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Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Old 04-07-2008, 12:33 PM
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2001az
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Default Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

I have 3 OS 61 RF w/pump, all of them have been stored for many years (more that 7 years), now that I want to use them for BPA, I found that all of them are not moving, all the parts are stuck. It is safe to clean the engine with antifreeze dipping directly the engines into the pot or should I take the pumps out to avoid any damage?
Can somebody point me out to any link that tells you what to do with engines in this conditions?

Any suggestion will be appreciated.

Regards,

Arturo
Old 04-07-2008, 01:22 PM
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hurrejola
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Hi Arturo, I would take the pump out and clean it with alcohol, and with the engine, I would change ball bearings.
good luck

Hector
Old 04-07-2008, 02:07 PM
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Nathan King
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Be careful with what you use to clean the pump. Many chemicals can degrade the diaphragm. If that happens your engine won't pump any fuel and will never run!
Old 04-07-2008, 05:39 PM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Flush the pump with methanol. Actually, if the engine hasn't been run for that long fill the pump with methanol and cap the inlets/outlets and let it set for a day or so then flush. The diaphragm may get gummed up, but as long as it is intact and undamaged it should work fine.
-Will
Old 04-07-2008, 05:46 PM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

I second changing the bearings. They're only $8.97 a set:

http://www.rc-bearings.com/catalog/p...a3ebe33959523b

Wonder what a new sleeve and piston would cost if you could find one after those old bearings fail?

Dawn Power Dissolver and an old tooth brush will remove any old castor gunk:

http://www.dawn-dish.com/en_US/powerdissolver.do

David
Old 04-07-2008, 09:03 PM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

The others are emphasizing the delicacy of the pump which I agree with 100%...Take special care with it...No antifreeze, solvents ect...I flush mine with new fresh fuel...Or else I'd follow flywilly's instructions of methanol if necessary...

You may know this already but just in case: The thing I wanted to emphasize is do not disassemble the pump!! Do not mess with any screws on the pump!! Do not stick anything into the fuel nipples to "clean them out" ect. (no needles or anything like that) !!

Remember...Do Not Use Force on this stuff...Gentle Finesse is the key to dealing with the engine...No Hammers required!!

Here is what I'd do:
1) Remove the backplate off the engine with the pump intact and set it aside to flush with fresh fuel or methanol...
2) Remove the carb and treat it sorta like the pump as far as no solvents, antifreeze or the like...I personally disassemble my carbs and replace the o-rings and blow all the holes out with compressed air...
3) Remove the propnut & washer...
4) Remove the drive washer and thrust washer...
5) Remove the cylinder head...

Now that you have the engine broke down to this point...Unless your engines have seen some unusual conditions and corrosion is a problem...I'd venture to say the reason your engines are "frozen" will likely be the bearings are "stuck"...It really doesn't take that much to freeze a bearing...a little residual fuel which has gummed up between the ball's and their retainer can stiffen up a bearing pretty easily...

Now you could put your engine in the oven at about 225* and let it heat up about 5-10 minutes or so...*Wear Gloves* and remove the engine and see if she'll turn over enough to get the piston liner out...**Remember Finesse**...If so then remove the connecting rod/piston assembly next...Then the crank should slide out by hand with slight pressure...The rear bearing may come out with the crank...If not it should come out easily by lightly tapping the back of the case on a block of wood...Then the front bearing...I always try to tap it out first but very limited success...So I will normally resort to using the appropriate size wooden dowel and gently tap on it with a hammer to remove the front bearing...

I've never used the antifreeze/crockpot method...Not 100% sure *I* would unless the engine was in super bad shape...I kinda like rainedaves Dawn Power Dissolver and think I'll try that in the future...

Defiantly replace the Bearings!! Even if your able to clean your existing bearings I wouldn't re-use them...Replace them...

I'd Highly Recommend Stainless bearings..Another but more expensive option would be Ceramic/Stainless bearings which I'm slowly switching all my engines too...I'd stay away from chrome bearings...

Again...I highly recommend carb o-rings too...

Good Luck and Have Fun...

Chuck
Old 04-07-2008, 10:07 PM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Excellent instructions Chuck!

I just want to add:

You will probably need to heat the case to get the sleeve out. You can sick a bamboo skewer in the exhaust port and turn the crank. The piston will push against the skewer which will push against the top edge of the exhaust port in the sleeve and push it up enough to grab it and pull it out. Never pry a sleeve out with a screw driver.

