phuffstatler

My Feedback: (20)

Whether you like them or not, Tower is dumping the Spectrum 40 ARF's for $99 complete, with a $15 gift certificate for buying one. I'm not an ARF fan by any means, but I'm not stupid, either... (well, that's debatable). Anyway, I've heard they fly really well, the looks of it show that it should fly really well, and now I've got one sitting in the workshop, complete with new retracts, too. It'll be in the air next weekend. Not the latest monokote covered technology, but still looks mighty cool sitting there.


phil in austin

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

When it comes to instant gratification, ARF's are impossible to beat. I built a plane once, and I will say that all my ARF's have lasted longer than my kit built. (The only exception is a plane I sold that someone else crashed)

bgi

My Feedback: (7)

It's easy to understand: Simple arrogance. Yea, don't get your feathers ruffled. I'm guilty of being arrogant, myself. Humans do that. Some folks who have been kit-building for 30 years (as I have) sometimes get huffy when the new generation can get a plane up in the air IN ONE WEEKEND which:
1) looks great
2) flys as good as it looks
3) costs less money than building a kit
4) costs about 2-3% of the time to build a kit
Maybe like they don't think the new guys have "paid their dues." Well, the times they are a changing.

That's the simple reality. If you want to discuss poor construction, poor assembly, unsafe radio installations. etc., then that's a topic which can be thrashed about as long as you desire while leaving the ARF question completely out of the conversation.

I've seen kit-built planes fail. I've seen them go in because of poor construction, failure to secure clevises, etc. And I've been flying RC power planes less than two years. I haven't seen an ARF fail due to improper factory work (yet) but I'm sure I will. Most crashes I've seen were pilot error - either flying an unsafe plane or dumb-thumbing. All of mine have been!

Many builders today can't cover worth a darn and don't have the patience to learn how. I've seen some gosh-awful covering jobs (arrogance coming out?) but the planes did fly.

Planes fail. People get careless. Take responsibility for what you put in the air.

This topic probably won't die until 2 generations after you can no longer buy kits. So I'm outta here. Got ARFs to assemble and kits to build! Enough time-wasting on this topic!

ajcoholic

My Feedback: (10)

BGI,
You are the first guy that I have read a post from that I agree with 100% on this topic.

With that, I too am outa' here!

AJC

vtol_guy

guys, we all know self built planes are superior (!!!) so please just let this thread die with dignity lol

its had a long life, let it RIP

easyways

My Feedback: (28)

I haven't been in this hobby long, and the post and reviews by Minnflyer have been a huge help to me as I am one of the few who have tried to teach himself to fly RC, (With GREAT success I might add). But his stand against ARF's I must strongly disagree.
We all know that if you fly, SH$t happens. I'm a truck driver who works 10 to 12 hours a day, If I were a kit builder I would have clocked more time in the shop and Considerably less time at the field learning to fly. I'm going to crash planes, that's a given, thankfully, manufacturers have given me a choice as to how long it takes me to get back in the air, 2 months vs. 2 days. If a company puts out a bad product, it won't be long before we get wind of it. It won't be long before that product or that company has to go.
I'm willing to bet good money that there are just as many bad kits out there as is bad BARF's (ARF's)
Sorry to be so long winded but I think arf's are getting a bad rap from a guy that has been so helpful to so many of us in this hobby.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

As I have said before, I think that building and flying is "TWO" hobbies. SOme enjoy building, some enjoy flying, and others enjoy both. The ARF's are for people who enjoy flying but do not have the skill or time to build.

Scar

My Feedback: (3)

I had to laugh, the most smug, self righteous ARF-hater in the club has had two wing failures on kit-built planes in the last month. Haven't seen a single ARF wing fail, in fact I can't remember one failing.

Both wing failures caused destruction of the fuse. On one, half wing stayed with the fuse. The other was one he'd converted to bolt-on (from rubber band mount) and both bolts pulled through the wood threads.

I love this sport!

Dave Olson

FLYBOY

My Feedback: (11)

It is funny. Most of the people arguing one side or the other here, (notice I said most, not all), can't see the other side because they choose not to. I have 55 planes, 2 of which are ARFs. I have built a few other ARFs but the quality is far inferior to what I can build, and I can do a kit in the same time I can do an ARF almost, up to the covering point. That takes time. Not all can do that so ARFs work for them. The problem I see is that as an ARF builder, many can't fix what they break.

I was answering a post last month on fixing a wing. I explained how to do it and it was a really easy fix at that. Some smart ARF builder pipes in with "that would be really impossible to fix, you should just order a new wing so there is no problem."

The other one was a guy who wanted to make his ARF a tail dragger. It is one of the easiest things to do and takes no time at all. I and others expained how to do it, and again an ARF builder pipes in and says "you shouldn't do that. It is a huge modification and shouldn't be done."

