Is this wise to do?
 

I've been flying for a while and recently crashed my Sig Sr Kadet. I still feel I need more practice with landings on a trainer, although I have other planes to fly. I guy at my field is selling a 3 channel sig sr ready to fly for $225. Does anyone think it would be bad to fly a 3 channel trainer after using a 4 channel for the last year? I would set it up so the rudder is on the right stick.

Any opinions appreciated.

RE: Is wise to do?
 

Go for it. We used a 3 ch Senior Kadet as a club trainer for years with the rudder plugged into the aileron channel. the control response is a little sluggish when compared to an aileron version but after you fly it a while you won't remember the difference. We had the nose wheel on a separate servo plugged into the rudder ch so it would steer normally on the ground.
Fred

RE: Is wise to do?
 

I kept a trainer in my fleet for nearly 10 years even though I was flying very advanced airplanes. I just enjoyed going back and forth between very different airplanes. If you like Sr. Kadets, (and I think they are a hoot to fly), then buy it.

RE: Is wise to do?
 

You can always add ailerons...easy fix.

Best Regards,
Flak

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

to date my toughest student was a glider pilot...had to re-learn....he never had ailerons or throttle....based on that assumation, and you know what happens when you assume..add ailerons

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

The first thing you will notice between the four channel Kadet Sr. and the three channel version is the increased wing diheadral of the three channel version. This greater diheadral increases role coupeling when the rudder is used to make up for the lack of ailerons. While you can add ailerons to this model it still will not handle the same unless you remove a good bit of the diheadral as well. In addition to this the greater diheadral makes cross wind landing more challenging. As for the decision of wether it is a wise move or not, only you know and maybey this information will give you a little more insight as what to expect from the plane.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

What else do you have to fly? Anything that lands easy?

Don't get me wrong, a Senior is a nice nostalgic plane, but you're already landing and accustomed to ailerons.

If you're in the mood for a nostalgic plane, go for it. Otherwise, you can get a 4 channel trainer for the same money or less. Or, if you already have a nice landing plane, that would serve the purpose.

Good luck,
Dave Olson

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

snacker:

I would move forward instead of backwards and staying in a comfort zone.

Go for a Sig 4 star, if your other models are more advanced than it; you are already trained!

Regards!

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

Go ahead buy it. From your posting this airplane will not be a regression but instead allow you to progress. The Three channel Senior is arguably the most successful trainer in RC history going back all the way to the seventies in continuous production. I wonder why that is?;)

Two of the folks I am currently working with: one has been flying sort of for five years with a large assortment of inappropriate aiplanes and cannot really fly. I recently set him up with a three control Senior and in just perhaps ten flights he can finally fly safely by himself and loving every minute of it.

I also now just taken on another who has had around ten airplanes every one of them wrong for him and he never really learned how to fly either but I,ve finally got him into looking for the right airplane after trying other Seniors and he is now looking for one. Unfortunately currently you cannot find a Senior arf anywhere and will probably be another month before they are avalible agine.

Whether or not you fly a three control or four control Senior is completely imaterial, It will not make a differance in your primary training but what will and is far more important is your Mentor/Instructor.


By the way adding ailerons to a Senior is not very effective unless you also reduce the dihedral for the reasons pointed out by Mr67Stang.


John

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

I agree with the gist of your comments. The SIG Kadet SENIOR is a relative newcomer, however. True, the original Kadet was a 3 channel (I soloed on one in the 70's), later the Kadet II came out with ailerons, and yet later, the Senior came out, along with the Senorita. The Senior and and Senorita were not marketed as trainers, as they are stick construction and not nearly as durable as the Kadet. The people flying them soon came to conclude that the gentle flying style would lend itself as a good choice for a new flier, and that notion continues, as more and more people find that large, slow flying plane a pleasure to learn on or just sport fly.

The only downside I can see for snacker is what do you do with the 3 channel plane if you want to sell it later? I mean, who wants a 3 channel plane, anymore? :)

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

If it were me, I'd fly the 3 channel with rudder on the left stick if you can. Nothing wrong with learning to use your rudder more. I fly in pattern meets, am going to start flying IMAC next summer, and have even started to fly 'real' full scale planes. Rudder use is very important to keep your plane tracking straight at all times, through all maneuvers, and to keep the little bubble in the middle of the gage on the dash board (although I found it's easier to just fly by feel and not staring at the gages).

So I personally would LOVE to have a 3 channel plane in my quiver; I would use it for practice.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

Thanks for all the suggestions guys. I do have a few other planes including a twist, a pulse a couple mojos and am finishing up a Gene Soucey Extra 300. Sometimes there is a month or two between the times I get to go out and fly. I always feel better after a gap in flying, if I get some practice in on my trainer before moving to other planes. I still get nervous flying, especially after its been a little while.

I wouldn't have a clue how to add ailerons and I'm not sure it would be worth the trouble.

This will be my third trainer BTW. I'm not to worried about selling it in the future. I would probably keep it and fly it till it dies or I do.:D

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

Excellent plan and heck you may even want to do something like this to it. Oh and did I mention what wonderful night flyers they are and not even bad cross country airplanes:

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

Me! After 35 years of flying I still enjoy flying 2- and 3-channel.

Nothing wrong with 3-channel, and many who say stay with 4-channel probably have never flown 3-channel before anyway. I'd grab it and fly it until its so fuel soaked it can't be flown any more. The Sr. is one of those planes that are great to take out in the evening for a slow, lazy floating end of the day flight or to just shoot touch-n-go's.

