martno1fan

hi im thinking of buying a gws model for my next plane id like to buy the spitfire but ive only flown an aerobird 3 channels .would i be ok getting a spitfire or would i be better with the pt 17?.
has anyone flown them and are they good flyers ?.ANY ADVICE WELCOME!!.
i know the tiger moth or easy start would probably be easier but these dont do it for me.

Matt Kirsch

My Feedback: (21)

IMHO, neither is a good choice for a second plane. You'd be much better served by an E-Starter, to get used to a more responsive plane before going to extremely responsive planes like the Spit or Stearman. It may not "do it for you," but you have to learn to walk before you can learn to run.

martno1fan

somehow i knew youd say that !!.but hey i bow to youre superior knowledge mate,maybe ill rethink my next step before i decide!!
but theres a saying in england used by the SAS!!who dares wins !!!,so maybe ill take the plunge!!.but thanks for the advice.

WolfeWind

The Spitfire is definitely an advanced airplane - I think you would have just about zero chance of flying her successfully anytime too soon.

The Stearman is also pretty twitchy - one of the most dificult bipes I have flown. If you want to go straight to 4 chanel without going through a trainer plane, then the Moth 400 might be your best bet. The Moth is far more stable thant the Stearman, and will fly reasonably slowly, so you might have a chance with her.

However, even a 3 chanel plane like the Beaver will be much quicker than what you are used too. The E-Starter with a 350 C in her is a fine airplane, and may well be your best bet.

martno1fan

cheers for the reply wolfman ,im starting to think along the same lines myself after reading up on these planes.i think the e-starter is my best bet plus i can use all the gear out of it when i am ready to move onto the stearman.would you suggest the stearman be4 the spit? maybe the e-starter would be best.can you give me any info on how she flies?.plus is the transmitter from gws a good kit?.any advice is welcome!!.

WolfeWind

If you use a 350C motor - not the 400 - the E-Starter is quite lively. She will loop, roll and will even fly inverted figure eights, though those are not easy with the wing dihedral. She is quick and agile - much quicker than your Challenger - though not any faster overall. The is a good transition plane from RTF's and especialy from the Challenger.

The Stearman is a jumpy little devil - I would almost rate her an advanced airplane. The Moth 400 tracks a lot better than the Stearman.

All low wing warbirds are a handful - they are far quicker than than the ABC and do nothing to help you out. They are extremely pitch sensitive and very hard to control unless they are almost perfectly set up.

The E-Starter will be a very different flying experience than you are having now with the Challenger. She will be much more responsive. The aileron control will enable her to handle very differently than what you are used to.

Lots more info on the ES and most of the other GWS planes at www.novellahub.com. The discussions there are organized by airplane, so it's easy to pick a plane and get lots of info on it. There are several guys flying most of the planes you are talking about. Most of us started with the ABC or FBC around a year ago - there are also several that are right about where you are in experience. You would be welcome to join us over there if you want.

WolfeWind

Forgot one of your questions.

I would suggest this order of progression...

1. E-Starter
2. Moth 400 or Stearman
3. Formosa
4. any low wing warbird

Stay away from the 400 motors - all of the above will fly well on a 350C 10 amp system - the 400 motors don't have enough rpm's to give you the airspeed to fly aileron planes well. If you move up to 2-cell lipos all of the above will fly very well on 350C motors and 9070 props. Top speed on any of them won't really be much faster than what you are used to, but each step in the progression gets more responsive (quicker), less forgiving, and a bit harder to fly. However, if you can fly the one just before it in the progression well, you have a reasonable chance of moving up the ladder without making any leaps that will crush you. Anotherword, each move up will press the edge of your skill range, but not so much that you have little chance of success.

martno1fan

thanks for the advice ,its very much appreciated .looks like its the easy starter for me then!!!
you say stick with the 350c motor ?,ive read a lot of guys say to go with a 400 motor.
so can you tell me the pros and cons of 350 vs 400etc.

WolfeWind

The 400 motor is more durable than the 350 because itis turning less rpm's. It is also drawing more amps though. The 350 motor turns more rpm's, therefore is cabable of delivering a higher top speed. The 350 also weighs about an ounce less than the 400.

