Bash your planes for little or no money
02-06-2011, 02:15 AM
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Bash your planes for little or no money
I'm seeing this place slowly die and fall into obscurity in short order. It's a sign of the times, people have no money for hobbies any more, they are barely struggling for the basics, and it seems the weekends spent flying planes are set off to the side due to the expense and time involved to do so.... Gentlemen, it's probably the most cheapest thing you can do with the maximum amount of fun factor involved you can possibly think of, if you are prepared to roll up your sleeves and get a little dirty in the process. The mindset being, you don't need to snag something off the shelf, you don't need to get in debt on the gear, and the old gear that people are practically throwing away, work just fine.
Airframe, anything you can pull from the recycle bin will do, carboard, plastic, foam, etc. all you need to do is get a little creative about it if it's totally crude, even that left over pizza box will do just fine for building material. You can take the extra expense by buying foam from the dollar store, or hardware store, and you are still spending less then the gas it took to get there. A hot glue gun, being your only major expense, a buck at the dollar store as well. lol.
Gear, you'll need around 3 servo's, you can get them if you want to wait through overseas at 5-7 bucks a piece, shipping included, esc's, around 10, motor, another 10, battery, 10, and rx/tx, if you go on the old gear, another 20 bucks, and you have all of that back end in that area, that goes from plane to plane to plane, not a huge investment.
So, we have plane, gear, and a little bashing to do, and you are flying anything and everything, from lazy trainers to any comparable model that costs hundreds, all on the super cheap.
The bashing process, honestly, not a huge issue, any idiot can put together a plane that flies, be it wont' look pretty, it will fly if you hang around with us on these boards and take the advice given. Even for the non builder type, modifying one of those cheap big foam chuck gliders is only an evening job to do, and you have something that does comparable to the expensive, box birds. I've done planes using nothing more then a hack saw and exacto knife, carving raw foam to the sophisticated systems using a hot wire cutter, jigs, and of course, plenty of balsa builds as well. For just quick fun, you don't need to put a whole lot of stock and preperations to it, just carve out your creation and have fun. It's not that hard do to, and it doesn't cost alot to do, but, it's a matter of having fun on the cheap, rather then having some show model you can call your own "build up into that show model with a scratch build as you have time".
That all to the side, if you are new to this, are on the broke end trying to start out, ask around here, chances are you will run into people that have gear simply collecting dust, chances are as well, you'll find friends that will help you bash out your first plane and show you to fly it as well, and many of us, won't even bother charging you for materials or gear itself if you are local to us. I have plenty even though I've given out a lot, still, have plenty that's merely collecting dust and is her for emergency reserve, but there is never an emergency to prepare for, and I'd like to order new stuff, just because, lol..
Don't consider this hobby to be expensive, I guess, my point here, and don't neglect it because you have this or that taxing your resources, you deserve some r and r time, and it's just good clean cheap fun if you go at it the correct way.
Anyway, posting a pic of my latest prototype., It's something I bashed together, old school wise without a hot wire cutter, "even though I have the hot wire cutting system down nailed down pat", just to float around the skies with. It will get prettied up some day, for now, just having fun flying it around the small area I'm at, just outside of my door and the wingspan is close to 4 foot, lol, and it's using all full size mainstream gear, yet able to crawl along at 3 miles per hour, and then go into 40 mph if I opt to push it, lol. Simple, easy bash from a basic chunk of foam which costed me a grand total of seven bucks to do. This is just something anybody can do with very little effort. The lines/strapping are reinforcement, they are plastic strapping I pilfered from the home depot store they were tossing out, they make the EPS turn into a very rigid structure for all conceivable purposes, it's a super easy way to beef up any foam structure.
Airframe, anything you can pull from the recycle bin will do, carboard, plastic, foam, etc. all you need to do is get a little creative about it if it's totally crude, even that left over pizza box will do just fine for building material. You can take the extra expense by buying foam from the dollar store, or hardware store, and you are still spending less then the gas it took to get there. A hot glue gun, being your only major expense, a buck at the dollar store as well. lol.
