Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Over the pastseveral weeks, I've been looking for sources of vintage pattern airplane kits. I have found two sources, those being Classic RC Hobby/ Home and Hobby Solutions, Inc. This is owned/run by Jeff Petroski. The second is Eureka Aircraft Co., owned by Don Turnock. Both of these sources offer several different and interesting airplanes. My question in all this is are there other sources that I should be considering in my search for my next modeling effort? I've not found much available for composite fuses and sheeted foam flying surfaces. Don does have some nice foam wing cores, but no composite fusesat least I don't think so. I'm not saying anything negative to either of these folks or their businesses, and am glad they are providing the kits and support that they are. I will be doing business with them. I'm asking if you know of others here in the USA that are also catering to the vintage pattern movement. Any other sources???

Larry Fitch

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

I guess when you use the term composite you mean carbon fibre or kevlar? I don't know anyone that uses those materials except to build modern Pattern ships. I'm sure Don (Frequent Flyer) would make one for you, he'll do anything a customer wants. It won't be for his rock bottom prices he charges right now, I'll bet!
Chris...

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

I have this and more glass fuse and foam cores For sale
Duane

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

I used the term composite to include glass fiber and epoxy. Several of the older glass fuses used fiberglass with carbon fiber in certain areas of higher stress/load. I meant the "composite" term to be inclusive of most anything execpt balsa wood.

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Hi Larry,
I see the confusion. I confused Don at Eureka with Don (Frequent Flyer). Don Carlson in Redondo Beach, CA makes all of his kits of epoxy glass fuselages with carbon fibre tow reinforcement and foam wings and stab cores. I have two of them, Bridi UFO and Jigsaw Atlanta 60, they're pretty nice and very quick building. He is easy to contact at;
Epoxy Glass Fuselages, Short Kits & Fiberglass parts. [email protected]
Hope this helps,
Chris...

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Does Don (Frequent Flyer) have a website? If not...I suggest he get one to help eliminate the confusion. PayPal payment too!

Dave

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

rcguy,

I guess he does not have a website. I sent him an email, and he responded within several minutesvery quickly. Heattached a price list of what he currently is making, and a little update of what is coming down over the next month or so. He is currently working on making a glass fuse for the Wild Beat. I don't know that airplane, but hope to look up some pictures and info later today. Does anyone out there know of this airplane and willing to increase my knowledge basesmall as it is?

stuntflyr,
Thanks for the help. What's involved in building a glass fuse? Do you need to shape ply formers and epoxy them in to stiffen up the fuse? That is what is required in large scale RC glidersmy main involvement in RC modeling for the past several years. You stated they are very quick building, which is great, but not my experience when building scale gliders.
Larry

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Larry,
Yes, they come with firewalls which are the only former necessary on most of them. The wings and tails need to be sheeted with 1/16th balsa with epoxy, then add leading and trailing edges, cut aileron and elevators out, shape and hinge. Fibreglass models are a little different than wood model because of the firewall installation is a different technique, but if you've built glass and foam gliders I don't think it'll be difficult. Landing gear takes a while, but another technique to be learned that once done becomes just another way to build.
I hope you order one and give it a try. Welcome to Classic.
Chris...<br type="_moz"/>

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Here is a link to Singapore Hobbies pictures of the MK designs. The Wild Beat and Wild 7 120 and 90 are very pretty designs in my mind. The Wild Beat is a 120 sized model.
http://www.singahobby.com.sg/mkp03.html
Chris...

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Chris,

Thanks for the comments and link to Singapor. I must say their photos leave a lot to be desired. Don says the fiberglass fuse won't be available for about a monthwhich is fine by me. I'm finishing up a big profile fun flyer that I need to get completed anyway before starting a build. Now I have five designs to chose between. It's been recommended to me to build any of the following:

1. King Altairall wood
2. Simlaall wood
3. Boxer 120wood fuse, foam flying surfaces
4. Wild Beatglass fuse, foam flying surfaces
5. ZEN 120AFR w/ wood fuse and flying surfaces (I think)

Each is different, all seem highly regarded by the folks that have recommended them to me. All are likely better flyers than I am a pilot.

