rabraaten

As I'm sure none of you remember, my first Hangar 9 Arrow met the earth rather hard last June. At the direction of my instructor I picked up every last scrap of plane and took it home. The replacement airframe came and has been flown over and over and over again. One minor crash that moved the firewall a bit, but all is right in Arrow Land once again. I decided early on that the Arrow would be rebuilt one day. As the 'wife' has put a moratorium on future buys till after the wedding I'm starting to rebuild Arrow 1... with mods of course. Firstly the wing will be moved to the bottom of the fuselage. I'll post as many pictures as I can...as soon as I figure out how to make them small enough to post.

rabraaten

The leading edges of both wings suffered pretty bad, although it is making it easier to pull the control rods out and switch them from wing to wing. The back half of the fuselage is of course in great shape as I epoxied the tail feathers in place. Here you can see most of the wing damage and the beginning of my plan to re-engineer my plane.

Mr67Stang

It will be interesting to see how you convert it to a low wing... I look forward to your rebuild and subsequent flight report.

rabraaten

I don't have enough experience building to know what I can't do...HAHAHA. So far it looks easy enough. The aileron torque rods were cut out of the wings and swapped side for side putting the control side of the rod facing up though a newly drilled hole. The servo is going to be mounted dead centre in the wing as opposed to the off centre original location. By my crude measurements I'll move the servo tray up about an inch or so in the fuse and flip the servos inverted. Make a cutout in the fuse for the wing which will be modified to bolt on. As you can see the fuse will be a bit shorter in height as I change the configuration but hey....isn't that what a rebuild like this is all about....I'm sure the maiden will be far more interesting than the rebuild ever could...

Krener

Dont forget to add doublers for the fuselage section where the new wing saddle will be, and how much deihedral are you going to build into it??

rabraaten

Hey Krener, I think I'll be doubling the fuse nearly all the way forward as that is how it was before, as far as the crash wreckage looks; balsa exterior panelling with a light-ply inner structure. I'll also be converting from a tricycle to a taildragger which will help me in another respect... I'll be installing a block at the front of the wing saddle for dowels in the wing to be installed into. This will also serve as my landing gear mounting block and I'll tie it into the fuse to provide structural support.

As far as dihedral goes im going to leave it as it was. I looked into that in a thread on the aerodynamics page, Rebuild....but different should get you there if you're interested. That thread also covers a number of the mods that I'm thinking of. Until it actually gets done everything is experimental. The one thing that I didn't talk about there was CG. I think because of the mods that I am doing I am going to move the wing position back to keep my CG forward. Enlarging tail feathers and reducing the overall section of the fuse will make things a bit tail happy I'm thinking. As this isn't rocket science my gut feelings are guiding me. My instinct tells me that the CG should remain in the same position on the wing, within reason. Move the wing back a half an inch and the CG should still be 3 1/8th inches from the leading edge....or very close....NO need for me to get all excited at this point though....wings are a lot of work....

r2champion

I've got my popcorn, sitting here rooting for ya! I'd love to see the process and end results. Good luck!

rabraaten

#1 Left Wing root end damage, leading edge destroyed in impact.
#2 Left Wing root repaired. Damage went all the way to the first rib so I fit tight and thin CA'd. Leading edge is doubled on the backside also for installation of dowels for bolt in wing attachment.
#3 Left Wing leading edge damage. Leading edge was broken at both ends and sheeting was cracked all the way along. I cut off the sheeting relatively square. All the ribs were broken back to the spar. Installed replacement pieces and glued sheeting back down. Carpenters glue on the ribs and thin CA around the sheeting edges.
#4 And all repaired.....Taaadaaaaa....
#5 Right Wing leading edge repaired and doubled. Because of the extensive damage at the ends of this wing I tongue and grooved my patches to strengthen the repairs. Here you can see how I doubled the leading edge for the dowels to go through.
#6 Right Wing. A good shot of how I tied into the leading edge. The outside is contoured to fit inside the fiberglass wingtip and was CA'd in place there.
#7 Right Wing inboard. If you refer to the first couple pictures in the thread you can see how this section was separated from the entire wing. I thought this was going to be the most challenging part of the rebuild but it turned out to be very easy. I cleaned up edges where necessary and slid the two pieces together. The fit was good enough that after cleaning some of the previously glued surfaces off, I CA'd the whole section back on. I'm sure its even stronger than before.
#8 Right Wing inboard... and a few patches and some little fillers and we're about ready for a rough sanding.

