Go Back  RCU Forums > Radios, Batteries, Clubhouse and more > The Clubhouse
Reload this Page >

Glow 4 stroke and gas/petrol glow?

Notices
The Clubhouse If it doesn't fit in any other category and is about general RC stuff then post it here at the Clubhouse.

Glow 4 stroke and gas/petrol glow?

Old 08-03-2022, 11:06 AM
  #1  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default Glow 4 stroke and gas/petrol glow?

I cannot understand why 4 stroke glow actually sell, the power output of a 4 stroke glow is round about 1/2 that of a 2 stroke glow which is about 1/2 the price of a 4 stroke glow. I can think of 2 advantages of 4 stroke glow, these are good fuel economy and long engine life however 4 strokes have a lot to go wrong with respect to the opening and closing of valves operation, 2 strokes have less moving parts which is desirable. I notice OS has introduced a gas/petrol glow that is it has a glow plug just like 2 stroke glow but it works with gas/petrol

I think if migrating from glow 2 stroke, would be looking to transition into 2 stroke gas/petrol with spark plug and ignition system.Unfortunately, the lowest cc for 2 stroke gas/petrol is around 10cc which is still a bit big.

Last edited by 2W0EPI; 08-03-2022 at 11:11 AM.
Old 08-03-2022, 11:35 AM
  #2  
init4fun
 
init4fun's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 4,177
Received 43 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

You did not list one of the biggest advantages of 4 stroke VS 2 stroke, , , , , , SOUND !

Believe me I love and run all types of engines (and yes motors too) in my planes, and of the engines I run, the 4 strokes sound better. In a nutshell, the 4 stroke don't have that "flying chainsaw" scream of the 2 stroke, a sound that seems particularly attuned to pissing off the flying field's neighbors......

Now aren't ya glad ya asked?

Old 08-03-2022, 12:06 PM
  #3  
David John Davis
Senior Member
 
David John Davis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 156
Received 41 Likes on 34 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 2W0EPI View Post
I cannot understand why 4 stroke glow actually sell, the power output of a 4 stroke glow is round about 1/2 that of a 2 stroke glow which is about 1/2 the price of a 4 stroke glow. I can think of 2 advantages of 4 stroke glow, these are good fuel economy and long engine life however 4 strokes have a lot to go wrong with respect to the opening and closing of valves operation, 2 strokes have less moving parts which is desirable. I notice OS has introduced a gas/petrol glow that is it has a glow plug just like 2 stroke glow but it works with gas/petrol

I think if migrating from glow 2 stroke, would be looking to transition into 2 stroke gas/petrol with spark plug and ignition system.Unfortunately, the lowest cc for 2 stroke gas/petrol is around 10cc which is still a bit big.
...and they all sound effing awful!
The following users liked this post:
init4fun (08-03-2022)
Old 08-03-2022, 12:20 PM
  #4  
tedsander
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: White Bear lake, MN
Posts: 696
Likes: 0
Received 59 Likes on 56 Posts
Default

You have not then encountered a Y.S. 1.20/1.40 4 stroke. Lots more power than any available glow 2 stroke, or many petrol engines of similar size.
But....gave up on mine as the ~$6-7 USD per 8-10 min flight at current glow fuel prices was getting hard to justify.
The following users liked this post:
init4fun (08-03-2022)
Old 08-03-2022, 12:41 PM
  #5  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
the 4 strokes sound better
Yep, I have to agree with you, however, I just want to point out that sound does not impact performance.
Old 08-03-2022, 12:59 PM
  #6  
David John Davis
Senior Member
 
David John Davis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 156
Received 41 Likes on 34 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 2W0EPI View Post
Yep, I have to agree with you, however, I just want to point out that sound does not impact performance.
I have a few two-stroke glows but only one is fitted in a model, the club's trainer! As for four strokes being less powerful, fit a bigger four stroke! It's that simple!
The following users liked this post:
init4fun (08-03-2022)
Old 08-03-2022, 01:25 PM
  #7  
init4fun
 
init4fun's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 4,177
Received 43 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 2W0EPI View Post
Yep, I have to agree with you, however, I just want to point out that sound does not impact performance.
And I want to point out that "performance" isn't always everyone in the hobby's ultimate carrot on the end of a stick. Are you the guy that I've already had a conversation with in a different thread about "fun" not coming at the very ragged edge of just how fast one can make a model aircraft fly ?

Try this "performance" scenario on for size;

Your screaming 2 stroke pisses off the field's neighbors SO badly that you get the field shut down, VS your 4 stroke not emitting the shrill whine doesn't bring the negative attention.
Now, tell me, , , which engine has "performed" better????
Old 08-03-2022, 05:36 PM
  #8  
Joseph Frost
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Coffs Harbour NSW, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,370
Likes: 0
Received 46 Likes on 44 Posts
Default

I love the sound of 4-strokes, always used them rather than screeming 2-strokes despite slight less power, so all you have to do is upsize a bit. The key is regular service/maintenance of taps check and adjustments I do on regular bases. I use them mainly in multi powered toys.

