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Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

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Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Old 04-30-2010, 06:58 PM
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2Sunny
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Default Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Just a quick comparison note as I flew 8 flights today switching back and forth between these two controllers. As always bear in mind that this is one person's OPINION and experience and I'm simply sharing to illicit further discussion as well as inform those interested in either or product. I am NOT trying to put down or promote anything . . . just sharing my thoughts


Anyways, . . .

I prefer the Jeti by far.

Why . . .

The Castle:

1) Seems to produce less power.

This is totally subjective as I don't have hard data on this, but honestly the "feel" between the two controllers was radically different in terms of power that I seemed to experience. The most dramatic sense came at full throttle which I hit numerous times on the Castle, but never even came close on the Jeti. At first I thought it was related to "fixed end-points" for which my Castle was set vs. "Auto end-points" for which my Jeti was set for, but even after changing that parameter the "feel" remained.

2) Makes funny noises.

The Castle has several annoying and as yet unexplained noises for my ears. The first is already reported and is a banging related to higher sample rates on the data logger. The second is a subtle, but perceptible whining or singing. The third is an ever so slightly rough engine sound, and the fourth is the squelch noise when braking is in effect and you add power. I played with numerous settings today including throttle and brake ramp speed. I did significantly reduce the brake squelch noise, but it did NOT go away entirely. The Jeit on the other hand produces a motor noise that is absolutely whisper quiet and no noise what so ever even with hard braking engaged.


The Jeti:

1) is cheaper.
2) is lighter
3) makes a motor that is as quiet as a mouse.
4) seems to produce more power.


Obviously, the power question can be solved by testing the RPM using a 3rd party RPM gauge, but that will have to wait for another day.


Anyways, that's it for today


Joe
Old 04-30-2010, 08:00 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Having switched between the two a few times myself I noticed that I had to adjust my thottle curve considerably. The Castle produces the same amount of power, but in the mid range you have to adjust the curve to achieve the same feel as the Jeti. My Jeti set up is almost linear. Castle, is not... Stick at half is about 70% throttle.
Old 04-30-2010, 08:08 PM
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underdw
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

I probably shouldn't reply - as this is 3rd party info, but.....
A friend of mine with the Castle and MonsterPower motor ($45 and runs great) in an EMotion flew for weeks at low timing. His plane seemed less powerfull than my Shulte/Pletty/Emotion setup. He went to the mid timing setting and claims a huge increase in power.
(we think the MonsterPower is a copy of the AXI)
Old 04-30-2010, 09:58 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

ORIGINAL: ExFokkerFlyer

Having switched between the two a few times myself I noticed that I had to adjust my thottle curve considerably. The Castle produces the same amount of power, but in the mid range you have to adjust the curve to achieve the same feel as the Jeti. My Jeti set up is almost linear. Castle, is not... Stick at half is about 70% throttle.

I would think that that could have explained a great deal of the "feel"!

Definitely worth checking out next week. Thanks for the input.



on another totally separate note that is almost worthy of a separate thread . . .




I also flew one flight today with the Jeti Spin 75, and what I experienced was a thermal cutout.

I was flying about 4 minutes in and I noticed something wasn't 100% right, but it came back quickly so I wasn't sure. Then about another 30 secs in I had a definite loss of power to where I came across the field in front of me in "slow down" mode and recovered to normal power so I played with it for another minute or so to be sure having some confidence about what was happening. When I brought the plane down I put the Spin Box on the controller and found a measured temp of 103 degree C where the limit was 100. Then talking with my buddy and mentor Chris tonight he mentioned that he believes Jim O. had had a similar experience and solved the problem by adding a heat sink to the Jeti Spin 75. I realize this is buried in a thread not mentioning the 75 but there it is . . . another tiny iota of info for the web




Joe
Old 05-04-2010, 03:52 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

One pro for the Castle:

Cooling is not as critcal as the Jeti. I installed an Emcotec safety switch over the weeked which forced me to move the location of my Jeti. Today on my first flight the Jeti hit soft cutout due to overtemp, and when I brought it down and tested it with my fancy new [link=http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=DYN2529]Infrared Thermometer[/link] I got a reading of 167.3 degrees Fahrenheit [X(]. I had the Castle in a position similar to the Jeti, but it never overheated because it has that massive heatsink to help dissipate heat.