Gear, you'll need around 3 servo's, you can get them if you want to wait through overseas at 5-7 bucks a piece, shipping included, esc's, around 10, motor, another 10, battery, 10, and rx/tx, if you go on the old gear, another 20 bucks, and you have all of that back end in that area, that goes from plane to plane to plane, not a huge investment.
So, we have plane, gear, and a little bashing to do, and you are flying anything and everything, from lazy trainers to any comparable model that costs hundreds, all on the super cheap.
The bashing process, honestly, not a huge issue, any idiot can put together a plane that flies, be it wont' look pretty, it will fly if you hang around with us on these boards and take the advice given. Even for the non builder type, modifying one of those cheap big foam chuck gliders is only an evening job to do, and you have something that does comparable to the expensive, box birds. I've done planes using nothing more then a hack saw and exacto knife, carving raw foam to the sophisticated systems using a hot wire cutter, jigs, and of course, plenty of balsa builds as well. For just quick fun, you don't need to put a whole lot of stock and preperations to it, just carve out your creation and have fun. It's not that hard do to, and it doesn't cost alot to do, but, it's a matter of having fun on the cheap, rather then having some show model you can call your own "build up into that show model with a scratch build as you have time".
That all to the side, if you are new to this, are on the broke end trying to start out, ask around here, chances are you will run into people that have gear simply collecting dust, chances are as well, you'll find friends that will help you bash out your first plane and show you to fly it as well, and many of us, won't even bother charging you for materials or gear itself if you are local to us. I have plenty even though I've given out a lot, still, have plenty that's merely collecting dust and is her for emergency reserve, but there is never an emergency to prepare for, and I'd like to order new stuff, just because, lol..
Don't consider this hobby to be expensive, I guess, my point here, and don't neglect it because you have this or that taxing your resources, you deserve some r and r time, and it's just good clean cheap fun if you go at it the correct way.
Anyway, posting a pic of my latest prototype., It's something I bashed together, old school wise without a hot wire cutter, "even though I have the hot wire cutting system down nailed down pat", just to float around the skies with. It will get prettied up some day, for now, just having fun flying it around the small area I'm at, just outside of my door and the wingspan is close to 4 foot, lol, and it's using all full size mainstream gear, yet able to crawl along at 3 miles per hour, and then go into 40 mph if I opt to push it, lol. Simple, easy bash from a basic chunk of foam which costed me a grand total of seven bucks to do. This is just something anybody can do with very little effort. The lines/strapping are reinforcement, they are plastic strapping I pilfered from the home depot store they were tossing out, they make the EPS turn into a very rigid structure for all conceivable purposes, it's a super easy way to beef up any foam structure.
02-20-2011, 01:08 PM
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RE: Bash your planes for little or no money
It has been a while since your post, but it was a pretty good one overall. I would like to add another source of building material - foam drink cups, foam plates, foam .... well you get the idea. I noticed the same techniques people are using to build paper model airplanes in full diamention can be used with foam products most of the time. For example; a paper model airplane is built to look like the actual craft, but in scale, often 1/72, 1/48, and etc. The paper used has enough stiffness to hold the curved, or semi-curved shape, but not tuff handling. Notice the fuselage is made from paper cyclinders in sections and are clued together using paper tabs bent inward. If the cutting and forming of the tabs is done carefully, the finished model has a straight and proper appearance from any angle. Now imagine instead of using paper you are carefully cutting foam cups, plates, and other consumer items often disguarded as trash. The foam is thin, so you want to start with foam that is already near the shape you need and will conform without deforming or damage to the "rib" shapes common to balsa kits cut out of balsa wood. Most balsa wood kits of airplanes use the right half and left half construction method, where you build one side and then the other. The plastic airplane kits are assembled in the same fashion, but the wing will probably be a top half glued to a bottom half. What you end up doing is a mixture of each of the methods already discribed, butproduce avery thin skinned foam model airplane that can be strengthened as needed to fly with an electric motor.