Hogflyer

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

That plane looks like a tank John.:D

The guy that was selling the plane flew it for me and it floated around like a big blimp. Even more so than my first Sr Kadet, (I didn't think that was possible). I think it will be fun to fly with 3 channels.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

When you make a low fly-by inverted with it, you have arrived.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

Since you have been flying with 4 channels I would recommend setting TX for the 3ch plane up with the rudder on the left just like a 4 ch setup.
The very best thing you can do for yourself is to learn to fly with the rudder.
If the rudder is in the same place on the TX as the ailerons normally are that is not learning to fly with the rudder.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

i have a Sig Kadet sr best flying plane i have ever had i am starting on a sig rascal with a 3w 23 i hope to fly that soon
buy it!!! i ed like to have two my self

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

I learned to fly on A two channel and loved it. Three is even more fun. Keep the rudder on the left stick and when you start flying the other planes you will be way ahead of the game.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

Hogflyer:

I am one that have not flown 2 or 3 channels, and don't know how.
I believe I could do it, but not too far from level flight in circles or flat number 8's.
I could not do rools, snaps, or more complicated maneuvers.

It would be interesting to start a thread teaching 4-channel pilots how to do typical maneuvers with just 2 or 3 channels; if for not other reason, just to learn how it was done time before the 4-channel radios were available and affordable.

Regards!

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

There is not much difference between flying 2-, 3- or 4-channel, depending on the aircraft you have. You want to hook the rudder up to the aileron channel on the right stick. Most 2-/3- channel will be lower performance planes like primary and secondary trainers, 1/2A and gliders, but there are exceptions, and most will be rudder/elevator(/throttle on 3-channel). There are some pylon racers that are 3-channel – throttle/ailerons/elevator, but that’s another ball game. I’ll just look at the R/E/T aspect.

3-channel flying is, for the most part, just like 4-channel. The main difference is the feel of the plane and what you see in turns. When banking, the 2- or 3- channel plane yaws into the turn instead of rolling. You’ll see it swaying back and forth going into and out of turns. Some planes have a noticeable yawing motion while other do not – depends on the specific model. You control the plane just like you do with ailerons, but don’t expect a quick roll unless you have a lot of rudder set up. Flying without rudder generally means you have more dihedral in the wing, so it’s more susceptible to cross winds because you can’t force a wing down.

The maneuvers you can perform are similar, but not exact. Most 2-/3-channel planes will be sluggish in the roll by design, but with enough rudder control (or the right design) they have excellent rolling characteristics. It’s not uncommon for an R/E/T plane to perform almost all the aerobatics a 4-channel plane can with the exception of cross-control maneuvers like side slips. You can roll, loop, stall turn, spin, Cuban-8’s, immelmann, split-S, etc. All it takes is practice, but some of the maneuver will not look as crisp as a 4-channel plane. Just the nature of the beast.

The place you will have to get used 3-channel is on the ground – you’ll steer the plane on the ground and take-off with the right stick instead of the left, but it doesn’t take more that one or two ground loops on a tail dragger to get this down.

2-channel is very similar to 3-channel (talking powered here, not gliders) but you don’t have any throttle control, and you don’t land until the engine quits and then make a dead stick landing. Most 2-channel planes are also hand launched.

Not if you really want a challenge, try 1-channel which is rudder only.

Hogflyer

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

i agree with most that 3 channels is not so different from 4 channels if you're already in the flying instead of learning phase. if you can fly a 4-channel plane, you can fly a 3-channel plane but not necessarily the other way around. if you are not on a budget, getting the 3-channel can be a great way to enjoy flying and possibly sharing the experience with a friend. a 3-channel is a lot more stable and releasing the sticks will get you reoriented much easier. on the other hand, if you want to continue with 4-channels, and you can't afford two planes, i would suggest a new trainer or, if you're a good builder, adding another channel to the 3-channel kadet.

i personally love 3-channels for the nostalgia of the hobby. the way the tail wags and the coupled rolls are fun to watch and flying inverted always gets my stomach in a bind. but if i were you, learning to fly, i'd go for one of the recommended trainers. my two cents.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

Wow, I learned on Sig Kadet Senior (3 channel) that I built and had a blast flying it. I'd say the only real problem I had was on windy days. That big wing is easily caught and even with the tricycle gear it can be tricky to taxi. I remember flying real slow with mine, stall turns and flying inverted. Altitude can be your friend when learning. Boy I used to take it up high. Fearing other models, I used to fly it way too far out. But I always got it back and still have it. I should get it ready for next season. Oh, I eventually moved to an Avistar and had a blast with that. The transition went fine. In fact I liked the Avistar so much that I decided to get my second Avistar and I am presently putting that together. Just for fun.

If the Kadet is available for a good price, you can learn a lot from it. Even as a 3 channel.

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

I bought it guys and flew it yesterday. Very easy to fly and there is really not to much of a difference from flying my 4ch Sr Kadet. I like it and for practicing takeoffs and landings it seems perfect.:D

RE: Is this wise to do?
 

That's really cool! Here in Chicago land, its getting really hard to get out because it is too cold and windy most of the time. So it's like the building season. I'm going to get my Kadet out and check it over and make sure it's ready for that nice day when I can fly it. Not too windy is the major prerequisite. I know that I had fun with mine and I think it could be a blast puttering around the sky. Mine only has a Thunder Tiger GP 42 in it, very economical Have fun.