My advice to you is to stay at 10 amp and below power systems for awhile. You can fly a lot of planes on that "current range" that will be appropriate for you as you bring your skill level up to intermediate and advanced.

Since the 400 motor turns slower, your planes will have a lower top speed, but more thrust. On some planes that is a good thing. But on aileron planes planes a certain amount of speed is required to make the aileron control function properly. For a lot of reasons the 350 is better, I think. I have flow all of the planes I listed on 350C motors and they all flew very well. At the same time, I have heard many complaints about the 400 motor on those same airplanes.

This is a pretty simplified explanation - obviosly prop selection, battery and other things will have an impact on the performance of any motor. However, in my experience it is very hard to beat a 350C or B motor, a 9070 prop, and a 2-cell lipo's in any plane that weighs less than about 16 to 18 oz. Most GWS planes will build at under 16 OZ AUW with a lipo battery.

martno1fan

once again thanks for your advice ,ive made my decision now and im goin to order the e starterso thanks again for your help.

martno1fan

ive seen the e-starter from gws with a 370 carb motor is this a good choice,or is the 350c better?.it sounds a good deal at £ 133.00.for the full package!!.
but i wasnt sure about the motor as you said the 350c or b was the best once again thanks in advance wolf!!!.

WolfeWind

I have better luck with the 350 C than any other GWS motor. You can fly jst about any GWS kit well with that one, and it works very well with 2s lipo's if you want to upgrade.

3rcfreaks

Hi
i started with a gws cub, its a great first plane. Then i bought a gws spitfire, and it was a mistake. I never got it in the air at all.
I then bought a gws easy trainer and a gws tiger moth. the easy trainer is a great plane, easy to fly and control. the tiger moth is harder and i did have to repair it a few times so far. i still love flying the cub, because i run a gear drive 350 with 1080 prop and 9.6 battery. it is neat and i found out you can fly it inverted also. i also have a bb goose made from a company called q jet. http://www.qjet.com/Airplane_goose.asp
it called for a direct drive 400, but i put in a castle 35 brushless controller and a golden horizon brushless engine with a gws 6030 prop.
i flew it yesterday and it is great. never flew over 1/4 thottle and it was 3 times faster then the easy trainer. good luck with whatever you choose but i would recomend the cub for first time and then the easy trainer, maybe one of these days i will try the spitfire again with better luck

martno1fan

thanks for the input mate i appreciate any help i can get at the moment!!.

BuzzBomber

My Feedback: (4)

Wolfewind, I don't mean to pick on you, but have you flown an aerobird or seen one fly? They're surprisingly fast; a few kids at my club field learned on them this past year. A stock GWS Beaver would have to dive to catch an aerobird in level flight, and would probably lose the wings due to flutter in the process. That said, I agree with you that the E-starter on a 350C drive would be a good step up for our buddy martno1fan.

A.T.A.C.

Have you considered Mountain Models' Magpie? That seems to be a very good second plane and an aileron trainer (www.mountainmodels.com). BTW, the Challenger becomes a lot more responsive and quick when the control lines are pulled to the lowest holes. You may maximize your Challenger while building your next plane. After 10+ planes I still enjoy flying my ABC. Good luck and happy flying!
Atac

lwien

Just an fyi here guys. I fly a 400 E-Starter and it flies just fine. Better than fine on a tp1320 2s Lipo. I've heard someone say here that with the 400, the plane will not fly fast enough. Hooey................The plane will scoot just fine. Mine will take off in less than 5 feet and climb with authority at a 45 degree angle and will reach a couple hundred feet in altitude in a matter of seconds. I cruise it around at nothing more than a quarter to half throttle and can do loops from level flight at half throttle.....no problem. I find no need to have any more speed, but if I needed it, it is there.

The key to flying a 400 E-Starter is using a 2s Lipo................I haven't flown the E-Starter using the 350, but I can't imagine it flying any better than what mine does. I really couldn't ask any more from that little cessna look-a-like.