BUT,


And I know folks will find this hard to believe, but I assure you the information is accurate . . .



I removed the shrink wrap and changed the location of the controller to a spot where it would receive constant airflow and the new temperature was 85 or 86 degrees Fahrenheit for the next 8 flights. It was in the mid 70's outside so this means the controller was staying pretty close to ambient temperature. The whole point is certainly obvious to all you old pros, but as always I'm still learnin' as I go. So now I understand how critical placement is for some esc's



















Old 05-04-2010, 05:50 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

I just posted directions and a picture of how I mount a heat sink on my Jeti 77 controllers in the 'electric crappola' thread.

Woodie

Post #19 http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_97...tm.htm#9710624
Old 05-04-2010, 06:22 PM
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2Sunny
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Great stuff, Woodie. Thanks for sharing!

Do you know if this is the heat sink you used: [link=http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102856]RadioShack TO-220[/link]?



Joe
Old 05-04-2010, 07:53 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

No, the one in your link has the fins linked together, but I don't think it would matter as long as it was close to the right size. The size listed in the specs for that heat sink shows it as being very small. Anything that fits will probably work quite well. I just opted for the one I used due to the light weight.

Woodie
Old 05-05-2010, 09:58 AM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

This Hyperion heat sink should work well. http://www.aircraft-world.com/shopexd.asp?id=4434
Old 05-05-2010, 08:12 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.


ORIGINAL: wingster

This Hyperion heat sink should work well. http://www.aircraft-world.com/shopexd.asp?id=4434

Sometimes I'm amazed at all the great equipment available from Hyperion; thanks for the link!



Now back to our regularly scheduled programming . . .


I'm beginning to not like my Jeti so much. C. Moon originally set my throttle curve for a nice match with a 20.5x 14 RASA, but lately I've been flying the 20 x 15 and liking the extra speed when I want it, but the problem was the old mid-range on my throttle was too much with the 20 x 15 so I wanted to adjust the throttle curve down. I made the change on my TX but the effect on the performance was bizarre. Mid range barely kept the plane flying and I needed to go to 3/4 throtttle before I got the response I was expecting. At first I tried some minor adjustments with the TX settings. Next I tried using full power on T/O to set the endpoints, but nothing worked until I went back to the original throttle curve. So tonight I did some reading and found the post:


[link=http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12687595&postcount=4]Jeti Advance Endpoint Setting[/link]


Is this right? I need to hold full throttle for several seconds to reset the endpoints? Is there some thread, booklet, or person that can explain endpoints in details?


Thanks as always,



Joe
Old 05-05-2010, 09:54 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

G'day Joe,

I'm not sure if you can do it with the Jeti Advance but with the Spin 99 I use fixed endpoints. I set low to 1.12mS and high to 2.0mS.

Cheers
Jason.
Old 05-05-2010, 10:08 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.


ORIGINAL: 2Sunny

I'm beginning to not like my Jeti so much. C. Moon originally set my throttle curve for a nice match with a 20.5x 14 RASA, but lately I've been flying the 20 x 15 and liking the extra speed when I want it, but the problem was the old mid-range on my throttle was too much with the 20 x 15 so I wanted to adjust the throttle curve down. I made the change on my TX but the effect on the performance was bizarre. Mid range barely kept the plane flying and I needed to go to 3/4 throtttle before I got the response I was expecting. At first I tried some minor adjustments with the TX settings. Next I tried using full power on T/O to set the endpoints, but nothing worked until I went back to the original throttle curve. So tonight I did some reading and found the post:


[link=http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12687595&postcount=4]Jeti Advance Endpoint Setting[/link]
That message was written by Woodie... he gave you the info on the heatsink. I'm using that exact same controller, Joe... and I have not had any problems with it. Have you set your ATV settings to what Woodie recommends? I haven't put a curve on mine - it is linear - and with a 20.4x14 the throttle control is just like I want it.
Old 05-05-2010, 10:20 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Hey guys,


Thanks for the input!


