What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Hey guys, i have been looking at pattern birds for awhile now and have no idea what to look for in a go one. i was trying to deside from a Krill spark and a CARF , or just going with a cheaper wood model. so hard to deside.what i do know is i would love to use a countra rotating motor. but which one? i have looked at a few and himax has some nice ones but not sure about power to weight. i do not plan on competing just to have fun with it. and work on my prescision. so what are some thought? should i just find a used one?

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

well if you have a budget for one of those, I say go for it, or look at the Vanquish, not quite as expensive,

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Right now the only viable contra setup is brenners.

The valiant and spark have both made weight with the setup.

If you want a spark....getbwith dave snow...he has a contra I believe.

If money is not an issue.....oxai.

Also consider the sebart wind s pro

Chuck

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

You could also wait for the SebArt Mythos, when it is available. Put a 10s set-up in there and you might have a winner

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

A Mythos... Really? would it be better than a  Spark or valiant? thats funny because i was looking at the mythos and almost laid down a pre order on it. THat is what got this whole thing started. with me. i always wanted a pattern plane and i've had small and cheap ones before. and i thought it is time to actually get a decent set up. and maybe start competing with it. i have no plans to compete but if the plane becomes a common flyer for me i don't see me not competing.

I had the pleasure to fly a krill spark once and the smoothness with the crisp manuvers mixed with great electric power amazed me. but at the time thought it was too much to spend on something. so i bought a spot-on frome world models. which flew well but no contest on the spark.

do you think a CR set up is worth it, and Does EF and sebart hang with the best of em. they seem to be the best choice of wood models.

thanks so much for your replys.</p>

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

I don't know if a Mythos is better then a Spark or Valiant. I have owned and flown a Spark, but i have no comparison with a Mythos. When i look at the Mythos it has all the features of a modern pattern-plane at a reasonable price. If i had to choose? I'd wait for the Mythos

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

henry, very nice i think you may be right.  i think the best thing about sebart is that they give a great recommended set up so you don't have to modify the plane anyway for a great out of the box plane. thanks for your imput. the mythos outs the vanquish. for sure.

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

The Mythos is not a full 2m. Plane. It is slightly smaller. The Vanquish is hard to beat for the money. I love my Wind S Pro. The Nuance is also a very nice plane. Unless you fly FAI you will notice very little difference in any of the newer 2m planes.

Arch

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

the Nuance does look like a pretty nice plane but it really just looks like another sickle and the price is high for what it is. 1800usd. but i think your right about they probably all fly about the same. i think it comes down tho personal preferance and what kinda deal you can get for the quality. thanks arch

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Exactly. The Sickel and Nuance fly nothing alike and the Nuance is much bigger and nicer.


Arch

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

thas good to here it not another sickel. they totally over built that plane and made it a pig. my buddy bought 2 of em to compete and had tons of trouble making weight. and he showed be a huge list of planes for all different prices that were actually the same exact plane. sold by different companys. i fugured the Nuance was another. since it looks pretty siimilar (just going by memory  at the moment)

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

I have yet to see a Nuance even close to the weight limit. That really surprises me on the Sickel. Everyone I have seen have all been comfortably underweight with no real effort. The Nuance is a totally different plsne from BJ craft. Great finish and better flying. If I wasn't running the NATS this year I would have a pair of them.

Arch

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

that neat to know, i was just looking at them and some of the others they got. do you know a dealer who carrys em. i only found one of those strange sites that will contact a dealer.

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

All of the BJ Craft stuff is carried by F3A unlimited in the US and Bondaero in Europe.

The 2m Monolog and the Prolog are also worth a look

http://www.f3aunlimited.com/webstore...dex&cPath=8_70


www.bondaero.co.uk

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

thanks, that site has almost a ton of stuff.

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

the Nuance  made my top 5 list. thankks Arch, i have done some research and it seems to be great set up. perfect for todays equipment.

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

I wonder what that top 5 list looks like ;-)

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

the usual suspects I presume.....

Volkert

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

what are the usual?;)

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Will F3A Unlimited be at Toledo this year?

RC

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

don't see them on the list

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Well my list may be strange but theese are my pics

1. Krill Spark Evo
2. CARF Valiant
3. BJ Nuance
4.Toxiris
5. CARF Integal 
 not in any order i would gladly fly any of these. the top 3 are basically tied in my opinion.

and hanging on the list just simply for budget is
CARF Impact
E.F. Vanquish

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Maybe should be a new thread, good question.

Here is mine:

1. Krill Spark Evo 2
2. Nuance
3. CA Visa
4. Sebart Wind S with contradrive
5. Nice Oxai, but which one?

Volkert

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

If money is not an option, here is my list:

1 Krill Spark evo
2 Axiome
3 MissWind with contradrive
4 Leviosa
5 Mythos

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

looks like the spark evo is common choice in the lists. I took CA models and sebart out of my running just because of lack of experiance with the company. it appears ca is older style and sebart is the exact oposite adding all theese littl pieces to their planes like foamies, looks easy to break all that little stuff off . i have flown a nitro CA models pattern ship and it was ok. really didn't seem much better than my cheapy world models spot on.  but i will say the mythos is cool and the wind-s- is probably the most popular plane sold. i do have a budget not a low budget but refuse to spend over 2k on a airframe. makes sense ?

