RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Firstly no one is pointing fingers but the outcry when anything to do with safety is raised never ceases to amaze me. I have seen some dangerous situations over the years because people do not pay attention to detail, OzMo as a safety officer has a duty of care to the pilot, the club members and the public and if he has any concerns he should be able to pass a judgement on whether the plane flys or not. The heavy handed response is what amazes me, the person should be commended for his commitment to the safety aspects of this hobby not openly condemned as being to heavy handed.

I have seen plenty of accidents and a lot of very stupid things done by participants in this hobby and it takes a lot of courage as an individual to stand up and be counted. The problem is that all is ok until something goes wrong and then all the people who howled the safety officer down want his blood because he supposedly did not do his job properly. You just can't win. I have been a safety officer at a club and I know how difficult it is to get past this attitude. This is one of the reasons that clubs frequently have difficulty getting people to sit on a committee. So OzMo if you read this forum I am on your side.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

It's not about taking sides. It's about what is reasonable and what is not. No one has shown that is it unreasonable to attempt a repair on a tank. If a repair is made and the tank is serviceable, what would possibly be the justification for saying that it is unsafe? I'm just asking to have that explained to me.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

There is nothing "calculated" about the risk you were talking about. Flying a plane with know defects is not a "Calculated risk" but rather hopping for good luck. We have had a couple guys taking "calculated risk" that we have kicked out of our club. The safety rules are there for a reason. First, they keep people from getting hurt. Second the prevent property damage which can and does result in the lost of a flying field.

Look, a leaky tank isn't likely, in it's self, to be a safety issue. It is dumb to let a plane get destroyed by a leaky tank though. You are right that there are risk with this hobby. The idea is to control the risk as best you can. That doesn't include flying with a plane that isn't airworthy. A plane with a fuel soaked fuselage that may spit out the engine falls into the not airworthy catagory.

Don

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Every single flight is a calculated risk. Every model we have has some defect or another. Show me the safety rule commonly in use at clubs about repaired tanks - in my experience, there isn't one.

It seems the the moment someone raises a safety concern, some individuals lose perspective. Instead of examining the issue and determining if the activity is genuinely unsafe, it's simply declared to be unsafe. Campgens, you've stated that flying a plane that isn't airworthy is an unacceptable risk. I can certainly agree with that. It's a reasonable statement. Now take the step of applying that to a repaired tank. Tell me how a repaired tank categorically creates a model that is not airworthy.

Connect the dots for me. If your position is reasonable and sound, you'll be able to do that.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Thank You High Plaines !! Have you ever seen such CRAP over trying to repair a fuel tank ?? It's laughable !:D
Ugo

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I wonder who ties their shoes. Are they allowed to walk without having a safety knot or just the regular knot. Does a knot monitor walk behind them or to one side to observe? When should the laces be changed? Do you have to have the shoes pass inspection after the lace is replaced or repaired. What is the correct lacing pattern? What if they skip the top holes of the shoes. What to do if the lace is too long? Too short?

Perhap Velco shoes are the answer. Or maybe shoes with zippers. What to do about slip-ons?

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Without any safety stuff or name calling. It is irresponsible to suggest a tank be fixed in the beginners forum. There will be a beginner try this. His plane will be ruined or crashed from fuel soaked balsa. Then what? He quits or gets mad at RCU and stops coming here for help.

David

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I ain't believing this !! Let them fly " Electrics" No more tank problems LOL !....I'm atta here !
Thanks again for your support, HighPlains...
Ugo

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I hope the original poster has not been permanently scared away by all of this. It is pretty funny that this much animosity has grown out of a simple question regarding a way to save $4.00. Most of us would just buy a new tank, but I have been known to spend hours fixing something just to see if I could. These things usually end up right back in the trash, but they keep me amused for a bit.

I also agree that safety is a serious issue, but I have never seen such a thorough safety inspection that would catch a repair on the front of a fuel tank. In fact, I have never seen a safety inspection period, and I have shown up with some pretty goofy, homemade planes.

I hope that the OP just listened to Ken's advice in post #2, and got on with flying.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Me too.

I think the whole "safety issue/not a safety issue" distracted from the original question. Sometimes we get to busy think "can I do this?" we forget the "should I do this?".

IMO the cost of a new tank is small enough that I'd never consider it.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Ugo,
Sometimes here things you say get shot down in flames, I admire your attempts to fix a fuel tank but still find it a lost cause, but if that's what you want to do so be it. I personally would'nt risk a $100 airplane let alone a $1000 airplane with the possibility of fuel soak, the benefit's don't outweigh the risks.
We have a safety officer at our club, and for the last 5 years at every meeting he's asked if there's been any problems, he always rises and says no calls, no problems, yet in that time we've had 2 planes crash into the pits, one lost finger, and several illegal wiring projects done by incompetant wannabee electricians, the safety issue here was seriously overblown.:D;) If you come to our club which shall be unamed, don't touch the metal building when you walk in, it could send a shiver down your spine.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

My problem with this whole deal is the forum. This is for beginners. It's not the place to post a response for a questionable technique.
Sorry if I offended.