Mellemel

Mart, I have flown both the Stearman and Moth 400, both flew great with stock 400 motors then upgraded to Himax brushless.
The stock 400 brushed motors don't last long if you use Li-po's all the time.
The stearman is tailheavy I needed to slap on that GWS clay that they include but it tracked very straight never twitchy at all in fact I found it a very docile flying plane. If you can fly ailerons you could fly the Stearman however the Moth is a great flying bipe. I have 2. You can fly them around the field at half throttle just cruising doing low passes, very predictable.
I don't have a Spitty but I fly the GWS P51 which is well fast on brushless. It's a real tiger by the tail once tamed though it's a lot o' fun.
The GWS Corsair was the first low wing I tried which I stuffed loads of times but my flying improved a lot. That was a stable low
winger. I reckon it's about 40% epoxy now ! Buy yourself a Spitfire at least foam fixes in 10 mins or so with epoxy!
Check out the videos at this link it'll give you an idea of how they fly.
http://www.e-flightline.com/e-flight...ain%20body.htm
Happy landings.
Mel.

martno1fan

cheers mel great videos on the link ,now i am tempted to get the spitfire.i think the tiger moth looks cool too so i might get that 1st !!
like you say she looks docile enough in slow flight but has enough power when needed!!!.thanks for the advice!!.
mart

Mellemel

Go for it ! The Tiger moth is a beautiful flying plane, let me tell you of an undercarriage upgrade that I did, you might have seen the flimsy wire used in the kit , well after a few bumpy landings and 'specially on grass it gets a bit of a battering and bends a fair bit, so replace it by first cutting a piece of 3 or 4 mm ply wide enough to reach to the edge of the fuz and about an inch the other way, file away the foam so it's sits reasonably flush with the underside of the plane and epoxy it on. Next get a piece of aluminium bar about 15mm wide by about 2 or 3 mm thick bend it to the same angles and the original u/c wire, drill about 3 holes to screw it onto the ply and hey presto a decent set of undercarriage legs oh BTW get some sponge tyres too, secure these wheels with a simple bolt for the axle part and 2 nuts locked on I never noticed the weight of any of this and it makes it 100% more durable.

As for a Spitfire rev it up and just toss it, double check balance and control surfaces are level gain height and keep it up there !

Glad you liked the videos.

Mel.

martno1fan

cheers again for the reply its much appreciated,i love the spitfire but it seems a bit of a handfull?,its the first time ive spoken to anyone from Tokyo .whats youre real name and what nationality are you mate?.
would you suggest the tiger moth b4 the spitfire then?,once again thanks for the advice.
mart!!

Mellemel

Ay up ! Born and bred in Yorkshire ! Hessle, Nr Hull to be exact. Couldn't get much further away could I !!
Actually I'm not in Tokyo, that's a mistake I'm near Kyoto out to the West.
I' don't know what your aileron experience is but the Moth is a 4 channel plane, and definitly easier than the Spitfire.
I've read in this forum of people not getting on with either P51 or Spitfires, but my P51 is wicked, although gets squirly if slowed down too much for landing.
I'll tell you what though since I started to fly the GWS foamies due to their size and electric convenience I am able to fly more and have improved 100%, much more than if I had stuck with glow.
I have found that, E-Flightline, the link I sent you , are one of the cheapest for prices and mail costs I always receive stuff inside a week from them. Enter something in the basket and fill in the shipping details you'll see the totals before buying anything.
I can't say enough about the GWS Moth 400, I'll leave the decision up to you.

Mel.

WolfeWind

Matt,

This response is late in coming but, yes, I have flown the Extreme. When I said the Beaver was quicker I meant more responsive, not faster. I have flown the ABC, FBC and ABX. I just don't think any of them were as responsive as the Beaver.

The ABX was fast, but I did not think it handled all that well. It just seemed like a bigger ABC to me, and I actually like the ABC better.

Balsabeaver

Martno1fan,

I went from the GWS Beaver to a Corsair, IMO I'd just jump right in! I mean maybe if you're rich it would be nice to graduate up by buying all the planes listed here. but the GWS planes are easy to fix I kmow I have crashed them all although I would suggest using the stock setup with the stock 350 motor first and then go brushless.

Cheers

Brian

Balsabeaver

So what I am saying is get the GWS Corsair set it up as per C of G and so on and you'll find how easy they are to fly, the other warbirds are a bit of a handfull.

Brian T