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New Contra Design: Adverrun

Old 02-13-2015, 02:05 PM
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Default New Contra Design: Adverrun

Hi,

about 1 1/2 years ago I started creating and building a new Contra drive for 2m F3A planes. I flew the drive during last year and while the concept proved to work flawlessly it was a bit on the heavy side. In strong winds I also missed a little power.

This winter Robert Hirsch and I joined forces and we re-worked the construction to address the issues. This turned out to be successful and we reduced overall weight to ~770g (w. Props/Spinner) while maintaining a simple (and relatively cheap) construction.. Current increased quite a bit compared to the first design and range from 75A - 95A WOT now on 10s packs depending on Motor kv and Props used.
Robert flys his drive in a Biside (4.7kg) with using Mejzlik Props 22x18 and 22x20 . I'm flying an Addiction using 20.5x20.5 and 20x22.5. Consumption is around 2800-3000mAh / Flight. We have a few (30+) flights on the planes now without any issues.
The next steps will be to decrease belt tension a bit, experiment with props and prop spacing and complete the spinner for my Addiction. If there is interest we may also look into building a small series. Attached are pics of the drive and the Addiction "test bed" :-).

Best
Malte





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Last edited by MalteS; 02-13-2015 at 02:15 PM.
Old 02-13-2015, 11:58 PM
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Congratulations, great work!!! It looks like it works with outrunner motors, which are much cheaper than the Hacker and Neu inrunners. Is it possible to fit a Himax 210?
Old 02-14-2015, 12:21 AM
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Hello, together
here are some pics from my BiSide

best Robert
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Old 02-14-2015, 12:26 AM
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Hi Alex,

the Himax Motor is not possible. You need some Heli Motor with 520-560kv. The Himax Motor is to heavy.

robert
Old 02-14-2015, 12:39 AM
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Thanks Robert. What would be the price for the system (with / without spinners and propellers)?
Old 02-14-2015, 10:59 AM
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We think the price becomes much more favorable than the present systems.
Old 02-15-2015, 04:55 AM
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Hallo Malta, Hallo Robert,

very, very interesting system. Hope, we will get more infos shortly. I have great interest in Your design.

Gerhard
Old 02-15-2015, 05:06 AM
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Do you expect any issues with wear on (what looks like)the nylon gears?
Old 02-15-2015, 05:33 AM
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Gearing looks like a typical high powered heli setup
Old 02-15-2015, 08:40 AM
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Hello together,

i come frome the airfield and i make the next 5 flight without problems. For a P programm i used 2600-2800mAh.
@ Gerhard which information do you need?

And now a new pic from inside
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Old 02-15-2015, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by ltc
Do you expect any issues with wear on (what looks like)the nylon gears?
Hi ltc,

right now I think that the gear will last few hundert flights. But I expect that there will be some wear. I think this is inherent in any geared design.
The gears are comparable to the ones that are found in Helis, although we had to custom made them to get to the RPMs needed.

Best,
Malte
Old 02-17-2015, 12:39 PM
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Hi Robert and Malte,

When Do You think the system will be available.
And when do You think Your price is fixed for the first systems.

Gerhard
Old 02-18-2015, 11:57 AM
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Hello Guys, can you post some video. Im interesting in noise level to comapre it to Brener system. Go on with some price and avaibility.
Thanks.

Ales
Old 02-19-2015, 01:59 AM
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Thanks for all the interest.

Gerhard I wrote you an PN. Seems that you live very close, so you can check the drive in real if you want

Ales the only video I have is on the ground made during testing, Robert did the same, installed in the Biside. It’s nothing particular fancy but I’ve uploaded this to youtube. I’m not totally sure that this can be used for what you’re after, but I can tell you that the sound level is quite comfortable. Please find them below.

We’re in contact with a leading pilot meanwhile and it looks like that he will test and provide feedback. This means we’ll enter a beta phase now to collect feedback. If you’re interested in this process feel free to shoot me an e-mail at [email protected]

I will update the thread with news from that phase.