Giant 12 kilo twin cyl. 4-stroke Boxer sonding awesome.

Twin 4-stroke powered B-airliner by Frosty in my younger days, still ticking sweet after regular service.

Four 4-strokes sounding even better.
The following users liked this post:
TheEdge (08-03-2022)
Old 08-03-2022, 06:03 PM
  #9  
TheEdge
My Feedback: (788)
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bonita, CA
Posts: 1,015
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Damn that is one fine Lanc.
Old 08-03-2022, 06:22 PM
  #10  
Joseph Frost
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Coffs Harbour NSW, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,370
Likes: 0
Received 46 Likes on 44 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by TheEdge View Post
Damn that is one fine Lanc.
TX, (took me ~1000 hours to build) tail heavy as a brick at 12kg, needed lot of nose probe balast to fix it, flew well after, later de-commissioned and moved it 4-strokes to

Sweet sound of 4-stroke Herc.

Now as E-power.
"C-130/Herc", still flying it but now as E power with 2kilo more thrust, and LOL.
Old 08-04-2022, 06:21 AM
  #11  
daveopam
My Feedback: (9)
 
daveopam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: ELK CITY, OK
Posts: 7,780
Received 38 Likes on 33 Posts
Default


Having flown both I will say this. On a 3D type plane I prefer a 4stroke using glow. Replacing a .45-.50 two stroke with a Saito .82 made a better 3D plane IMHO. Throttle response was better being the main difference. The .82 had a shorter spool up time and made better torque on the low end. When you are hanging on the prop at eye level every second counts. Not saying it can't be done with a good two stroke. Just giving my preference.

David
Old 08-04-2022, 09:24 AM
  #12  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by daveopam View Post
I prefer a 4stroke using glow.
For me, migration from 2 stroke glow towards 2 stroke gas/petrol means two important advantages can be gained, the first is precise controlled ignition timing with auto advance at high rpm and secondly, gas/petrol is considerably cheaper than nitro glow fuel. Ignition timing on either 2 or 4 stroke glow is at best erratic.

Last edited by 2W0EPI; 08-04-2022 at 10:19 AM.
Old 08-05-2022, 06:04 AM
  #13  
daveopam
My Feedback: (9)
 
daveopam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: ELK CITY, OK
Posts: 7,780
Received 38 Likes on 33 Posts
Default

Currently everything I fly now is gas/petrol. I still own a few glow powered planes but haven't flown them in years. I'll never go back to glow but gas is not practical for a .40 size airframe either.

david
Old 08-05-2022, 09:17 AM
  #14  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by daveopam View Post
but gas is not practical for a .40 size airframe either.
That is correct, about 10cc and below belongs to glow, the smallest 2 stroke gas/petrol engine, that I know about, is the NGH9 (9cc), but I've been told elsewhere that NGH engines are not so good?
Old 08-05-2022, 12:31 PM
  #15  
David John Davis
Senior Member
 
David John Davis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 156
Received 41 Likes on 34 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 2W0EPI View Post
For me, migration from 2 stroke glow towards 2 stroke gas/petrol means two important advantages can be gained, the first is precise controlled ignition timing with auto advance at high rpm and secondly, gas/petrol is considerably cheaper than nitro glow fuel. Ignition timing on either 2 or 4 stroke glow is at best erratic.
They still sound bloody awful!
The following users liked this post:
init4fun (08-05-2022)
Old 08-28-2022, 12:07 PM
  #16  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by David John Davis View Post
They still sound bloody awful!
That is very true, it's an annoying whine but, for a lower cost entry into rc plane flying, the 0.46 cu.in glow 2 stroke engine is king. I would also like to point out that a 6hp petrol 4 stroke 2kW generator system sells for around 240 whilst a 4 stroke petrol rotary rc engine can have a asking price of about 4500, clearly ridiculous, even if it does sound better.
Old 08-28-2022, 09:01 PM
  #17  
David John Davis
Senior Member
 
David John Davis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 156
Received 41 Likes on 34 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 2W0EPI View Post
That is very true, it's an annoying whine but, for a lower cost entry into rc plane flying, the 0.46 cu.in glow 2 stroke engine is king. I would also like to point out that a 6hp petrol 4 stroke 2kW generator system sells for around 240 whilst a 4 stroke petrol rotary rc engine can have a asking price of about 4500, clearly ridiculous, even if it does sound better.
You are misinformed.

