viper_bob

Just a little background....

I started with a Zagi 400 as my first plane. Learned to fly and moved to glow for the last couple of years. I like the power and duration of a glow powered plane, but the convenience of an electric is pretty hard to knock.

I bought my son a GWS Tiger moth last year and we've been having a blast flying it around our yard (2 treeless acres of grass). Now we're looking for something a little more exciting for flying around home. The Mustang looks like just the ticket.



I've searched all over RCU and the Ezone and can't seem to find a definitive answer as to how to properly configure a GWS Mustang.

I'm considering one of the GWS flight packs but can't decide which one.

For starters -- are pico or naro servos necessary and/or strong enough or do I need to go for the mini servos.

The flight packs all come with 6 cell packs... is this enough or will I need to build 7 or 8 cell packs to fly this plane properly?

I'm considering running it on either 2 or 3 lithium Ions. Will two be enough? Will 3 cook the speed controller? Can the Lithium IONs take the current draw?


I'd like to here from anyone who has flown this plane and get their comments on their current configuration. What do you like? What would you change?



Thanks.

midnitedew

alot of people have told me that the GWS me-109 is the best warbird from GWS ... you might want to try the e-starter.... its a high-wing with alerons....i hear its a pretty good plane.... so my suggestions would ne the 109, spitfire(which i hear is ok), or the e-starter

lots of people have told me the mustang is hard to get setup right... i.e. CG and everything if you do get the mustang i hear it needs alot of nose weight... i hear these run good on 8.4v 800's

Matt Kirsch

My Feedback: (21)

Be warned that the Mustang is not a step up from the Tiger Moth. It's SEVERAL steps up, like going from a hand-tossed paper airplane to an Extra 300. Lots of people cut their teeth on Tiger Moths, then jumped right to GWS Zeros, and had many problems that they blamed on the plane.

Horizon markets a flight pack specifically for the GWS P-51. It's listed on their website. Just get that one, and keep it simple.

They fly on 6-cell packs, but fly better on 7 or 8-cell packs, from what I've read. However, I would just try it with the battery that comes with the flight pack first, and see. The most highly recommended packs for this type of plane are the 7 and 8-cell, 720mAh NiMH.

When you start talking LiPoly, you have to be specific about WHICH LiPoly, because the battery configuration will change depending on the brand and model. A 2-cell pack will give you the same performance as a 7-cell pack of NiCd.

As far as configuration goes, you need a single 2-cell pack (2S1P) of Etec 1200 cells to fly this plane. They can handle the approximately 8 Amps this motor/prop combination will draw, if you don't fly full throttle all the time. Kokam cells now come in three different types: regular, high discharge (HC), and super-high discharge. You'd need two, 2-cell packs wired in parallel (2S2P) to handle the load, but you still need to manage throttle.

viper_bob

mkirsh,

Are you sure about the performance step size??? The moth is a little more than a paper airplane, and the Mustang is certainly no symetric shoulder wing prop-hangin' Extra.

We'be been flying combat with .25 and .46 sized dogfighters
http://www.rcuniverse.com/gallery/da...ighter-med.jpg


(Avatar shows a launch of the .25) for over a year now. We're just looking for something to fly around home without having to drive 30 minutes to the field. I doubt that the Mustang will pose too much of a challenge.


Thanks for the great info on the LiPoly packs wrt draw. I'll look at the Etecs.

What do you know about Lithium ION cells? All Electronics has 1400mah cells for $5.50, or $5.00 each for 10 or more.

Derek_TX

My Feedback: (1)

The GWS 300C is quite happy with an 8 cell 700-800 mAh NiMH pack. Once you use that size, 6 or 7 cells is a big letdown.

The stock config is good, and nothing special needs to be done CG-wise to use an 8 cell 720 AAA NiMH battery beyond removing enough foam to slide the battery to the foam at the firewall. If you wish, you can add weight and make the CG more forward...or you can just keep the airspeed up and enjoy the maneuverability The plane slows down quite well, but it can get touchy. The GWS P51 is the hardest to land plane I have ever had. Not hard to safely land, but hard as hell to land and look good. The wing loading is excellent at 16 oz AUW and the plane is flying on the wing, unlike many other warbirds which demand high airspeed due to their high WL.