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

The more important question is what do you want it to do? Spending more, doesn't mean you get a better plane for the lower classes. Many of the planes in that list are designed to play at the highest levels, which doesn't necessarily mean they do the lower classes better. The Krill's are very nice planes and fly VERY well, but they are very expensive, and are much more complex than other choices. For most pilots out there, you would have a hard time telling a difference between a Vanquish, Osiris, or any of the more expensive planes, except you could build 3 Vanquishes for the cost of the kit for the Krill, and really see no value added. Most pilots wont keep a plane for than 3 years, so if you are just starting out, by the time you get to needing a top level FAI design that one you have now will be out of choice anyway. I have flown, and have watched the Vanquish fly FAI, and it will hold its own when setup right. I flew mine in Masters contests last year and scored as well as I did with my Wind S Pro. If you want to spend close to 5K for a Krill or whatever, feel free, but it certainly isn't necessary and it really wont give you any extra value over the much lower priced planes unless you are playing at the top 15 level in FAI at the NATS. You are better off with a lower prices plane with the best equipment you can buy, and then getting a second one setup exactly as a backup. I hate seeing guys spend a fortune to get into pattern, and then get frustrated once they realize that the plane is only part of the equation. Dollars don't always translate to flying better.

Just my opinion,

Arch

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

you are very informative Arch and you are right. i agree with all that you said.  i can get a great deal on carf  planes so it really would be too much more than a vanquish. i think both are very good.

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

ok this is what i have desided. im probably going with a carf as long as i get the deal i want or a spark new or used. the vanquish will be 3rd pick if i cant find a good used spark evo.  i think this will be the way to go. thanks for all the help desiding. the the nuance is very nice and so is the toxiris they would be in the running as well.  the cr set up has a cool factor but the advantages arn't really big enough to go with .  thaks

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Glad to help. Just hate seeing guys throw money at something that really doesn't benefit them for what they are doing.

Arch

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

I see you are in Ohio, I am the District 4 VP and would be glad to help you in any way requuired. Just PM me and we can chat. We also have a great pattern group here in the Cleveland area, it might be worth making the 45 minute to an hour drive to join us during a few practice sessions. You will learn a ton flying with other pattern pilots.

Just give a shout.

Anthony
[email protected]

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

AAbdu, i think that would be a ton of fun. i'll have to get with you then we have a nice day. i snt you my number so you can call anytime you plane to go out and fly.

thanks

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

anyone familar with a gator rc g-202 f3a plane?

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

It's about 10 years old. They were from the time when F3A and IMAC almost collided, and pattern planes were getting very 'scaley'

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

is it worth getting to start pattern or go with a more modern set up?

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

It would get you started in Pattern, that's for sure.

However, for a somewhat longer horizon (i.e. capable of flying the more advanced sequences later) you'd be better off sticking with your original list and going with electric propulsion. You'll be able to find a lot of help with electric set-ups, and electric is a lot easier on airframes and servos.

All my Humble Opinion, of course.

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

littledevile

I fly pattern planes though I do not compete, I just like to fly them as they fly so well. I started with a second hand Sebart Angel 50 with the stock motor / controller and 6S battery. Unless you are already a very good pilot this model will do anything you can. I then decided I would like something a little bigger and moved up to a Sebart Wind 110 again on 6S. ( This allowed me to stick with my simple charger etc.) I liked the 110 a lot as being bigger it presented better in the air and flew fine except in very windy conditions when I felt it was a bit underpowered.

I eventually crashed the Wind 110, and although the fuselage was in two pieces and one wing tube was pulled out of one wing, I repaired it and it still flew well, it is still flying with a friend who has damaged and repaired it again. After the Wind I decided to go full 2 meter and bought a Shinden all composite at a very good price (under $900) I also had to buy a decent charger (Cellpro 10S) new motor / controller and 10S battery packs. There was more work to do the install than the wooden models as the motor mount is not pre-prepared and some thinking, cutting and glueing is required! The Shinden flew very well too although at my skill level I don't think it flew better than the wind 110, when I eventually crashed that too all I had left was a bag of fiberglass! Composite models do not repair easily.

I have now gone back to a new Wind 110 this time on 8S with more power and less amps. Love flying it still and If I go back to a 2 metre I would only buy a wooden one i.e, a Vanquish 2M or an Osiris, I suspect both of these will fly on 8S if you are not into competition flying but I would always take advice from RC Pattern on such matters. You should be able to put a Wind 110 in the air for around $1,000 including motor / controller, servos, charger and some battery packs.

In short I would not advise you to jump straight into pattern with a full house 2M competition model. If you have not flown mid-sized electric models you need to get on the learning curve a bit lower down and get used to battery charging and management etc. I would suggest a Wind 110, but if you inssist on 2M I would follow Arch's advice and get a Vanquish. Therer are build threads on here that you can read for both the Vanquish and the Wind 110.

Best regards and good luck.

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

thanks guys so much, i came across a custom gator 202 with a plettenburg motor and thought it may be pretty good for the price.  but had heard nothing about them before. im on the prowl for a good  2m.
john you are right about composite being more work than a wood model for sure. i currently fly 3, 3m carf areobatic planes and 2 krills. i just love the nice painted finish with no chance of wrinkles. and the rigidness of the airframe makes crisp manuvers at any speed.  and i learned on electrics and have had upto a 35% in electric. i agree you need some a decent charger to persue larger electrics, and good timing to get the right amount of batterys charged before you have to be at the field.  good advise. i guess my search continues. thanks

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

Littledevile

Sorry, I did not realise you were already an experienced electric flyer.

John

RE: What to do? 2m Patternship
 

oh no that is ok, John. i love to see good ingo. even if it dosn't help me it can help someone else reading along. thanks again