Of course one could build a thick foam box and carve or sand away the extra foam to end up with a rounded, model airplne. If one can comprehend how the skin of an aircraft is made up of sections of thin metal, you can use the same process with thin foam. The internal foam parts are needed primarily to ensure the foam skin parts stay put until the glue cures and to add a little stiffness againsthandling, andflightpressure or stress. If one is a good craftsman/person, they can use very light weight glues to make a foam shell of most of the smaller scales that will weight less than a balsa, plastic, or other reproductions. I call this technique "Foam Cup Technology", but there may be other names for the same idea andconstructionmethod. The key is the end product can fly and with mini RC gear inside, entertain for many hours. With experience the foam model maker can learn how to strengthen the RC model against engine torque, vibration, and weight without adding significant weight to the foam model. The foam modeler can also learn there are many products commonly available to coat and seal the foam without damage, while providing additional strength, and open up more options for coloring the skin. One example is the light weight spackling compound where the plastic tub feels like it is empty, but actually isn't. The spackling compound is easy to thin or clean up with water, but there are other light weight liquids that can be mixed with the compound to make it spread easily without fear of water thinning problems. With this basic compound thereare a significant number of water clean up products that can be mixed with it to provide resistance to damage, or add color, and other desireable characteristics. It is mostly a process of trial and error on test peices with recipes to arrive at the desired results; protect, strengthen, and color the foam.
The objective is to be able to recycle RC equipment one already has and without much cost be able to have another model not yet available in the hobby market, or is too expensive, or the wrong size, or ... whatever might be the reason to build your own. This is still scratch building, but with common materials often thrown away as trash and easy to obtain with little effort. One can also buy the same foam objects in bulk from most big box warehouse supply stores at a reasonable cost and have more than a few years supply of stock for many RC models. Later the modeler may want to purchase other kinds of foam andmaterialsto add specific charteristics to a project even if doing so would add a small expense. The message still is many RC models can be made with little expense, but the hours of pleasure flying the finished model can more than justify the effort. Another side benefit is repairing, or replacing, or improvinga favorite model will be much easier since the modeler will already know how the aircraft was constructed and will have the necessary materials and tools on hand. If more than two members of an RC club share interest in the same aircraft style and size, they can make a second or more copies of the favorite project and trade the copies for another's handy work, or hobby materials, or equipment. The result of swapping and trading will be more models to fly and share. I think most of us know the value of a hand-me-down to another who has expressed an interest in the RC aircraft hobby.
My son is currently sharing some of my still flown models and he is showing obvious progress as a pilot. If he later shows interest in the building part of the hobby, he will inherit many trade secrets and techniques he will later be able to share and pass down. My hope is he will find this hobby as rewarding as I do and be a good steward of my collection, even if it is rather small at the present time. Imay never get around to building all the model aircraft kits I have collected, nor use all the plans and materials Ihave, but he could, or he could pass the materials to another in some way. One thing is for sure, Ihavenoticed Idecide where to buy my next drink based on the merchantswho use good quality foam cups. It is surprising how a few discoveries can change how a person lives by effecting their decision making process. The paper cup is dead for me, but the foam cup is now a collector's item, lol. To me two large foam cups can become my next mini RC flyer and it could also be in scale!