The cheapest petrol four stroke engine costs 280 from Just Engines. I would not buy one myself because I have several four stroke glows currently sitting in their boxes doing nothing. https://www.justengines.co.uk/shop/p...v=11aedd0e4327

People cite the lower price of petrol as the reason for going over to two stroke petrol engines as if we are running a fleet of diesel trucks instead of flying a few toy aeroplanes once in a while. However, modern Chinese two strokes fitted with a standard silencer not only sound bloody awful, they are so noisy that they could be the cause of losing flying fields. If you must run a flying chainsaw engine, at least fit an effective silencer. Zimmermann have a good reputation: https://zimmermannschalldaempfer.de/...--muffler.html

As for your remarks about the 46 two stroke glow being the entry level engine for beginners you are absolutely right. If you crash a model powered by a four stroke engine you may well have a big repair bill on your hands and second hand two stroke glows sell for peanuts these days. I have one in a Seagull Boomerang. I use it as an advanced trainer with novice pilots. I would not put one of my beloved four strokes or even my Enya 50 in the clumsy hands of a beginner!

Last edited by David John Davis; 08-28-2022 at 09:11 PM. Reason: Grammar!
Old 09-01-2022, 10:11 AM
  #18  
slindsay
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 26
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default Glow 4 stroke and gas/petrol glow?

I'll have to say I do like the sound of a 4 stroke engine, I only have two at this time. My back ground is 2 stroke and have a good number of them in my shop. However I've been trying to move to gas 2 stroke engines due to the cost of fuel these days. I first bought a 15cc to mount in an old Astrohog, then acquired a 10cc and I think I'll use the 10cc for the Hog. I've started a build (I have been very slow with that) of a Carl Goldberg Super Chipmunk and I have the 15cc mounted at this point. I've also acquired an old biplane the Lazy Ace, 76" wing I think. HeHe, at first I purchased a twin 30cc but I may revert to a twin 20cc for the Ace. Anyway for me I believe gasoline engines are my future. I am not interested in electrics at all. I'm just an old retired guy that likes to bore holes in the sky on weekends. And 3D is not in my vocabulary, but I do like to watch.

sherm
Old 09-01-2022, 10:23 AM
  #19  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by slindsay View Post
I've been trying to move to gas 2 stroke engines due to the cost of fuel these days.
That's the direction we must all move in for lower cost and precise ignition timing reasons. I see 4 stroke gas on offer but the expense and power droop is just too much.

Cheers
Old 09-01-2022, 10:35 AM
  #20  
Telemaster Sales UK
 
Telemaster Sales UK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Measnes, La Creuse, France.
Posts: 1,972
Received 98 Likes on 85 Posts
Default

I'll stick with my glows.

I already have a fair bit of fuel in stock, besides we're not running a fleet of diesel trucksare we? We are fueling little engines to have some fun on the weekends. I don't suppose you'll get very fat on the amount you will save going over from glow to petrol.

Besides, unless they are fitted wiuth a decent, read expensive, silencer, they will sound bloody awful and are likely to loose flying fields in noise sensitive areas.
Old 09-01-2022, 10:46 AM
  #21  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Telemaster Sales UK View Post
,,, and are likely to loose flying fields in noise sensitive areas.
Highly unlikely given the amount of business and revenue generated by the rc community.
Old 09-01-2022, 01:53 PM
  #22  
init4fun
 
init4fun's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 4,177
Received 43 Likes on 37 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 2W0EPI View Post
Highly unlikely given the amount of business and revenue generated by the rc community.
Shirley you can't be serious ?

Noise complaints from neighbors have lost plenty of flying fields over the years, and as to revenue generated by our hobby? Freakin STAMP COLLECTORS generate more revenue than we do
The following users liked this post:
David John Davis (09-01-2022)
Old 09-01-2022, 07:46 PM
  #23  
David John Davis
Senior Member
 
David John Davis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 156
Received 41 Likes on 34 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 2W0EPI View Post
Highly unlikely given the amount of business and revenue generated by the rc community.
In the immortal words of John McEnroe, "YOU CANNOT BE SERIOUS!!!"
The following users liked this post:
init4fun (09-02-2022)
Old 09-06-2022, 10:40 AM
  #24  
2W0EPI
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: N.Wales UK
Posts: 93
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

A lot has been said about 4 stroke nitro/petrol but what about 2 stroke glow gas/petrol? Here/s the one such example

https://www.align-trex.co.uk/nitro-e...-silencer.html

Power output is up there, but it uses a special O.S. developed glow plug?
What about it's cost?

Last edited by 2W0EPI; 09-06-2022 at 10:46 AM.
Old 09-06-2022, 07:40 PM
  #25  
David John Davis
Senior Member
 
David John Davis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 156
Received 41 Likes on 34 Posts
Default

Being an OS it should work well but they're not popular. I've never seen one on a flying field.

It's your money but for slightly less you could buy one of these and run it on the recommended new 7% oil mix.Laser 180 | Laser Engines

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2022 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.