It is a fair amount of work, but its not nearly as daunting as I was expecting. It's nice to sit and relax and sniff some glue for a couple hours at the end of my day. I can tell when I get a good bond cause the CA starts to burn my eyes. LOL. It looks like most of the damage is repaired in the wings. I have yet to find my chunk of light ply that got misplaced in the move, but as soon as I find it the right wingroot will be finished up and the wings will be rough sanded and joined.

rabraaten

AND NOW....SOME PICTURES!!!!!.....I'll get this thing figured out sometime soon....

Mr67Stang

Nice progress. You said you do not have a lot of experience so I will throw out some of my thoughts and you can take them or leave them. Remember they are just some ideas pertaining to your project not rules for making it work

1) If you do not have some 220 & 400 grit sand paper and sandable wood filler... get some. The smoother the surface is before you cover it the better it will look when you do.

2) The old wing mount location on top is begging for some custom removable canopy so you can still get in there from the top to access radio gear. Bear in mind you may have to brace that section of fusalage to keep it from flexxing (maintain structural integrity)

3) Before putting the wing halves back together trace the root rib profile so you can transfer it to the side of the plane to make your new low wing wing saddle.

Again just some ideas. I am enjoying YOUR project from afar.[sm=thumbup.gif]

vegas mossie

if its not to late, you might consider using dual aileron servos in the wings instead of one in the middle, better control and less flutter...

Mr67Stang

Definately.[sm=thumbup.gif]

rabraaten

Hey Stang,

1) After getting to the point that I'm at now I think I'll be happy with the results I'm getting from the 180 fine I have. Seems like a finer finish than was on any of the ARF parts to begin with, and I didn't have a lick of trouble from the factory covering job.

2) My revamp of the interior should alleviate any concerns there. If you look at the drawing I've made of the centre bit of the fuselage you'll see a dark horizontal line from the rear wing former forward. Under it is a fainter line. The bottom line is the original servo tray position. The darker line is where I will be mounting it now. I'm going to invert the servos in the tray so that everything there is accessible from the wing openning. You can also see about the centre of the wing is the original trike gear mounting block. The post in front of it was the hold down for the fuel tank retainer and the receiver/battery. I think I'm going to move the post to the top of the fuse somewhere and do the same with the receiver and battery. The wing is going to be mounted up into the fuselage a bit more than the diagram shows right now. I think as high as I can get it and still have adequate clearance for everything. The fuse is going to be constructed essentially the same as it was before. 1/8th inch light ply (carved out for weight of course) and 1/8th inch balsa sheeting. The top of the fuse is going to be rounded as opposed to 'stick' shaped. I'm still considering ideas for this part. I have enough ply and balsa sticks to do it framework style (like the GP Sprtster/Hog Bipe/etc.). I'm also toying with the idea of carving it from styrofoam and sheeting that. Dunno what I'm going to do about canopy yet...but that's a ways off yet to worry about.

3) Step ahead of you there. I had traced it right away as part of the centre rib on one wing was gone in the impact so I had to rebuild that whole part of the wing anyways.

As far as wing servo(s) go, I hadn't thought about dual but certainly am now. With my rods set up as they are do you think I'll gain as much by going with the dual set-up? The wing, although joined, is a ways off from being finished. I need to add some strength to the top where it will sit in the saddle and to strengthen the bottom for my bolt set up. I'm also going to shape the bottom of the wing into the fuse after I'm done with that too. I got a bunch more ideas from a thread in the kit build section on the GP Sportster, as far as strengthening and filling, and mounting the wing as well. I found the main gear mounting block in my Zip-Locks of wreckage and have deduced that it looks fine enough to be molded into this build. I was planning on using the main gear wires for my taildragger swap and will wire/solder them together for a bit of firmness. My landings are much better than they were at first so I'm not terribly concerned about grinding it in. Tail wheel still under consideration. I think I'm going to engineer a bolt on to the rudder for that.

The Arrow came with the Evolution PTS engine and I think this version will get a boost with the Evo .52. Same dimensions...more power. I'm not looking forward to swapping electronics around so the early plan for that end is a Futaba 7C 2.4 with 3152 servos. If I go dual on the ailerons I'll grab a 3001 or 3004 for the throttle.