Of course one could build a thick foam box and carve or sand away the extra foam to end up with a rounded, model airplne. If one can comprehend how the skin of an aircraft is made up of sections of thin metal, you can use the same process with thin foam. The internal foam parts are needed primarily to ensure the foam skin parts stay put until the glue cures and to add a little stiffness againsthandling, andflightpressure or stress. If one is a good craftsman/person, they can use very light weight glues to make a foam shell of most of the smaller scales that will weight less than a balsa, plastic, or other reproductions. I call this technique "Foam Cup Technology", but there may be other names for the same idea andconstructionmethod. The key is the end product can fly and with mini RC gear inside, entertain for many hours. With experience the foam model maker can learn how to strengthen the RC model against engine torque, vibration, and weight without adding significant weight to the foam model. The foam modeler can also learn there are many products commonly available to coat and seal the foam without damage, while providing additional strength, and open up more options for coloring the skin. One example is the light weight spackling compound where the plastic tub feels like it is empty, but actually isn't. The spackling compound is easy to thin or clean up with water, but there are other light weight liquids that can be mixed with the compound to make it spread easily without fear of water thinning problems. With this basic compound thereare a significant number of water clean up products that can be mixed with it to provide resistance to damage, or add color, and other desireable characteristics. It is mostly a process of trial and error on test peices with recipes to arrive at the desired results; protect, strengthen, and color the foam.
The objective is to be able to recycle RC equipment one already has and without much cost be able to have another model not yet available in the hobby market, or is too expensive, or the wrong size, or ... whatever might be the reason to build your own. This is still scratch building, but with common materials often thrown away as trash and easy to obtain with little effort. One can also buy the same foam objects in bulk from most big box warehouse supply stores at a reasonable cost and have more than a few years supply of stock for many RC models. Later the modeler may want to purchase other kinds of foam andmaterialsto add specific charteristics to a project even if doing so would add a small expense. The message still is many RC models can be made with little expense, but the hours of pleasure flying the finished model can more than justify the effort. Another side benefit is repairing, or replacing, or improvinga favorite model will be much easier since the modeler will already know how the aircraft was constructed and will have the necessary materials and tools on hand. If more than two members of an RC club share interest in the same aircraft style and size, they can make a second or more copies of the favorite project and trade the copies for another's handy work, or hobby materials, or equipment. The result of swapping and trading will be more models to fly and share. I think most of us know the value of a hand-me-down to another who has expressed an interest in the RC aircraft hobby.
My son is currently sharing some of my still flown models and he is showing obvious progress as a pilot. If he later shows interest in the building part of the hobby, he will inherit many trade secrets and techniques he will later be able to share and pass down. My hope is he will find this hobby as rewarding as I do and be a good steward of my collection, even if it is rather small at the present time. Imay never get around to building all the model aircraft kits I have collected, nor use all the plans and materials Ihave, but he could, or he could pass the materials to another in some way. One thing is for sure, Ihavenoticed Idecide where to buy my next drink based on the merchantswho use good quality foam cups. It is surprising how a few discoveries can change how a person lives by effecting their decision making process. The paper cup is dead for me, but the foam cup is now a collector's item, lol. To me two large foam cups can become my next mini RC flyer and it could also be in scale!
04-05-2011, 09:16 AM
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RE: Bash your planes for little or no money
Let us not forget soda bottles. These come on several shapes and sizes and they all have the characteristic that, when heated, they want to shrink back to the blob they were blown from. So if you need a canopy or indeed you want a skin for that aircraft you haven't built yet, then maybe soda bottles are the way to go. If you can carve a chunk of wood to the shape you want and get it inside a section cut from a bottle, then a heat gun will shrink it onto the form. For those that suffer, as I did, from always having a piece thats a little larger than the bottles I have, there's a trick. Keep the screw tops. Drill a hole into the top, screw on a fuel nipple. Screw the top back on the bottle. Now heat the bottle where you want it bigger while pumping air in with a bike pump. Any pump really. Don't try blowing....trust me. When its big enough, let it cool and it'll retain its size and shape. Now stick your masterpiece inside, heat again and it'll come back down to fit.
For a compound shape that doesn't come off the form easily, shrink on one bottle and cut it off with a straight cut end to end. Shink on another then cut it off with an end to end cut somewhere else. Now use a strip out of the second one to join the cut you made in the first. yes, you can make then double thickness too. Complete fuselages can be constructed this way producing overlapping tubular sections from bottles.
