sale.

It all comes down to personal preference, often influenced by what your instructor uses, if you are working with an instructor, that is. That's how I got to use the Airtronics radio, my instructor was using that, so I sort of emulated him, and that radio worked just fine.

CGr.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

I know that it's hard to imagine not needing more than 6 channels. And I dont' have any planes that literally use more than 6 channels, but I have several planes where the extra MIXES come in handy. It's not necessarily the ability to physically connect more servos, but it's sometimes the ability to mix the servos you have together in different fashions.

For example, on one particular 40 sized P51 I have, I use split elevator servos. It also has retractable gear. I use six channels because of the four basic control channels, the aux channel that is hooked up to the extra elevator servo, as well as the gear. I also am using several mixes to make it all work right, as well as using a mix between the elevator halves and the ailerons. In essence, I have a switched mix that allows the elevator halves to move in unison with the ailerons, making them almost like elevons. It gives an unbelievable roll rate that is very axial, believe it or not. Not sure if I could do all of that with a six channel radio, even though that's all of the channels I'm physically hooking up.

Another example is crow with my giant stick and ultra stick 60. Couldn't work right without 7 channels, although only 6 separate channels are in use on the radio. It's the mixes that make it happen....

If you can in any way afford a 7 channel radio, get it. It will last you for a long time to come. I owned a four channel and 2 6 channel radios before buying my 7202 a couple of years ago. Within a year, I was buying the DX7 (same radio, different modulation). I could have saved over 600 bucks by skipping the 6 channel phase all together. That's at least one decent airplane I could have bought.

JMO

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Futaba has the 6EX spread spectrum for $230 with servos ($200 w/o) from Tower. Great radio for second (or first) radio.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Now that's something I didn't know/realize. Thanks, 2slow. I didn't realize that a switched servo mix would eat up a channel. It makes perfect sense now that I think about it. Goes to show how much us noobs don't know that you experienced guys see as obvious.

So, you have a 7 channel and that works for all of your planes? Have you ever wanted/needed 8 or even more? Have you been limited by channels since going to 7? If I went with a 7 channel, what kind of planes/options/etc would I be getting into when I said, "Dang, I wish I had another channel or two?"

Great comments and info, guys. Please keep them coming.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

I just bought my Futaba 7C 2.4 complete with 4 3151 digital bb servos and the receiver battery for $300 at the LHS. Best I could find on the internet was $350.

bob

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

>> So, you have a 7 channel and that works for all of your planes? Have you ever wanted/needed 8 or even more? Have you been limited by channels since going to 7? If I went with a 7 channel, what kind of planes/options/etc would I be getting into when I said, "Dang, I wish I had another channel or two?" <<

I'm new to this as well, but after doing a lot of reading and asking some questions here I went with the 7C. That will give me flaps and retracts if/when I ever get to that point, and another channel in reserve. I went with the 2.4 GHz to avoid all the frequency conflicts.

The radio is what drove my decision to get an ARF rather than RTF. It allowed me to pick what I wanted rather than go with a low end 4 channel 72 MHz.

bob

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

The Airtronics RDS8000 2.4Ghz radio system is $229.99 before discounts and offers 8 channels of control, advanced airplane and helicopter programming and mixing, and additional full range 8-channel receivers for $79.99 each. It's hands-down the best value in spread spectrum radios on the market.

With Tower Hobbies' current promotions, you can order it now for $199.99 plus shipping and handling. If you're a Tower Hobbies Super Saver Club member, it's only $194.99 and shipping and handling are free.

I'm a happy Futaba 7CAF owner, but if I were to buy a spread spectrum radio today I wouldn't hesitate to order the RDS8000. More features, less money, cheaper additional 8-channel full range receivers. What's not to love?

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Tower has the 2.4GHz 7C with four 3152s (higher torque than 3151s) for $300 ($330 - $30 for purchases over $225):

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXSBX0&P=ML

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

As a beginner in this hobby I'd like to hear more about this - how mixes use channels, and maybe some common mixes that are used and how they relate to channels.

I have a 6 channel programmable radio, and am interested in having flaps and retracts, as well as mixes. Is this even possible with 6 channels, or would I have to sacrifice say the retracts to have a mix?

Thanks.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Mixes need extra channels only when you have to transmit an extra channel.
Example, if you have dual elevator servos and plug them into two seperate channels in the receiver then you need an extra channel to mix the two because you have to transmit a seperate signal to each servo.
Now lets say you want to simply mix some rudder with throttle to help on takeoff? That does not require an extra channel, the mixing is inside the radio and no extra channels need to be transmitted.
Basically it is how many servos you want to control seperately or independently. I think refrencing mixes to number of channels was not quite a correct way to term it.
The example of the Stick with the quad Aileron/flaps needing a 7 channel radio is because the 4 wing servos each plug into a seperate channel on the receiver, so 4 channels for the wing, plus throttle, rudder and elevator require 7 channels to get the most out of what that plane can do. IF he only had a 6 channel radio he would have had to Y harness at least the outboard set of ailerons.
I hope I explained that well enough and not caused more confusion.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Yes, hooking up separate servos to do the same thing, and then mixing them together requires multiple channels. Missleman probably said it better. For example, one who uses two aileron servos has a choice to make--use a Y harness, or mix two channels together, slaving one to the aileron channel. Although the separate channel isn't doing anything different on the plane (it is still contolling aileron movement) it does allow you to do stuff like electronically trim each servo separately, it allows you to set differential in the aileron travel, as well as mix the ailerons to other channels.