David

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I'm glad I live in the middle of no where surrounded by open livestock fields and hay meadows. I can walk out either door of my house and fly...no loading equipment..disassembly/reassembly of planes. Even without a club and safety officer there is still a measure of common sense that one should use even if your alone in the middle of nowhere. I'd never attempt to repair a fuel tank. Even a cheap plane can get expensive when it's ready to go...engine, electronics, all the knick knacks and do-dads to make them work, all to risk for a 5 dollar plastic tank. But if thats the route you want to go, so be it. Attempt to repair the tank and then come back in a few weeks and ask us the best way to pull the fuel oil out of the wood because your plane is soggy and "will the electronics be ok if I just take them out to dry". No one said welding the tank was impossible...it's just not terribly bright...kinda like flying with only one wing bolt....or two out of four engine mount screws missing.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

On second thought..... just give me your address and I'll send you the unused tank out of the one ARF I've bought prior to starting kit building exclusively..... what plane is this going in?

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

didn't mean to get you guys all worked up. I know some of us take this hobby very serious and some of us not so much . I prob lean to the not so side but i do appreciate all levels of inthusiam. I did listen and bought a new tank. I like to try to fix stuff but i don't want to create things to fix. I do plenty of that not even trying. I'm thinking of patching and puting a little fuel in the tank and letting it sit in a tray to see how long it lasts. LOL

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

this is normal operation around here, it gets worse during the winter when there is less flying and more internet time :D

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Just consider this leaky tank as a good excuse to replace it with a slightly larger tank to get more flight time.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I agree
hudman came in here to ask a question on a subject (he didn’t know)
It may have seen like a silly question but I have been asked worst.

We have to keep in mind that this place is for beginners and helping them
Keep you opinions to the subject and don’t degrade the guy for asking it.

Hudman
I would replace the tank it might or might not cause problems later on
If you patch it and it starts to leak then the tank loses pressure
Then you are spraying fuel all over the inside of you model.
I have seen were a fuel soaked receiver can start to do some weird stuff
Also not to mention your engine is not getting the fuel it needs.

We have to keep in mind that all of us we are our own safety officers that
That flying a model that is 5 + pounds and an engine turning 8000 + rpms
And swinging a blade 10 + inches blade can be dangerous or enjoyable.

Knowingly flying a plane that has a leaky tank and or a motor mount loose
Or held together with duck tape is not right (yes I have seen these things)

A pilot should always check the condition of his plane before he flies
Pilots do it on there full scale why shouldn’t we.

Both can kill

phatom

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Phatom77,
I don't think anyone here was degrading the poster, they answered his question. It was the over zealous safety officer that came in and started all the problems that led to this spirited discussion.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I think we are all capable of tying our own shoes and neither are we scared of our own shadows, as a participant in this sport / hobby for a lot of years I have seen some downright stupid things happen and all of them could be prevented with a little common sense. I have seen engines come out of planes that are very well maintained by their owners and plenty of other things as well. As with anything mechanical or for that point man made things do happen from time to time that are seemingly out of our control. The point is that as a responsible person you should do all within your power to minimise any risk in this hobby. I have had a tank that leaked into the fuselage of my aircraft and was pleased that I managed to catch it quickly and also do a pretty reasonable job of cleaning up the mess in the balsa. I have seen people badly cut with props, planes flown through the pits and so on. Now every club should have a Safety Officer and he has a duty of care (that is a legal term) to ensure that safety measures are in place and in this world where people sue each other for looking at them the wrong way he needs to ensure he is seen to be doing the right thing by all concerned. As with all of use we can put rules into place and if participants chose to ignore them there is little anyone can do about it other than counsel and if they persist ban them from their club.

Yes this did get a little heated but only because someone is concerned enough to stand up and be counted and say that something would not be acceptable where he flies. Others have followed along a similar line. I fly at several clubs and some of them are very lax in their attitude to safety and some are like Safety Nazis. It would be nice to find a club where common sense prevails and flying takes precedence over personal politics .

To the person who asked the question in the first place, I am pleased common sense prevailed and you purchased a new tank

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

If a safety officer had a legal duty of care beyond the common standard to everyone in the club, for everyone in the club, no one would be a safety officer. Doing "all within your power to minimize risk" can lead to some pretty crazy notions.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

Question for OzMo: What are the specific rules at your club regarding inspections?


Our club safety rules say all new or repaired models have to be inspected before the first flight.
They do not say who must do the inspection.
They do not list the requirements for becoming a qualified inspector.
They do not define the inspection steps.


I am 100% confident that a tank with a repair on the firewall end would not be discovered in an inspection at our club. If a tank repair was noticed it would not automatically ground the model. It would generate a question: Has it been leak checked? A "no" answer would ground it until it was checked.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

OMG, give it a rest already. This post has become a collection of useless information and bickering.

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I was just going to point out this has gone on almost as long as the "how many rubber bands on an Avistar thread":D:D:D

Oh come on 2 slow, have a little fun once in a while! Grumpy!:):)

RE: patching hole in plastic fuel tank?
 

I agree that this thread has gotten out of control. The original question has been answered and this arguement is accomplishing nothing. I'm closing this thread down.

Thread locked.

Ken