For a compound shape that doesn't come off the form easily, shrink on one bottle and cut it off with a straight cut end to end. Shink on another then cut it off with an end to end cut somewhere else. Now use a strip out of the second one to join the cut you made in the first. yes, you can make then double thickness too. Complete fuselages can be constructed this way producing overlapping tubular sections from bottles.
04-05-2011, 09:47 AM
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RE: Bash your planes for little or no money
Soda plastic bottles are used by many who like to scratch build for many things from canopy to skid. It is true the standard soda bottle does shrink a bit as it is heated, but this must be done in a controlled manner or the plastic will begin to burn and produce toxic fumes. The trick is to find the perfect temperature for the too hot to touch plastic for the desired method to produce the wanted part. I don't think I would attempt to melt the plastic to make a skin for aRC model made of foam since the foam is very sensitive to heat. Many types of glue are also sensitive to heat and that is why it often is a bad idea to use heat gun glue on a black or other dark colored foam. The glue will get soft and let go while transporting the foam model while it is setting in the hot car, truck, or other vehicle that can heat up like a greenhouse without ventilation. If one is going to make a canopy from a plastic bottle, it is best to find a bottle that already has the basic shape wanted so very little work is needed over a hardwood form to gain the desired shape when exposed to mild heating and the required cooling period.
There are other plastic products often thrown away that can be used also, but we just not forget many consumer product containers are designed to break down in sunlight. If your flying skills are such that you don't crash much anymore and you want your work to last more than three years with occational exposer to sunlight, it will be necessary to use modeler products with UV and other enhibitures. Other wise cracks and other problems will begin to show and the model with become too weak to fly safely. Of course the more details about successful and problem methods and materials we share, the more likely fewer of us will be disappointed with our creations, or risk safety and health issues. As to how to best skin foam, it depends on the foam, and the products used. I tend to use the very cheap wall plaster materials available for sheet rock, or plaster board. There is a commonly available plastering, or patching plaster that weights so little you think the container is empty. It sticks to most foam board materials very well, and can fill in the holes in various screen cloth materials to form a strong, light weight skin. It is also water clean up, but permanent when cured in 20 hours or so, depending on how thick the skin is.
More information is available in the various threads about scratch building foam combat planes.
There are other plastic products often thrown away that can be used also, but we just not forget many consumer product containers are designed to break down in sunlight. If your flying skills are such that you don't crash much anymore and you want your work to last more than three years with occational exposer to sunlight, it will be necessary to use modeler products with UV and other enhibitures. Other wise cracks and other problems will begin to show and the model with become too weak to fly safely. Of course the more details about successful and problem methods and materials we share, the more likely fewer of us will be disappointed with our creations, or risk safety and health issues. As to how to best skin foam, it depends on the foam, and the products used. I tend to use the very cheap wall plaster materials available for sheet rock, or plaster board. There is a commonly available plastering, or patching plaster that weights so little you think the container is empty. It sticks to most foam board materials very well, and can fill in the holes in various screen cloth materials to form a strong, light weight skin. It is also water clean up, but permanent when cured in 20 hours or so, depending on how thick the skin is.
More information is available in the various threads about scratch building foam combat planes.
04-23-2011, 04:07 PM
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RE: Bash your planes for little or no money
I'm seeing this place slowly die and fall into obscurity in short order. It's a sign of the times, people have no money for hobbies any more, they are barely struggling for the basics, and it seems the weekends spent flying planes are set off to the side due to the expense and time involved to do so....
One thing I've noticed is that if a guy has to choose between a MEGA 16/15/3 and a week's worth of food, he'll pick the motor. R/C flying can't be bothered by such mundane troubles as lack of funds.