Woodie was certainly the one who gave the excellent input on heat sinks, but I just wanted to say thanks for the link to the Hyperion option, and as to the fixed endpoints option sadly it's not available on the Jeti Advanced series only on the Spin series. At the recommendation of others on the site I'm planning on testing my 12X tomorrow using my Spin box to see what the actual output of the TX is in terms of ms. I expect to find that zero throttle = 1.1 ms or so and max is 1.8 ms, but we'll see. In addition, I've done some more reading tonight, and finally I'm beginning to realize that any controller using auto endpoints requires a sustained full throttle input to find "THE endpoint" and adjust accordingly so now I understand why friends "in the know" prefer fixed endpoints and honestly based on the information I have on hand right now I have to agree.


Thanks again,


Joe the School House Neophyte Drinking from a Fire Hose
Old 05-05-2010, 10:32 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Joe,

The reason I use fixed end points is to get a consistant setting. This is important when you have an idle setting for a spin or stall turn flight mode etc. I found that the auto set was very inconsistant with regards to an idle.

Cheers
Jason.
Old 05-05-2010, 10:39 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Hey Jason,


Yep, I think I'm beginning to figure that out tonight. So why didn't you just tell me last week: "Hey you moron, auto endpoints are not efficient for F3A applications; go with fixed endpoint controllers"!?


Just kidding of course, and thanks for the input



Joe
Old 05-05-2010, 11:17 PM
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Default RE: Jeti 77 Advance Pro Opto vs Castle ICE 80 HV.

Joe, You can actually use 'fixed' end points on the non Spin Jeti controllers. About 3 yeaars ago, and after a lot of fumbling around trying to get consistency from throttle response, I emailed Jeti with a lot of questions. After a series of emails with Jeti I finally understood how the non Spin controller uses the default endpoints and the auto endpoints. When you power up a non Spin Jeti, it defaults to 1.1ms and 1.8ms as the low and high end points. What this means is it will 'arm' when it sees a signal less than 1.1ms and it 'assumes' 1.8 is the high end. If it sees a high end signal of more than 1.8ms for about 4 seconds, it will reset the high end to match the higher ms signal. That is why you see people doing full throttle runups on the ground, to set the high end. However, if you set your TX to limit the high end to 1.8ms, you will never override the default condition and there is no need to do full throttle runups on the ground. I have run my Jetis this way for over 3 years and never had any issues with throttle response being inconsistent. Basically, if you use this approach with a non Spin Jeti, you have 'fixed' end points.

Woodie


ORIGINAL: 2Sunny

Hey guys,


Thanks for the input!


Woodie was certainly the one who gave the excellent input on heat sinks, but I just wanted to say thanks for the link to the Hyperion option, and as to the fixed endpoints option sadly it's not available on the Jeti Advanced series only on the Spin series. At the recommendation of others on the site I'm planning on testing my 12X tomorrow using my Spin box to see what the actual output of the TX is in terms of ms. I expect to find that zero throttle = 1.1 ms or so and max is 1.8 ms, but we'll see. In addition, I've done some more reading tonight, and finally I'm beginning to realize that any controller using auto endpoints requires a sustained full throttle input to find ''THE endpoint'' and adjust accordingly so now I understand why friends ''in the know'' prefer fixed endpoints and honestly based on the information I have on hand right now I have to agree.


Thanks again,


Joe the School House Neophyte Drinking from a Fire Hose

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