DrAlexander

Can you guys reccomend a good source for a starter plane for us. Looking to start flying a little basic pattern, and want a plane that tracks better than an ugly stick. Don't really have alot of building experience, but not unwilling to learn.

Thanks

dbacque

My Feedback: (3)

A Kaos is always a good step up from a stick and a great intro to pattern flying. Tower has a very nice ARF Kaos 40. For two steps up, look towards the Bluejay Dirty Birdy, if you're willing to build from a kit anyway. For updated instructions on the DB look here http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9520759/tm.htm. Beyond that, there are lots of old school pattern planes out there. But the Kaos and DB will be inexpensive, good fliers and little to moderate work.

Dave

Roguedog

+1 Kaos or Super Kaos

A short kit of the Kaos can be had here http://lazer-works.com/rcm.html for $59.10 Just scroll down the page to find it.

A short kit of the Super Kaos can also be had there for $69.35. Just scroll down a little further.

He has a collection of Kaos' like the Super Kaos Jr. (40 size) to a short kit of Direct connections Ultimate Kaos http://lazer-works.com/misc.html
scroll down to it. There's ever a 90 sized Suoer Kaos.

Bryan

MTK

I think it was from Bluejay.....a 50cc Kaos also

DrAlexander

I'm really liking the Super Kaos 90 size. Seems like it would be awesome. Nice size wing. Just not sure I'm prepaired to commit to the build. Is there something more complete in the 60 size ship?

Timthetoolman1

My Feedback: (6)

Intruder http://ecsvr.com/twm/ShopDisplayproducts.asp?Search=Yes
Dirty Birdy http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXAYNV&P=0

I couldn't tell you specifics about these but I know everyone I talk to with the Dirty Birdy loves the way it flies. Seems like anyone flying back in the 70s and 80s had one at some point.

Tim

Atlanta 60

My Feedback: (18)

The Dirty Birdy is a very nice flying plane!! I don't own the new ARF, mine is an older built up version but I'm sure they will fly the same...Defiantly got the old school feel to it!!

Roguedog

If you're looking for a Classic Pattern Plane kit the 2 mentiond by Timthetoolman1 are the only build kits that I know of other than shopping for a build kit on ebay.

The Kaos, Super Kaos, and Ultimate Kaos I mentioned above are all 60 sized planes but not complete kits. Eureka Aircraft http://www.eurekaaircraft.com/pattern.htm also has several Classic Pattern Plane short kits as well and you can get foam core wings and stabs from him as well.

There are also 2 Classic Pattern palne ARF's that you can purchase the Dirty Bridi and the Phoenix 7. Which sounds like what you're looking for.

dbacque

My Feedback: (3)

My Dirty Birdy is built from the Bluejay kit but I can highly recommend the ARF. I have flown one. It is smooth and fast. I was a bit jealous, I thought it flew better than the one I built up. The only problem is that the provided tank is way too small and you need to cut the tank mount out to get a decent tank in the plane.

There is also the Phoenix 7 ARF. I've never seen one personally but hear good things.

Dave

Timthetoolman1

My Feedback: (6)

The Phoenix is no longer available.

We have a few of the Bluejay Dirty Birdy kits flying here and they seem to be good flyers.

If you want to try building here's a couple things that I tell the guys that come to build night, if it's balsa and you make a mistake you can always fix it. You can add more wood or take it away with sanding or cutting.

If it's a fiberglass fuse and foam wing kit the fuselage is mostly done but by no means expect an ARF type build. Most of those kits come with almost no instructions. If you want to change the way the wing mounts you have to figure it out. It's not difficult but for most having to make it up as you go creates a road block. Don't be afraid of any of the built up planes. Anything can be fixed, at worst it can be replaced. For example, if you ruin the foam wings while sheeting them then just get some more foam wings and try it again; there are several people that can cut a new set of wings for around $50 but you'll need new balsa sheeting.

I guess with building many are afraid of they kits, foam and glass or balsa, but if you just set down and just do it you will be amazed at what you can do. By afraid it seems they either don't know what to do, or where to start, or that they will screw it up. The first one will be slow but you'll get faster with each build.

I will say starting out is a bit pricey because you have to build your stock up. If I'm working on a kit, or ARF for that matter, and I need to change something up I simply go to my wood stock and get what I need or grab some bulk stock and cut it down to what I need. That's another thing to consider is the tooling. Most of the tools aren't required, because basic tools will work, but it will be a little more difficult. The Bluejay kits should have most of the stock you need but if you get a foam and glass kit you will need to supply a bit of your own materials. The older 70s and 80s glass kits have some of the material you need but everyone seems to have their own method of building and I'd prefer not to pay for the lower grade stock they put in some of the kits.

If you build, post here or on some RC site because there is a wealth of information but I'd suggest to get some local help if there's someone in your area that builds. We have a network here where I live and I'm sure there is some underground group where you're at too.

So with all that said I'd go for the Great Planes Dirty Birdy ARF and get it in the air and build a kit on the side. I'd suggest the OS 55 or 65 if you're style is slower but if you want it to scream the NovaRossi Speed 13 with pipe can be had for just a few bucks more.

That's my 2 cents so know it's my opinion based on how I enjoy this hobby. If you made it this far, thanks for listening

You are going to absolutely love the way a pattern plane flies. Once you get it in the air please make sure you trim it right. Ask here about how to trim your plane. If someone says just set your elevators level with the tips to start...then ignore them. Trimming is based on a set of specific flight maneuvers and listing what the plane does in that maneuver and there is a list that tells you how to correct it depending on what it's doing. Once completed you will have the best plane you have ever had! It will make an OK plane fly like it's on wires. I have several lists that takes you through the procedures when you get ready.