Missleman explained the crow pretty good. On the other example, I think I mis-spoke a little. I am actually using seven channels because I'm using two aileron servos, two elevator servos, one rudder, one retract, and one throttle. The extra channel allows me to mix the ailerons to the elevators for tighter rolls. I could have done the same thing with a 6 channel radio, using a Y for the ailerons and AUX for the second elevator servo, but I don't believe I could have mixed the four surfaces together on my old JR 6102. With the seven channel radio I have (I believe) 2 slavable mixes as well as (once again, I believe) 5 non-slavable mixes. By slavable, I'm talking using one trim lever to trim both channels at once. For example, when I set the elevator up on the elevator and aux channel, I mix them together using mix 1 in the radio, which allows me to not only independently trim each servo through the software and sub trims of the radio, but it also allows me to trim both of them together using the trim lever on the face of the radio. So when I trim the elevator on the face of the radio, both servos move the same. Not all mixes allow for that--at least not with the DX7 or JR 7202. I believe there are only 2 mixes that allow that. I could be wrong on that, it's been a while since I've been into the programming of my radio, but that's what I remember. Sorry, it's spring and I haven't been out much since last summer. I can get my radios out and confirm all of that, but I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

The point I was trying to make is don't think of 7 different things that the plane has to do in order to utilize 7 channels to the fullest extent. One can easily use all 7 channels with only the basic control surfaces (like in crow setup).

Have I ever thought I wish I had 8? No, actually I haven't. but I'm a die-hard JR fan, and the 8 channel radios are a bit pricey for me. The 7 channel seemed like a good compromise between price and functionality. Like I said, I went through 2 6 channel computer radios before settling on the 7 channel, and I was always wishing I had that extra channel (OK, maybe not always, but often). I've not thought that since moving up to the 7 channel. If I were to get into turbines, then I would need more channels and more mixes for sure.

Now, as missleman said, simply mixing rudder to aileron, or something like that does not require extra channels, but the 7 channels that I have do have more of those kinds of mixes than the 6 channels offered. So in that respect, you do get more of those mixes as well.

Hope that was clear as mud....

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

orangekat,
you are fine with that setup. Your gear will go on channel 5, and your flaps on channel 6 (I believe). However, this is where my statement comes in. Let's say you want to have a switchable mix that allows you to mix your flaps to your elevator (common if you want to have tight loops--I have this setup on my giant stick). You only have six channels, meaning you have two switches on your radio--one for gear, and one for auxillary. The aux/flap will be used for flaps, and the gear switch will be used for the retracts. So what switch are you going to use to activate the mix? You wouldn't want the elevator and flaps to be mixed together all the time, so you need a switch to turn it on and off. This is where the seventh channel would come in handy because you would now have an AUX 2 channel switch on the radio that you could use to turn the mix on and off with, even though you do not have anything hooked up to the AUX 2 channel on the receiver itself. Does that make sense?
I'm talking exclusively of the 2 JR 6 channel radios that I have owned. Maybe other brands of radios offer a mix switch on their face for this purpose, but I'm not aware of any that do.....

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

My Airtronics RD6000 actually has 2 mix switches plus the dual rate, retract and gear switches. I guess it depends on the radio. My Futaba 6 channel has a bunch of extra switches as well but it is primarily a heli radio and I haven't looked very far into reassigning the extra switches like idle up and throttle hold. I might be able to use them for mixes but I have never tried.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Two and a half weeks ago when I bought mine the best I could find was $350.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

I wouldn't worry too much about using more than seven channels for quite some time. I don't plan on outgrowing my transmitter for years, and seven channels allows you to fly some pretty cool airplanes! :D

For example, many people that buy the Futaba 14 channel radio (14MZ) to use with large models don't even use more than seven channels but simply buy the radio for its extra programming features. Frankly the most I've used is six channels (two aileron servos in separate channels and two retract servos wired together for a total of seven servos).

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Thanks guys :)

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

The first time I ever used more than 7 channels was when I started reviewing planes, and that just recently. Up until then I went 11 years and never needed more than 6 channels in a plane. So many people think they need huge radios with lots of channels to get by, but many find they never use them. In all honesty a 6 or 7 channel radio will more than likely satisfy your needs for many years to come.

Ken

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Ken do you have anything published? I'd like to read some of your reviews.

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

Go the the [link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/]RCU Magazine[/link] and look on the right side of the page and find "Search Articles". Search by author and select Isaac, Ken to get all of my reviews so far.

Ken

RE: Noob Radio Questions
 

using 14 ch on my wingspan b-17