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New Plettenberg F3A motor

Old 02-10-2010, 05:36 AM
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mola
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Default New Plettenberg F3A motor

Hi guys,

I just got some information from "Deep Throat" about a new Plettenberg F3A motor in development, apparently a direct drive in-runner... Interesting concept. Should be available later this year.
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Old 02-10-2010, 11:25 AM
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Walt Thyng
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

Holy Crap! It'll probably wipe out my modeling budget for the next year, but I'm drooling already (-:
Walt
Old 02-10-2010, 04:40 PM
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Mvelez
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

I just hope deep throat did not lose his job at plettenberg ha ha

looks nice!
Old 02-10-2010, 06:14 PM
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Ryan Smith
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

Sweet!

I'm not so sure I'm crazy about the four prop bolts, however.
Old 02-12-2010, 09:09 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

So what's the scoop? More efficient? Lighter? Cheaper? Why do I need one? Not that I'm not already a devoted Pletty fanatic with multiple thousands invested . . . just wondering what the "angle" is



Joe
Old 02-14-2010, 09:07 AM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

My guess is to provide a in-runner to those that prefer the in-runners over the outrunners? It sure does look kool,...I am just wondering when YS will bridge the gap with a EP power plant of their own? See's like lots of guys are moving to EP these days.


bholsten

Custom Airframes of America, Team Black Magic, Advantage Hobby, Guardian America, Dist. 2 FAI/F3A Champion 2009.
Old 02-14-2010, 12:42 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor



Well in theory you get the best of both worlds, higher efficiency with no maintenance. But with outrunners now days so efficient it doesn't make sense, except in the lab. What is more important today is being different (and not easy copied by the others) therefore it is easier to explain the premium price Plettenberg needs to ask for because of Made in Germany. Don't ask me how I know , but I worked long for a premium car manufacturer!



Velco

Old 02-14-2010, 05:51 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor


ORIGINAL: BHolsten

My guess is to provide a in-runner to those that prefer the in-runners over the outrunners? . . .

bholsten

Perhaps, but it's interesting that this is a direct drive inrunner vs. a geared motor as it is the gears that require the most maintenance. This looks and sounds like the ORK (Out Runner Killer) 17 and 19 series from Neu.

[link=http://www.neumotors.com/Site/1700_series.html]Neu 1700 Series ORKs[/link]

[link=http://www.castlecreations.com/products/neumotors/nm1900.html]Neu 1900 Series ORKs[/link]



Old 02-14-2010, 07:25 PM
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Walt Thyng
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

I thought I read somewhere that inrunners can spin faster than outrunners due to less rotating mass.
Walt
Old 02-14-2010, 09:07 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

ORIGINAL: Walt Thyng

I thought I read somewhere that inrunners can spin faster than outrunners due to less rotating mass.
Walt

My simple understanding is:

brushless outrunner = The magnets rotate outside the windings, which are stationary.

Brushless inrunner = the magnets rotate inside the windings, which are stationary.




So the outrunner spins more mass at a greater distance from center than the inrunner which would explain the faster spin potential for the inrunner.


But, this type of motor looks like the windings and the magnets rotate so I have no idea what kind of animal it is, and I guess I'll have to wait for some of the experts to chime in.
Old 02-15-2010, 05:06 AM
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Magne
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

I thought I read somewhere that inrunners can spin faster than outrunners due to less rotating mass.
That is possible, but not really applicable in this case.
It matters in a geared set-up, where you (may) want the motor to spin at a very high rpm, but in a direct drive application for F3A you still only want about 6000 rpm, which is no problem in either case, inrunner or outrunner.

Cooling is better for an inrunner, though.

Magne
Old 03-14-2010, 01:45 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

More information from "Deep Throat"...

The new Pletti will be named Advance 30/10 and it will have 91% efficiency. To compare, the efficiency of the evo 30/10 is 86% and the soon to be released evo 30/9 two has an efficiency of 88%.


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Old 03-14-2010, 03:51 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

"Deep Throat" just sounds wrong! It sounds like an old X rated movie or something!

Perhaps something is lost in translation? [&:]

It will be very interesting to see how this inrunner goes with direct drive. You have to wonder if it will have enough torque...

Cheers
Jason.
Old 03-14-2010, 04:16 PM
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ExFokkerFlyer
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

"Deep Throat" was the nickname given to the source inside the Nixon administration that provided information to Woodward and Bernstein (Washington Post newspaper reporters) that uncovered the Watergate scandal.

