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Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

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Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Old 09-13-2006, 10:35 PM
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dqman40rock
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Default Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

I bought a fairly new Carden Yak 37%. I put my JR recievers in the plane and it has failed a range test. The elevators for instance do not go up and down together when you get about 50ft away from the plane. They get out of time with eachother. I changed the recievers and it still has the problem.
There are 4 8611As on the elevators. They do not have matchboxes as that is how they were initially set up when the plane was first built.
Any ideas would be helpful. I am running 2 JR S945R recievers. I also tried a couple r770 recievers to see if the recievers were the problem.
Thanks
Darren
Bonney Lake WA
Old 09-14-2006, 08:45 AM
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ben beyer
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Are you using any kind of Powerbox or Power Expander type system with the radio?
Old 09-14-2006, 08:52 AM
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BBW Walt
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Had a similar major situation with a big Ultimate", tried everything, took a year to eventually get a satificatory range check. Ended up going with one 945 receiver, through a power box and the problem was gone, plane fly's awesome. Your plane does not need 4 elevator servo's. I would eliminate 2 to simplify things. You might consider hooking up everything with one receiver for test check to see if it improves and go from there. These range demons are sometimes hard to find but in our case removing all the complexity straightened our problem out. Hope this helps, Walt
Old 09-14-2006, 03:08 PM
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Ricmussman
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

I had a similar problem and it turned out to be one of my extension cables had a little corosion on the terminal. I replaced the bad end with a new one and yoila all was good. The point is check your extensions for bad signal transfer, if one had more resistance than another it will change the output speed.

Ric
Old 09-14-2006, 03:40 PM
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as722
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Had a very similar problem that turned out to be a bad smart fly ignition kill device.

Albert
Old 09-14-2006, 04:00 PM
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cbk07
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Darren, a few guys up here have had this same problem. Two of them went to one receiver and the problem was solved. The other finally gave up and sent his equipment back to JR and found his Tx module was out of tune.

Another thing....tape your crystals in. JR cost me a 40% plane this year when a crystal fell out. I thought it was an isolated incident until everybody and their brother told me they always fall out if you don't tape them in. Good luck solving it!

Craig
Old 09-14-2006, 06:18 PM
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dqman40rock
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Hi Ben,
No power expander that I know of. In fact the plane only has one matchbox and that is for the 4 servo rudder.
Old 09-14-2006, 06:22 PM
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dqman40rock
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Walt,
You just gave me a great idea that might help me narrow this down. Maybe I dont need 4 servos for the elevators especially with giant ballancers. But if I do go with them at least I can try disconnectin a couple to see what happens. Maybe that will help to isolate where the problem is.
This plane can be seen here. http://www.aeroprotect.com/Workbench/Yak54/Index.html Maybe you could take a look to verify that I dont need so many servos.
Thanks
Darren
Old 09-14-2006, 06:27 PM
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dqman40rock
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Thanks everyone for all the advice. I will be going home soon to work on the plane and it sure helps to here from some experienced experts and especially what you said Craig regarding taping in the crystals. I will definitaly be doing that for sure. Lots of money on the line here.
Thanks again
Darren
Anymore advice will be appreciated. I will update everyone on this post. Hope to fly the plane in IMAC this weekend at Richland WA
Old 09-14-2006, 08:16 PM
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quist
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Do a range check with only one rx powered up. It would also help to have detailed pictures of the interior.

Was this range check with the engine running or not? What mufflers are on the plane? Make sure all servo extension are plugged in tight. Where are the antenna's mounted?
Old 09-14-2006, 09:10 PM
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ben beyer
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

I read where one guy built a 150cc class plane and put the 14MZ in it. He had range check problems and then they all went away when he installed a Smart Fly Power Expander. I'm using one on my 35% Extra 260 that i'm going to build. Matchboxes are just a method so that the servos don't fight each other.
Old 09-15-2006, 01:56 AM
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dqman40rock
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Thanks everyone for the advice. I believe the problem is solved. I put the 2 Futaba recievers that came with the plane back in and borrowed my friends 9cap. Everything is much better. No more troubles that we can see running or not.
Before this, I had tried 2 sets of JR recievers so if all goes well at the field I will know almost for sure my 9303 is a bit out of tune. I will send it in.
I had to do my latest range testing at my house. I will make sure I do a good range test again at the field tomorrow.
I will be flying the plane at Imac on Saturday and Sunday. This will be my fourth time flying sportsman. Still very green. Hope to do well with this plane. Maybe it will fly it for me?
Thanks again. Everything everyone wrote was very helpful!
Darren
Old 09-15-2006, 08:56 AM
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ben beyer
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Cool! Good luck.
Old 09-15-2006, 05:07 PM
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quist
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

You dont have to send the radio in, just the module.
Old 09-18-2006, 11:20 AM
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dqman40rock
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