Mr67Stang

Actually if you use the dual aileron servo this will give you the option of another feature. You can cut the aileron, say about the first 5 inches from the root side and make them functional flaps utilizing the existing aileron torque rods. If you need a picture of how to do that let me know. While the plane wont NEED flaps it could be fun

Revodude29

this is somewhat cool[][][]

rabraaten

Just a quick update....build stalled out a little over the weekend as a more important assembly came into the house.....

1) A perfectly acceptable build interruption, 78, 000 BTU's worth...ARGH ARGH ARGH....no one can argue that!
2) Landing gear mount, stripped of busted bits and ready for glue removal, servo tray and receiver/fuel tank retainer ready for cutout
3) Left and right fuselage sides, balsa sheeting and plywood doublers (to be carved for weight)
4) Mock-up of fuse....seems like everything is gonna fit...it'll be snug but it should go

I guess I'm mostly commited to my fuse now. The top will be a bit higher than it looks now as the curved top has yet to be added. After dinkin around with some styro I've decided that frame and sheeting is how that will happen.

Mr67Stang

Looks good so this far. Stalled out? No, your making good progress. At this rate we may have a flight report before the steaks are done

kid chuckles

That is wanting a grilled steak BAD looking at all the snow and a short sleeve shirt BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR Looks like a very good start and a cool project. Hope it all works.

rabraaten

Next update.....
1) Fuselage ply doublers cutout, landing gear braces glued on.
2) Fuse mocked up with formers (notched for strength and location).
3) Fuse with balsa sides and servo tray relatively located.....

The balsa sides and doublers are under the glue right now joining together. The landing gear block will have a 1/4 to 1/2 inch plate glued into it to receive the wing dowels, as of now, not installed. Once the front section of fuse is assembled and ready I will notch the rear section kinda puzzle piece like and join the two of them together. Tail feather mods are not far off now. I think I might add a quarter to a half inch to the ailerons too...that way i can reduce my linkages to gain some more mechanical advantage AND increase my roll rates.

rabraaten

oh yeah... barbeques started going on sale.....weather has finally turned around. 32 degrees sure feels nice after -50. Steaks on Friday....somethin else on Sunday....

Mr67Stang

There was a thread in the ARF/RTF forum where an indevidual asked for pictures of the front end of an Arrow for reference to rebuild. The picks may be helpfull to you as well. Particularly where the cowl cheeks are cut down to facilitate the needle valve assembly of the engine. Here is a link to that thread if you care to look.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_71...tm.htm#7148785

rabraaten

Thanks Stang, but somewhat unecessary as I do have an operational Arrow at the moment. If you're curious about the cutout for the needle valve that seems to be missing from my pics..... The profile of my fuselage continues on from that cutout straight back. I shortened down the top of the fuselage straight from that cutout line to the back, then designed my as yet un-fabbed rounded top side to the top of the cutout line....geez i hope this works....lol. I fooled around a bit tonight with the bum end of the plane and found that my assembly of the feathers was a bit shoddy and it pulled apart fairly easily after removing the wingnuts. I hadn't cut away the covering before I did the big epoxy in place so it just popped apart. At least that will make my mods to the tail section and covering a bit easier....

james#17

It ironic to see this plane being rebuilt. The arrow was my first and only plane. To make it short. I got it up and running and everything looked fine. A local pilot with lots of experiance cheacked it out and said it was great. I had him to fly it. Well after a few minutes the place started to dance around a little. Then all of a sudden the monocoat just tore from the wing. The plance came down very fast. Just before it hit the ground it pulled from the nose dive and it laned on the landing gear.

Just to say. I carried it back to the hobby shop. Horizian gave them credit for it. I got a REVO. No more flying for me. Even though I would love to.

ROBCAR

My Feedback: (52)

You would be out of your mind to quit flying for that reason.

rabraaten

Wow I can't believe its been over a year since I was on this thread.... Quick update, no pictures today but soon. I lined up the front and rear sections of the fuse and trimmed them to fit nice and snug in a straight line. Its going to be a bit tricky to get the two pieces lined up when I glue them, but I'll take my time and it should be close enough. That's what trim is for isn't it?