Of course there was an X rated movie that came out around that time... I'm sure that one does not have to do with the other

Interested in the motor, unfortunately that picture doesn't tell me anything about it! Which is why it was released I'm sure..

Tom M
Old 03-14-2010, 04:24 PM
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Jason Arnold
 
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

G'day Tom,

ORIGINAL: ExFokkerFlyer

''Deep Throat'' was the nickname given to the source inside the Nixon administration that provided information to Woodward and Bernstein (Washington Post newspaper reporters) that uncovered the Watergate scandal.

Of course there was an X rated movie that came out around that time... I'm sure that one does not have to do with the other

Tom M
There was also that Bill Clinton and Monica Lowinski scandal too. Now that was real "Deep Throat" Classic!

Back to the motor.... Yes, the pics are obviously to get people wondering.. The new Hacker Q80 also looks interesting. The Q80 is due for release next month.

Cheers
Jason.
Old 03-14-2010, 05:15 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor


ORIGINAL: Aussie_Knife_Edge

It will be very interesting to see how this inrunner goes with direct drive. You have to wonder if it will have enough torque...

Cheers
Jason.
Its a big diameter inrunner.
Old 03-14-2010, 05:26 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

"Its a big diameter inrunner. "

That will help with torque.... Do you know how much it will weigh Chad?

Cheers
Jason.
Old 03-14-2010, 05:40 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

No, I just know the size, but I would not be surprised if its lighter than the Evo.
Old 03-24-2010, 04:19 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

More news...

The Advance 30/10 is being tested presently, and compared to the evo 30/9 two the pilot has 15% more power. The Advance 30/10 weighs 550grams, and since the power levels are so high they are now thinking about designing a smaller version of the Advance that should weigh below 500 grams. Interesting stuff.
Old 03-24-2010, 05:35 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

Hi Morten, is there any info on the availability of a vectorthrust solution for the advance as available for the 30/10 now. Yesterday started testing with the vectorthrust. It seems to have a lot of potential.

This EVO 30/9 is this just a higher Kv version of the 30/10 or a very different design?
Old 03-24-2010, 11:40 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

What is the price point of this motor?

Has anyone yet tested the similar Neu direct-drive inrunners?
Old 03-25-2010, 02:43 AM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

Hi Hans,

Yes, they plan to do Vector Thrust for the Advance series as well.

The Xtra 30-9 EVO II is an optimised version of the Xtra 30-10 EVO with lower internal resistance and higher efficiency. According to the data I have seen the KV is identical to the 30-10 EVO, so you can use the same prop types.


I don't know what the price will be for the Advance, but it should be available in 3 months.
Old 03-26-2010, 07:39 AM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

Some more details, sorry its in German, maybe someone can translate. You can get the gist with google translate, but its not 100%!
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Old 03-26-2010, 11:44 AM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

Translation of Advance 30-10 text:

Standing still is going backwards therefore we constantly work on moving forwards. The result is in this case taken literally: Advance – Moving forwards!

While other motor manufacturers are busy copying our proven technology this motor for F3A aerobatic airplanes goes a completely different way. The revolutionary construction combines the advantages of the out-runner and the in-runner. The main advantage comes from the laminated rotor that optimises the operation at partial load.

Due to the reversal of the - for out-runners - typical SPS winding system these advantages have also been integrated into this propulsion system. An internal fan wheel optimises the cooling of the rotor and the winding. The efficiency could be raised considerably compared to normal F3A motors and is at 91%! All this at a weight of 565 grams. A stable 12mm hollow shaft ensures outstanding stiffness. The in-runner is easy to install in the fuselage. A technical stroke of genius: Advance – always a step in front.
Old 03-26-2010, 12:14 PM
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Default RE: New Plettenberg F3A motor

Translation of Xtra 30-9 Evo II text:

The Xtra 30-9 Evo II is developed on the basis of the Xtra 30-10 Evo - the leading electric motor in F3A. The motor is modified in accordance with the newest knowledge in the area and hence brought up to date.

This means that the magnetic system has been optimised further and the number of winding turns has been reduced. This has the effect of reducing the internal resistance while increasing the efficiency and at the same time the performance has been increased.

The running speed of the new motor has not changed compared to its predecessor, meaning that the same prop sizes can be used.

The motor is designed for aerobatic models up to 6 kilograms and 10S Lipo's or scale models up to 8 kilograms. The idle speed is 225 rpm/V, and the maximum prop size is 22”.

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