You will need to spend lots of money on LiPos to get 7-10 amps to feed the speed 300 motor. A 3s3p or 2s3p would be needed as a minimum - assuming a 1020 LiPo or bigger. They would give you 6-9 amp draw.

I would think buying a couple 700-800 8 cell NiMH packs would be the way to go. Adequate flying time, reasonable cost. You might even go with 1100 mAh NiMH as the plane can take the extra weight. I think 20 oz will still fly well and not turn it into a brick.

As for the step size between the TigerMoth and the P51, it is relatively large. I think the midwing symmetrical aerobats are on par with the P51 as far as pilot skill demanded... both will go where you point them, whether you know where you are pointing them or not! The Mustang adds some low speed squirrely-ness that seems to come with scale warbirds. On the other hand, the P51 at 16 oz flies somewhat easily for a scale warbird.
... While the TM is ideal to teach someone to fly with... hands off stability. Very different demands on the pilot.

Added:
Li-ions are fine, just a little more care in charging, they explode instead of merely burning like Lipoly's if overcharged. I think 6 1600 li-ions would be fine in it, 2s3p. I have plenty, i think ill make a pack & try it out too.

DougT

My Feedback: (1)

There is a thread titled "GWS Zero problem" in the Park Flyer column that has a few excellent videos of both the P-51 and Zero.

I have the Zero that I was very weight conscious of when building. I sanded off all of the hated little molding bumps and filled with lightweight spackling and painted with thinned latex house paint. With a HECell 8X700 NiMH pack the AUW is 13.5 oz. It flies very well and I would recommend it for intermediate pilots. I'm getting 8 minutes of aggressive flying(loops, rolls, stall turns, chasing seagulls, etc) and about 13 minutes of lazy circles and slow flying. I do have to warn that the correct CG is important and isn't listed correctly in the manual. I'll try to post the correct CG later.

When I get my digital camera working, I'll post a pic on the park flyer column.

Please check out the thread listed above. You will be very impressed.

Doug

E*nealio

My Feedback: (10)

just a quick Q for u guys. I have flown gas planes and electric ducted fans successfully for the past 4 years and love em to death. Now i fly my p-51 in my friends 2 acre back yard(big feild zero trees foot of thin grass) When i first got my p-51 i had a 10 amp ecs and a 7 cell 8.4 350 pack on it. the thing glided for a while. I got a new 300c system from horizon. It will fly but is slow. I cant flip it without stalling and it will only fly at full throttle. I have a futaba 6xa programmed for all my planes and have all the trims at norm for now? Is that my prob. IM thinking about a wattage 370 motor or is that to much? I really wanna fly it on what i have. Any suggestions?

randaddy

I have been flying my GWS Mustang for a while now and just love it!
One thing that I would like to pass on is regarding the problem with assembly and painting of the pre-painted version.
A lot of people are experiencing the same problem that I encountered when using tape to hold the model together during assembly or for masking during additional painting.
On my model I wanted to do a " Tuskegee" paint scheme (Red nose & Tail) but when I tried to remove the paint mask the silver paint lifted with the tape.
So after re-painting the silver I used some very low tack masking tape that is used to transfer vinyl lettering from the backing. The tape is made by a company called "Grafix" and can be found on the web from vinyl sheet supply company's.
This tape works very well and will not lift any paint ! Good Luck[img]

wink

My brother has the mustang and I have the spit, both are very easy to fly but you do need to keep the servo movement down especially on the elevater. Also use explanential on the elevator (50%) and aileron(40%).
The GWS battery's are totally under power and only give a short flight time, we are using 8.4 nmh packs and getting about 10 mins. I would also suggest you dont use the gws RX or speed controller as both have failed on both our planes.
Hope this helps.

hpverhoeven

The GWS Mustang is a great flyer. Ignore the comments on being difficult to fly. I've only been flying a few months and it is a *****cat. BUT. The elevator is super sensitive. Cut the rate right down - maybe half. Get computer radio and either put in half rate or plenty of expo. I've got 50% aireron and 60% elevator!

Don't go with the standard packs they're hopeless. Minimum is an 800mA NimH 7 cell. Adequate for ROG and strained aeros. The problem with these models is that they carry no inertia so diving to gain speed, while of some use is limited. Forward speed in a 5 knot breeze is minimal.