Tim

dphillips3

+1 for the dirty bird ARF I don't think there is a better arf for pattern flying out there! I built one for a quick SPA fixed gear, muffled plane. It fly's great out of the box, with no bad tendencies. Mine has a OS 61 SF pumper on it and flys great with a muffler and even better with a pipe!

DP#3

Pattern One

My Feedback: (73)

For Fiberglass and foam pattern planes consider:

Don Carlson [email protected]

Hobby Barn Contact Rob @ 520-747-3633

They both do excellent work. I hear that Hobby Barn is also selling NovaRossi Engines with their planes.


Leo
Klasskotemo
NovaRossi Engines
B&D Retracts

eness76-RCU

My Feedback: (13)

The World Models Intruder ARF is no slouch either. It's a contest winner, is easy to setup and fly, and is very affordable. Very underrated in my opinion. It's been out for several years, so it's just not the flavor of the month anymore. Lots of posts on here about it though if you search.


http://ecsvr.com/abm/shopexd.asp?id=2395

AMA 74894

My Feedback: (1)

+1 on the ARF Dirty Birdy... I flew it for Geoff Barber's review here, and it flies VERY VERY nicely.
I've flown the world model's intruder as well and completely agree that's a good one

EscapeFlyer

My Feedback: (1)

Have you seen, or are you interested in any particular classic pattern airplane you'd like to fly? Would you prefer to sport retracts?

I know you'd have to build it, but the Kaos or Super Kaos is the perfect entry into this.

Don Turnock does produce a full Super Kaos kit. It is on the spendy side, but it is a great kit.

www.eurekaaircraft.com

Brian

DrAlexander

I'm going to start with the 60 size Kaos that you pointed me to...I am going to shoot for having it ready to fly before the end of the year. However, I think I am also going to be on the hunt for an ARFof some sort just to grease skids a little. Make sure our competence is up to par prior to the maiden of the Kaos. I appreciate everyones help and tips here. I have more research to do it seems.

DrAlexander

I'm thinking this will be my quick build to get something in the air. I really like the scheme! Looks like it's got no problems pointing straight up to the clouds!

Timthetoolman1

My Feedback: (6)

I think you'll like the Intruder better than the Kaos. If you'd like to build something you might like the Dirty Birdy build. It should about the same build as a Kaos as far as the basic design and you'd be a lot happier. The Kaos isn't bad and as far as sport planes it's probably the better choice but for precise flight I just think you'd be happier with a Dirty Birdy build.
Again, it's a personal opinion, you may have reasons for building the Kaos.

Tim

eness76-RCU

My Feedback: (13)

I'd have to agree with Tim here. After flying the Intruder the Kaos will feel like a step down. The Intruder will be much smoother and more precise through the pattern. I'd hate to see you spend the time building to be disappointed. The Dirty Birdy is an excellent suggestion if you want to build something.

DrAlexander

I appreciate the help here guys. I've been side tracked here recently with work demanding much of my time, but things have settled down now and I'm back on track.
On to serious business... Looking at the Intruder, I see the demo plane has some type of four stroke engine mounted on it possibly inverted? Is this configuration what most of you are running? Also, how are the wings attached on this model? Looks like a tube must be used as I can't really see that it would bolt on underneath. I also see they call for 5 servos, I guess both ailerons have their own servo perhaps? Finally, I see that the model is covered in Iron on ToughLon? Is this the monokote I remember from years past?

Pattern One

My Feedback: (73)

DrAlexander,

I agree that the Intruder will be a better choice. It has a one piece wing with a bolt on belly pan. There are two aileron servos. The Toughlon is like a Monocote type covering. My personal choice would be a 2 stroke engine.

Leo
Klasskotemo
NovaRossi Engines & Parts
B&D Retracts

Pattern One

My Feedback: (73)

DrAlexander,

The Intruder assembly manual can be found here: http://www.theworldmodels.com/para/i.../pdf/A050R.pdf

Leo
Klasskotemo
NovaRossi Engines & Parts
B&D Retracts

eness76-RCU

My Feedback: (13)

DrA, I flew a 4c 91 on mine but I see no reason why a 2 cycle couldn't be used successfully. I ran my engine inverted, and had to eventually use a perry pump as the tank position is a little high when mounted inverted and the engine would starve on outside loops (where the tank would then be low). Best bet is to side mount it. No problems with starvation then. The wings slide together on a tube than bolt on conventionally.

DrAlexander

Here is the plane I'm going to get. http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXAYNV&P=0. Good looking plane and it fits the bill for getting in the air this year. Since I only need 4 channels, this radio looks to be sufficient? http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXSFY3&P=ML. Includes servos. That's all I need sans engine correct?

Atlanta 60

My Feedback: (18)

A great choice on the Dirty Birdy!! I am sure you will be pleased...My (kit built) Dirty Birdy is a blast to fly and nothing flies like these airplanes, it's a real treat...

My personal preference would be to put a piped 2 stroke engine and retracts on a plane like this...I think one of the new Nova Rossi set-ups may be a good choice...

However since mine is gonna be my "SPA plane" (pipes and retracts not allowed) I took the pipe off and am running an old OS 61 FSR with the stock muffler and fixed gear...I **personally** would not put a four stroke on one of these, to me it's just not right...

The radio you have linked would defiantly be sufficient, a friend of mine has one and it works just fine...I don't like programming his radio but I'm a JR guy so it's a lot different, I think it's a matter of me not being use to it...I think it has enough features for you to be able to do what you want with the Dirty Birdy...

Good Luck with your plane!!

Chuck