Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

Last year I bought a Pheonix 25 and a Himax 2015-4100 for a hummingbird. The only experience I had with brushless was the Novak 5800 system. I don't know the definition of cogging, but I will assume it means the inability for a sensorless system to start or have proper control at low speed.

The hummingbird always had "cogging" problems. If throttle was applied, it would kick back and forth and never start up in one direction. The motor itself would run just fine, it was just when mass was added to the rotor. Didn't matter what settings the ESC was set to, soft-start, timing, ect...I always had to spin the rotor by hand and give it some throttle to get it started. OK, no big deal.

So I put the system in a 1/18 scale Xray car. Same deal, I'd have to push the car while holding a bit of throttle to get it started. By the way the car was ballistic! Ok, no big deal.

Now I have myself a Tensor. I bought the E-flight 370 1080kv motor for it. Guess what, same friggen problem. I can't even get a prop to start up, not even by spinning it up by hand. The only way I can get the motor (the outrunner) to run is without a prop AND to spin it up by hand.

Is this typical "cogging"? If so I can't believe how lame this sensorless stuff is. Do I have a bad speed control? If so, what is wrong with it? Why does it work once the motor is "up to speed"?

I don't care who or what is to blame, I want to understand what is going on here. Seems like this sensorless stuff is lightyears behind sensored. I simply want to have a system that works. I will buy whatever is needed for simple, trouble free operation.

Thanks.

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

I have a park370 5400kv, and a himax 2812-0850 outrunner, (and the CC10 and 25) I know others with similar setups. I have never heard of this problem. I would suggest that you find someone with a brushless system so you can figure out which component is to blame, then contact the manufacturer for a replacement.

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

OK, I should be able to try out some different components this week. But here's another interesting little tidbit.

The motor will not start with it mounted in the plane. It will (reluctantly) start if I take the motor out and mount it to a 2x4! It still cogs badly before it starts but it will reliable start when mounted to a solid object. I still think something is wrong and it is obviously amplified when the motor is mounted in the plane (flexible).

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

What you are describing is a fairly common problem with earlier revisions of the castle creations firmware on the controllers. You should email them and they will likely reprogram it and send it back for free... I had the same thing on my 25, not as bad as yours but sometimes made me think the motor mount might bust off.. I just dealt with it until this winter and they had me send it back. Seems to be running fine now. Haven't noticed any of the stuttering yet but only have made a handful of flights.

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

FYI, I bought a new Pheonix 10 and everything works perfectly. There is definitely something wrong with the older Pheonix 25. Hopefully CC will take it and update for little or no cost.

Thanks,

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

Had same problem with an early CC Pheonix 25, just get the USB cable for about $20 and you can reflash the software to the latest version. It prompts you for it as soon as you hook it up to your PC, if you don't have the latest software revision. It makes programing all the options alot quicker too.

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

I sent it in and Castle Creations fixed it up for no charge. Works great now!

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

Hi Gordon-

Glad you found the problem. By the way, the problem you describe is usually called "stuttering." Cogging is the resistance you feel when turning an unpowered brushless motor by hand as it jumps from one magnet pole to the next.

- Jeff

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

so the pheonix-25 esc will work in a 1/18 car. i bought the pheonix-25 esc and the new cobalt 5800kv brushless motor to go in my 18 t will the setup work?

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

Hi Gordon,
Isn't it nice when a company gives good service[8D]
I'm just goin to "second the motion" that you consider a Castle Link cable in the future, much easier to program, especially the LVC for Lipos.
Cheers,
Pete

RE: Is my Pheonix 25 'tarded?
 

Custamizer...you won't want to use the Phoenix controllers in a car. The software is totally different...the controller will arm at full brake/reverse (thus, no brakes!) and neutral will be 1/2 throttle. Mamba 25 is the way to go.