Fit the retracts they are a laugh. The standard GWS retracts are a bugger to fit and very weak so if in doubnt belly land it. But to see it take off with the u/c tucking up nicely in the climb - pass me the kleenex. Hold the stick right back, by the way as she accelerates down the strip or she'll nose over.

If you can get the stronger retracts then do. The linkage takes some sussing out as end points are difficult to get right. I put a link in the rods made from the smallest electrical connectors with the plastic removed. Works a treat. Before you set to work with a knife to carve up your new wing - don't. Only thing suitable is a high speed Dremel type tool with a cylindrical stone grinder. But go steady - one slip and you have expensive packing material. Use standard Naro servo and don't worry about the weight, she'll take it.

Scale flight is superb. The video we did of the Mustang and the Spit looks sooo real.

Mods: Dunno about LiOn batts. shop tells me 3 cells, but its too rich for me.
I'm Going to experiment with 8 cells on the geared motor then a 400, but thats going to add 2Ozs to the nose. Already a tricky takeoff with the prop cutting the grass! Shoud be a screamer in the sky though!

Don't use anything electronic from GWS. It is terrible, glitchy unreliable old tut. Already had 2 bad smashes due to rx and ESC failing. Go for jeti 5 channel RX and Simprop or Extra ESC.

Sum up. GWS ceiling tiles are the best value going. £/fun factor unbeatable. Get 2 in the sky and you've got the ultimate. They never fail to draw attention in the park. They are not park flyers strictly speaking. They will happily complete 'full size' r/c circuits and distances. They are not an advanced flyers model if properly set up (c of g, control movements etc) They do not build in a weekend either if you are going do it carefully and properly the first time.

You will not regret buying the spit or the stang. The 'stang is really good value if you want to fit retracts (none of the others will take retracts despite what the marketing hype says).

Tell me how you get on!

robinson727

[quote]ORIGINAL: Matt Kirsch

Be warned that the Mustang is not a step up from the Tiger Moth. It's SEVERAL steps up, like going from a hand-tossed paper <snip>

Howdy GWS'ers..
I am a newbie on the list and have been flying R/C for many years and I must agree with Matt, it can be a handful. I got ours going yesterday after letting it sit on the shelf partally completed for 6 months, I just didn't think it was going to fly very well and we got caught up in the Speed 280 foamie pizza box fad(lotsa fun) so I didn't finish it. Wrong answer, what fun!! after the initial flight, I cut the battery compartment and slid the batteries forward, set the ailerons up for max throw and mixed the rudder servo (HS 50's) with a "Y" plug so I could use my Focus 3 ch. with "Feather" reciever and Jeti 05 ESC. (it gets a little warm, should use a 110)
Now it has a fantastic roll rate, inverted flight, rolling turns all lots of fun with just a little energy management and beautiful loops. The flight times wide open are only 3-4 min on 7 X 350mah cells with the stock prop but that's enough, I keep a spare pack in my pocket and we fly in the back yard.
Neat design but not for beginners (or us old guys that don't fly much anymore) .
BTW, You guys raved on about the Tiger Moth so I ordered one yesterday from Horizon,
looks like fun and it can go with me on my trips. (I fly for Fedex) I uploaded a picture of my youngest, "Christopher" (5) he came up with the green foamie Alien head we put in it, looks great!

More later,

Al
Memphis TN

fastflyer101

yea i have a question for you I'm 15 and i have been in the Hobbie for a wile and i just got a p51 from gws i already have a tiger and I'm about to fall asleep with it i also have a piper cub on floats with an os 91 four stroke in it i love it. people cant believe how maneuverable it is it is great with inverted flat spins i was just looking to get a more power full electric plane and my dad looked into it and got me the p51 i have not started building it but my plans are to have no landing gear and run on 4 cell lithium poly batteries. i was wondering how exact would you put the cg to what they call for or is it better to be nose heavy or tail heavy.

fiasco-

fastflyer101,

A 4 cell lithium pack would burn up the GWS engines.

fastflyer102

what do you recommend for a battery

nate202

I had a bad experience with my Gws mustang.The problem was that the stock motor did not have enough power.It crashed first flight due to a full power stall.Irecomend getting a speed 400 instead of the 280 that it comes with. Keep in mind that this is a squily plane.Even on some of the lowest throws!