Let the engine cool completely before removing the crank. You do not want the rear bearing to come out still on the crank. After you remove the crank (with the rear bearing still lodged in the case) re-heat the case and follow Chuck's directions to remove the bearings. The reason is that the crank and the bearing are both steel and expand about the same when heated. It can be a real bear getting a rear bearing off of a crank when removed together. However, the case, being aluminum, will expand more than the bearing. Once the crank is out, reheating the case will usually cause them to almost fall out. It might take 10 minutes at 350° in some cases.

David
Old 04-07-2008, 10:19 PM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Excellent info Dave..One more little trick:

Best Bet would be use the Heat/Cool/Re-Heat method Dave mentioned...The rear bearing can be a bit of a hassle if it comes out on the crank...

*If* the rear bearing does come out...Putting the crank and bearing in the freezer for about 30min will normally allow the rear bearing to come off...Often times there is a build up or ridge of "gook" on the crank where the bearing sits that you you may have to clean off to aid in bearing removal...

Chuck
Old 04-08-2008, 12:43 AM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Wow! Great advice everyone.

I would also check to make sure the piston and pin move freely as well. I just purchased an 61 RF-N, The engine had excellent compression and turned over well. Took it completely apart to clean it and found the piston and pin were almost siezed with build up. It bearly moved. I too would change the bearings to be safe and follow the excellant advice given.

I tried the Green Preston Antifreeze method with great results. Found a mini crockpot, put the engine parts in overnight, pulled them out the next day and washed them using regular Dawn dishsoap and toothbrush. Hardly had to scrub at all to get the gunk off. Left the engines looking almost new. But don't use the crockpot for food after you put the antifreze in it.

Bryan
Old 04-08-2008, 12:47 AM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Hit it with a Monokote heat gun and it will turn over. Fire it up and as Flywilly said the diaghragm should be intact.
Old 04-08-2008, 07:49 AM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

The crockpot method works quite well - just remove all rubber parts and gaskets! If the engines aren't responding to any of the above treatments - and remember, the reason for the treatments is to minimize the amount of force required to disassemble the the engine - here's another 'solution'. PB Blaster. This stuff comes in a spray can and is designed specifically to loosen 'frozen parts that are gummed or rusted together. It is basically a high performance penetrating lubricant, but it will DESTROY your pump diaphragm and carb 'O' rings; so remove them from your work area! In fact, I would apply PB Blaster outside (it has a 'distinctive' odor [:'(])!! If you use PB Blaster, be sure to thoroughly wash all parts before assembling the engine (I use liquid dishwashing detergent) and dry completely. Oil everything up and put it back together!
One more tip regarding the (common) rear bearing stuck on the crankshaft problem: assuming you have a drill press or access to one, support the bearing (which you're going to replace ) I use some scrap metal blocks, so you can press the crankshaft out of the bearing. Use a wood block between the drill press chuck and the front of the crankshaft. This is a great place to use your heat gun - blowing hot air on the bearing to get a bit of expansion (of course PB Blaster works well here, too). I also refrigerate the crankshaft for 10-15 minutes before putting the engine back together. Slide the rear bearing over the crankshaft (oil, oil, oil) then slide the assembly into the crankcase. This prevents misalignment or 'bad' seating of the rear bearing.
All the above advice is excecllent!!
If you have more problems come back here...
Good Luck,
Will
Old 04-08-2008, 09:23 AM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Will, I do the same thing when re-assembling engines. I put the rear bearing on the crank and throw that and the front bearing in the freezer, like you. Then I heat the case in the oven. Now, the bearings will usually push into place with very little pressure.

If you have an old engine with a nasty case, you can use copper cream and a wire brush. I learned this from jetpack in the engine forum. Here're two engines that were covered with baked-on castor. In addition, the aluminum had that dark gray mottled surface that old Enya's are prone to. I was blown away at how well it works.

David
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Old 04-08-2008, 02:04 PM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

Hi David,
For external 'baked-on' crud, I've used Z-Best Engine Cleaner which was marketed for model engine use. It works very well, but I'm not sure it is still available. Supposedly, Easy-Off oven cleaner works well on baked-on castor, too. A wire brush and some 'elbow-grease' are also pretty helpful
-Will
Old 04-08-2008, 04:21 PM
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Default RE: Help cleaning a OS-61 RF-P

PB Blaster is tha Bomb!! I've never had a reason to use it related to R/C but it is definatly some Good Stuff!! **Special notice to flywilly's precautions for this application**

I've never used the antifreeze/crockpot method cause I never really had the need...I'm glad to hear it works well!! I have read about it and it does seem like a popular method for cleaning..

rainedave:
There was no castor build up on those engines...You pulling our legs arn't you...

Good Stuff Ya'll

Chuck

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