The Carden flew like a Carden. I took it to the IMAC at Richland WA. After we worked on the plane I had enough time to fly it once before competition. Very windy for a first flight with a Carden but all went well. I got better scores then ever. (the Carden did it) Second out of 4 people. That was my fourth time flying sportsman so I was happy with that.
Small turn out but we had a great time. It still does the out of time thing but not as bad. Some of the other Carden guys rewired parts in the plane to isolate the ignition wires from the battery to reciever wires.
We checked another Carden to see if it would do the same thing. A new extra with the same servos. It did the same thing.
I have a smart fly power expander. I will try it and see if it takes away the problem. If not I am sure it will be fine because you do not normaly operate your elevators continuously up and down during flight. Even in 3D it would be a strange thing to go up and down, top to bottom with the elevators. That is the only time it got out of cync. There are no glitches.
I will post again after I try my power expander.
Thanks
Darren
Old 10-04-2006, 07:34 AM
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Darren, are you running built-in elevator mixing with your radio? If so and the channels are far apart (like 2 and 8 using the 9CAP), you will notice a lag between the servos. This probably isn't a big deal, but it bothered me enough that I now run my own pmix on my dual elevator setups, using channels 2 and 5. The lag is almost completely gone when running two channels that are close to each other.
Old 10-04-2006, 10:51 AM
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Hi Ryan,
I have tried 2 systems in the plane. JR S945R recievers and 2 Futabas. With the JR A 9303 and with the Futaba a 9 cap.
I am flying it like it is. My friend has a Carden Extra on Futaba and his does it too. It works fine when you operate the elevators as you normaly would in flight.
Its not just the elevators. The ailorons do it too.
If you put the antenna down walk away the servos will get out of time the further you go away. And it is even worse if you run the motor. It isnt as bad as it was when you run the motor. We re routed the ignition wire away from the servo battery wires.
I get mixed advice. Some say the big planes all do it. Others say they spent a year fixing it before they would even fly.

I have 2 recievers so the elevators each have their own reciever. Let me know if you have any other ideas.
I just got the plane. Now I understand why some people have more than one Carden.

Thanks
Darren
Old 10-04-2006, 10:59 AM
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

When doing a range check on mine yesterday (antenna wasn't really set on the receiver side), I also noticed the ailerons and elevators starting to lag just before getting to my reception limit. However, in normal use, if you use two channels for different ailerons or elevators and notice a lag between them, try moving their channels closer together. I noticed a big difference on my old H9 Extra between using channels 2 - 8 and channels 2 - 5. After doing that I applied it to all of my planes with two channels on the elevator. It probably doesn't make any significant difference in flight but I'm a little happier with my setup.
Old 10-09-2006, 10:10 PM
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dqman40rock
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Hi Ryan,
Thanks for the advice. I have a bit bigger problem but hopefully a small one. I am new to DA 150S Mine decided to die the day before yesterday over a wine vinyard way out there just starting an upline from a cross box as you may know sometimes you are way out there. I turned around, dove and flew it back low over the vinyard. I have no idea how I made it. It looked like a miracle. Thankful? Ya 7 k in this plane I am a happy guy.
The engine burped on my the night before on an upline and I landed. I was 16 minutes into my practice flight for next days imac so I thought I was low on fuel. Dumb that I am I didnt bother to think of checking my tank to make sure and the dead stick came the next morning. What a lesson and what a lesson it could have been.
Anyway I am working on trying to figure this out. One person told me my idle was too low. It doesnt make sense to me but I will say I was getting my idle offly low on both instances so I could make sure the plane would stall for my spin. Maybe its idling down too much before I begin to throttle up? DA didnt think so but who knows.
I will be checking on some things.
If you have any ideas of why this thing would die before I could get to high needle let me know. Its been fine up to now. I did check my screen a couple weeks ago. I will check it again and maybe clean the carb out completely. as well as check the needle settings against what DA told me they should be about.
I am falling in love with this plane. I would really hate to loose it. I can see why everyone likes these Cardens they are really something.
Thanks again Ryan
Darren

Old 10-09-2006, 10:22 PM
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Was this the vinyard at Zillah, or the RAMS? The one at Zillah would turn your plane into foam confetti - I've seen it happen at their big bird event, not a pretty sight. Without being there I have no idea what could have caused it, but if other pilots were saying it was too low then that may be the case. You don't need a super low idle to get it to stall - just remember to keep pulling back on the elevator to hold level flight and it'll slow right down. If you check everything out, including the fuel system, and feel your idle is fine, you should send it back to DA. They'll take care of you. Fortunately there are plenty of guys in the area with DA-150 experience so they should be able to help you.
Old 10-10-2006, 10:54 AM
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JohnVH
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Default RE: Help my new 37% Carden fails range test

Hi Darren, did you take this to the RAMS big bird? I think I seen that plane there getting put together as I was leaving..

I run JR10x and dual 649 receives in my CompArf 3.3m Yak with no range issues for the past couple years now.

Good luck on the plane, Id like to fly one of the carden ones someday.

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