Larry

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Larry,

the King Altair and Simla are older classics (early R/C - certainly the Simla) with quite different lines and flight performance than say a Boxer or Wild Beat. The Boxer was designed to be competitive yet easy to build and fly. The Wild Beat is an earlier turnaround design but the evolution of a series of models by a well known competitive Japanese designer called Akiba. It was also originally an MK kit - fantastic kits. Depending on your age (or at least I have so surmised), you might find yourself more inclined toward one era of design or another. The ZEN is a much more recent design (probably within the last 10 years) and is kitted as an ARF as you pointed out by a company which puts together ARF's of "relative" quality. Having said that, it is supposed to be a good flyer. Regardless, it is an ARF so you really have to consider whether it is part of the list depending on whether you want to build or assemble.

In my experience I would recommend, if this is your first pattern build, a wood fuse with foam core flying surfaces. Since coming by original Wild Beat MK kits is pretty hard, you would have to go the glass fuse route with that one when Don has gotten the mold sorted out. But..., although I generally agree with Chris (at least in principle) that glass/foam models build faster than wood models, in practice, I have to say that building a classic glass/foam kit takes me as long (if not longer) as a wood model. The reason for that is due to the fact that framing up a model is less than 50% of the work in getting a pattern ship airborne. Also, glass fuses have to be painted while wood models can be covered. That's something else that you might want to factor in. If you are an "always paint my models" kind of guy then this is a non issue but if you want it up in the air fast, then covering does take less time and effort. The results are different though - no question.

So now that I've finsihed pontificating...:), I'd have to recommend going with the Boxer. I think it would make a great candidate as an entry into classic pattern building. Don (FF) might be able to fix you up with some cores if you don't have that equipment. I'd also have to say that I think the Wild Beat might be just adequately powered with a YS 120 unless built very light. Don's glass fuses might actually help there if he's able to produce a lighter version for your YS.

I would build a Boxer 90 and put the 120 in it...:D

David.

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

doxilia,
WOW, I'm learning so much on this website. Thanks for all the insight and thoughts. I agree with everything you mentioned about my list of candidate airplanes. I flown model airplanes for about 30+ years, and been flying gliders (TD, slope and scale aerotow) for the last 10-12 years. I have a very nice powered club in the area (TriCities RC Modelers) and thought I'd join and learn to improve my flying skills of powered planes by getting a pattern airplane up and running. I have a used YS120NC available in excellent shape that I thought I'd use to power this new airplane. I don't want to fly current 2meter pattern competition, but would like to really learn to fly straight lines much better. I'm leaning toward the Boxer or the Wild Beat. I've been trying to get in contact with Rick Allison for a set of Boxer plans, but haven't made the connection yet. Don told me this morning the the Wild Beat glass fuse should be available early next month.

I do have foam cutting equipment and vacuum bagging system as well, so I think I can handle the building part of this effort. Right now, first I need to settle on the first design, and then find the "kit" to build. No huge hurry here, but don't want to let this drop either.

Sincerely,

Larry

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

doxilia/all,

A local member of my RC Club has a set of plans for the Boxer120, but isn't interested in selling them. According to him, the plans he has are on a "velum"-like material, not paper and have been epoxied to the balsa sheet stock, per the instructions. Part of the construction effort is to epoxy the plans to the sheet stock. Then the components are cut out of the sheet stock. The 'velum-like" material is used as part of a "composite-like" sandwich of balsa, epoxy and this "plastic-type" material. Are other airplanes constructed this way, and does the laminating the plans to the balsa really add to the strength/stiffness of the airplane structure/members? If this construction techniqueis valid, then buying a set of paper copies of the plans doesn't make much sense. Thoughts?

Larry Fitch

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

Larry,

I don't think this was the original thought. As I mentioned to you earlier, I have original copies of all the plans and some are on blueprint style paper. Rick plotted the boxer 90 plans out on vellum because, as I understand it, he had original cad files and wanted to have the most accurate drawings. The plane is pretty straight forward and is light but strong. A friend of mine built a Boxer 60 and he just glued the templates on cardboard and traced them out. I didn't notice any lack of strength with the final result.

Pedro

RE: Sources for pattern airplane kits
 

I doubt laminating vellum adds any significant strength to balsa. I can see it adding a fair bit of weight though - primarily due to the glue!

Vellum is nice to rubber cement on to wood for cutting templates - then it can be pulled off.

David.