Its not always the ARF planes that people get frusterated with. It is the bad building or fixing advice given by someone that builds only ARFs and doesn't know how to do anything but buy new parts.

I am not singling out ARF builders here, because there are some guys who build that should stick to ARFs because they are built better than some can build. There are also some fine ARF flyers out there that are pretty smart when it comes to a lot of things in RC. You can't group everyone into one group. The same goes, you can't group all the planes into one group. There are too many different cases and none are the same.

SunShyne

My Feedback: (68)

Im gonna have to backup Miles on this one. There are 2 completely differenent aspects on this. I myself dread kits. I simply have no time to build. I barely have enough time to devote a couple hours a week to ARF's It cant be beat, there are too many people who enjhoy flying as opposed to building. I can appreciate good workmanship and the pride that goes into bulding a kit I simply dont see myself ever doing one anytime soon. You can moan and groan all day about suspect quality which does have some legitimacy to it but overall it cant and will not be beat. PERIOD. ARF haters are angry becuase I feel they come from a time where it was mostly KITS around and they bust their butts building all those years and now anyone with a few bucks can buy something just as good if not better.

Dont hate, ARF's are driving the hobby right now, visit your LHS and you will see yourself.

For those who build becuase its something they enjoy then God bless and please continue but dont hate on ARF's. Your reasoning only gets countered by the cash register's ching ching ching of another ARF out the door.

I have taken ARF's to the next level. I prefer to buy used. That way I dont even have to glue the tail feathers or the wing, I also get lucky sometimes and the pushrods were left in there, lol

You get my point. To each their own.

pZ

matt :stupid:

bgi

My Feedback: (7)

Amen to the last two posts. You guys are perceptive.

I'll stop typing now and get back to building my TF P-39 and assembling my Kyosho Pitts!

WADE

My Feedback: (19)

I say live and let live. Fly what you like. If someone doesn't like your ARF or your built-up kit, then the heck with them! You fly for yourself so choose what you like.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

I like a 33% edge or extra but I just can't seem one to fly!

Live Wire

I like the new ones they have for the airlines and military, the bigger the better.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

Following 18 months, many companies have economical ARF's on the market.
Hanger 9, Wild Hare, Composite ARF, Great Planes, Aircraft International, Aeroworks, Planes Plus, and many others.
With a good 1/3 scale plane costing less than $1000 and only needing 24 hours of work to get it in the air, what more can be done to make ARF's more compatable to kits?

I know Wild Hare and Composite ARF offer single color ARF's so they can me customized. SHould all ARF manufacturers do the same?

bobo_54501

My Feedback: (19)

Back in the day when I was a pot smoking ..know it all ..worthless ..cocky 16 year old kid I met another simuler child . We became friends . He was in foster care of a Baptist preacher that had just moved to town to preach . The church he was going to preach at had about 15 members more or less a sunday country club .The preacher was a large white man With a heart of gold .He never critisised you but tried to see the best in everyone .He never looked down at you but offered good advice and gave what he had to help you out . When he preached he preached from the heart . Talked of love not hate .And was always there for you night or day no matter what hit the fan .
In the next 2 years the church went from 15 members to well over 200 and growing .He never patted his self on the back or acted like he was the greatest thing .. He just wanted to help people no matter where they were at in life .Threw watching his actions he made me want to be a better me .Not a holly roler just a better person with a new attitude .
The 15 original members hated this .Their country club was being invaded ..
One day the preacher during a surmoned supposedly moved his hands in a Methodos or jewish or something manner .The original members thought this was horrible and wanted his head .. The Cat Fights Began ..They made it misserable for this good man doing good deads who only was trying to help people .As this continued you could sense the tension in the church . People Quit coming ..New members never came back .And the good preachers finnaly moved on . The original 15 had thier empty church back .Most of them are dead and gone now . I my self only will go to a church for marrying and burying ..I believe in God but alot of his socalled people stink ..
I often times see that church in this hobby ..New guys come in and alot of people act arogant about them selfs and what they fly .Does it really matter What you fly or how you do it if its done safely ?? Couldnt the guy with the $10,000 Jet go over and help the newby flying a SPAD ??? Arent SPADS actually scratch built to ?? Couldnt the ARF guys go over and say to the scratch builder Man thats a sweet bird and have him be modest about it .If a new guy looks at this thread with out knowing how great most of us guys are do you think they would want to get involved in argueing ?? I fly and build everything from Kits to ARFs to SPADs .I help new guys when I can and take pleasure in seeing a new guy get excited when he first solos or greases a landing ..But most of all I dont want our great hobby to die but not bringing in new blood to the sport ..So I think we should all try NOT to be like those Original 15 members .

jessiej

It is not a matter of good fortune. For most of us it takes a lot of hard work to create that "luck".

jess

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

You are fortunate that your family enjoys your hobby. Or should I say that you enjoy their hobby