halfmoon129

Yo,

I just got my mustang and put it together and on the first few flights I threw it into the air and it just wobled like I was messing with the ailerons, but I wasnt, and then it just nose dives into the ground from 30 feet. Ive shattered the whole fuselage into pieces before I even got to fly it. so does anyone else have that problem? Is it the weight? Is the motor even powerful enough for it? Also, this is my first time actually building and flying a plane other than an aerobird, so I dont really know how to handle a plane with ailerons. Will someone please help me, tell me everything you know.
THANK YOU

Spdrmnky

I'm tthinking about getting a GWS mustang... Comming from a Watt-age Turbo Hawk... that is all. haha

ACROHUNTER

Hi halfmoon129

I had the same problem with my new P-51, fortunately nothing happened to the airplane because I didn’t gain to much height.

The problem was the battery, I have the P-51 updated with the GW/EPS-350C-C engine running with the GWS BP7N730 AAA BATERIA 8,4 V730MAH NIMH. I charge the new battery with a GP PEAK CHARGER GPMM 3000, the night after the flight, but the battery didn’t catch all the charge, or it loose it during the night. I charge again the battery at the field, and the P-51 flown like dream for 10 min, It needs just a little trim in the elevator, and that’s it. in fact I perform some rolls and inverted flight and was great.
I was worried because a cover the model with to much layers of a very heavy paint, and I use 3 GWS Pico Servos, it weight complete 415 grs, don’t need extra weight to balance it.
It is really a good model, I’m very happy with it. ....

GWR

My Feedback: (31)

I flew my GWS Mustang for the first time yesterday. It needed alot of down trim but flew great otherwise. Mine has the Himax 2015/4100 brushless on a 3 cell Kokum pack. I also have a GWS Zero with the MPJet 25-35/20 on a 3 cell TP pack and it flys good too. If you can, go brushless with these planes. It's worth it. Gary

loading

I have gone through 3 GWS Mustang's so far. And I am getting another. The last one I ran over with my truck (long story). Anyway, me and a couple of friends do combat with them. I did a lot experimenting with motors and gear ratios to try to find the cheapest/most powerful combo. The best I have come up with, is the 350 motor (no timing adjustments) with the "C" gear ratio. Use the 9x7 prop and a 2 cell LiPo. The battery pack needs to handle about nine amps. One of my buddies runs this combo with a 7 cell NiMh pack. But not a AAA. Its the HeCell 1100, I think that they are 1/3 A, but I am not sure on that. His stang is heavyer than mine, but he gets a little more punch at the start of the pack. I use the 1100 and 1300 2 cell Irate packs and also a 1500 Kokam. All of these packs handle the amps fine. The 1100 gets a little warmer, but the others are hardly noticeable. We pretty much run full throttle all the time. If anyone is interested, I could try to remember all the combos I tried, but I have stuck with this combo for a while now. As Acrohunter found out. AAA NiMh are only good for about 6 amps continuos. I am not saying that this is the very best combo, but is a very good combo condisdering cost/power/motorlife.

raggedman

heyo,

I must agree with loading on the best setup for the mustang...i could barely keep it in the air with the stock setup and flight pack and i smashed it to bits first time i tried to fly it... i put it back together but it hung in my office for almost a year collecting dust.
got some 1300 2s thunder power li polys for my e starter and thought... hmmm i wonder... so i resurrected the mustang last week and it now flies beautifully on a 350 c geared c 9x7 prop castle creations Pegasus 35p esc(i know its overkill) and a 2s 1300 li poly i use hitec hs-55 servos and a gws 4rpII rx...so far no problems... squirrelly as heck when u first launch but once u have airspeed its a great flyer....3/4 in in front of the spar is the ideal cg....balance upside down from that point so the plane is slightly nose down for 1st flight and slowly move it back till it balances level or u find the right balance of stability and maneuverability

oistein

My Feedback: (1)

No, it will not if it is configured as 2s2p, wich mean two and to cells serial, and the two serial in paralell. Using f.eks 700mah you will get a 7.4 (nominal) and 1400 mah pack. Actually a good setup for this plane.

Øistein

raggedman

why not just get a 1500 ma 2s pack?