<span id="docs-internal-guid-1a2c68b7-a144-8c43-302b-3347e47fc2a7"><span style="font-size: 15px; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; background-color: transparent;"> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiF6dzPtJAQ <span id="docs-internal-guid-1a2c68b7-a144-8c43-302b-3347e47fc2a7"><span style="font-size: 15px; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; background-color: transparent;"> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPppaf1hDs8
Old 02-20-2015, 08:15 AM
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That looks very nice.
Mike Mueller
Old 04-06-2015, 11:10 AM
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I just realized that I did not post an update here for quite some time.
I made 4 flights yesterday and logged them and thought this is worth showing. Attached log shows current, capacity and the throttle stick position over the P15 sequence. As shown in the log I'm using about 70-75% throttle on uplines resulting in ~55A. 100% throttle will give an in-flight current of about ~80A (on ground ~90A).

Few other things are worth to mention which happened in the last weeks: We reduced belt tension and also slightly adjusted the pinion gear ratio. The latter mod and mounting the drive on rubber stands brought noise significantly down. Robert did test differnt Mejzlik props 22x18/22x20 to 22x20/22x22. In general all props can be used with ground currents of ~80-95A. The 22x20/22x22 seems to be preferable in windy conditions however.


We also made few drives and no issues showed up so far with the ones in the field. Impression of one drive with a Hacker Motor is attached.








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Last edited by MalteS; 04-06-2015 at 11:22 AM.
Old 04-07-2015, 01:32 AM
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Hi Malte,
is there any chance to show the system on DMFV competition in Berlin at 16. May?
Old 04-07-2015, 01:01 PM
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Hi Hans,

I'm sorry, don't plan to go there.

BR,
Malte
Old 04-26-2015, 06:56 AM
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Default For your eyes guys

The Adverrun contra drive with a Hacker Turnado in my Allure.
Best accessibility and generous installation conditions allow the installation of 6 Soft Mounts.
The result is a really good running noise with tons of power!
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Old 05-17-2015, 01:49 PM
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What is the price? Where do I get one ?
Old 05-27-2015, 10:22 AM
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Hey Matt ,

sorry for my late answer. You can order the Adverrun from us directly. The Price is 850€ up to the 8/1/2015. In the set are the spinner the gear and the engine.

Robert
Old 05-30-2015, 12:06 PM
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My Allure is complete ready and well tested in the meantime.

Now with reinforced gear plate and two add. ribs inside the canopy, autmatical connectors (MPX green) between wings and fuselage and well proven in the meantime.(The new series have a sufficiently strong chassis plate).
Inside very clean without visible cables and with my innovative battery mounting-system.
Flightweight now with Hacker Top Fuel 4150mAh WC Edition ( exactly 900 grams over all) : 4790 grams.
The Adverrun contra with the Hacker A 50 10L Turnado V3 is a "Powerbear"; max. Amps in flight with Mejzlik 22x20/ 22x22 contraprop 78 Amps! Never more then 3000 mAh for P15 at storm; typical 2750 mAh at normal conditions.
And this with tons of power! With a max. throttle point at 60 % (with fixed point at full throttle 1,98 ms at the controller Hacker Mezon 99 light with BEC)., there is no problem in a large upper headwind radius to speed. ( max. BEC Amps in flight were 3,5 Amp. with 2x Futaba 551 at ailerons, 2x Futaba BLS 173 at elevator and 1x BLS 471 at rudder)
The Mejzlik props 22x18 / 22x20 are also good, but the 22x20/22x22 give me at this drive set the optimzed power feeling at each wind condition incl. storm! And the motor is only slightly warm.
All what I could say about the Allure is WOW!
The Allure feels in the air with all advantages of monoplanes and biplanes together!
You promised not too much, Bryan!
Itīs the best F3A plane I ever have flown. (and this were a lot!)
Itīs sooooo good, that I decide to buy for myself an add. Allure as backup model for this and the next season.
More praise I can not pronounce!!
I like this model with itīs outstanding look and performance.

Old 07-24-2015, 02:46 PM
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All what I could say about the Allure is WOW!

Hi SchiBru,
Do you still be friendly with yours WOW or you've got already another contra drive system?


Any news about Adverrun at all? Guys what's happen?
Old 07-25-2015, 03:13 AM
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What is new: We did fly a lot and did not come across real issues. Pilots who've seen us expressed very positive feedback so far. Over the past weeks we have been working on optics with new anodized parts and are busy to build drives.

Robert
Old 07-25-2015, 12:41 PM
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Also adding that we placed some infos in Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/adverrun

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