04-23-2011, 11:58 PM
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RE: Bash your planes for little or no money
LOL, it would be something special if a person could skip on the purchase of food for more RC stuff, but reality seems to dictate otherwise. The best one can do is start out with an affordable RC system, build with MBFB in mind (most bang for buck), andpurchase more materials or supplieswhen possible. Of course that often means collecting materials from as free a resource as one has available and learning enough about scratch building on the cheap. Unfortunely that often means a lot of internet time, and a personal connection does cost money for just about any speed. The only other choices I know of involve public libraries (with limited time) or a friends connection, but that too is often for a limited time. At the moment I am recycling my Nutball, purchased as an EPPkit, and it will soon be a mix of Snowball and Arup (1930s) design. Currently installing the electronics, which means I should be able to maiden the new, bashed craft in another day or two, weather permitting. I am thinking of calling it an Arupy, but starting the name with an "A" might seem a tad odd. I do want to suggest were the design came from, more or less, and give credit for the principle concept. I would tend to think others from this thread have and are doing the same sort of things to save a few coins for future needs and recycling planes and parts when possible. Sure seems like a good idea to me anyway.
If one isn't concerned over cost of the hobby and is more focused on flying as many models as possible, as soon as possible, I would suspect the pilot to purchase craft that are pre-built and fly the bigger "gasers". I started out with the standard trainer many moons ago, got out of the hobby for an extended period, and then decided to go again. For me it made more sense to go electric, foam, light weight, and park flyer size for the convenience. This has been a good decision for a number of reasons, one of which has to do with the choice of flying sites are many, rather than few as is the normal case with the larger gaser models. I don't need a large site, paved runway, or other expensive and limited access requirements to launch a park flyer and fly as long as I can stand it. If the park flyer happens to take a tumble, repairs are much easier on the coin bank, and often of no consequence if I want to pick up the model, brush off the dust, or grass clippings,and go again. The newer EPO and EPP foam options have proven the better investment and more crash resistant that I first thought possible. The fact the Nutball kit was made of EPP foam has a lot to do with my option to recycle the craft, even if the changes were more than most would bother with. This new "Arupy" should fly just fine, but if it don't, I can scratch out a new version for less than $20 with new EPP foam. Something most of us would give a great deal of thought about if we are restricted by our collection of coins.
If one isn't concerned over cost of the hobby and is more focused on flying as many models as possible, as soon as possible, I would suspect the pilot to purchase craft that are pre-built and fly the bigger "gasers". I started out with the standard trainer many moons ago, got out of the hobby for an extended period, and then decided to go again. For me it made more sense to go electric, foam, light weight, and park flyer size for the convenience. This has been a good decision for a number of reasons, one of which has to do with the choice of flying sites are many, rather than few as is the normal case with the larger gaser models. I don't need a large site, paved runway, or other expensive and limited access requirements to launch a park flyer and fly as long as I can stand it. If the park flyer happens to take a tumble, repairs are much easier on the coin bank, and often of no consequence if I want to pick up the model, brush off the dust, or grass clippings,and go again. The newer EPO and EPP foam options have proven the better investment and more crash resistant that I first thought possible. The fact the Nutball kit was made of EPP foam has a lot to do with my option to recycle the craft, even if the changes were more than most would bother with. This new "Arupy" should fly just fine, but if it don't, I can scratch out a new version for less than $20 with new EPP foam. Something most of us would give a great deal of thought about if we are restricted by our collection of coins.
04-24-2011, 12:02 AM
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RE: Bash your planes for little or no money
LOL, it would be something special if a person could skip on the purchase of food for more RC stuff, but reality seems to dictate otherwise. The best one can do is start out with an affordable RC system, build with MBFB in mind (most bang for buck), andpurchase more materials or supplieswhen possible. Of course that often means collecting materials from as free a resource as one has available and learning enough about scratch building on the cheap. Unfortunely that often means a lot of internet time, and a personal connection does cost money for just about any speed. The only other choices I know of involve public libraries (with limited time) or a friends connection, but that too is often for a limited time. At the moment I am recycling my Nutball, purchased as an EPPkit, and it will soon be a mix of Snowball and Arup (1930s) design. Currently installing the electronics, which means I should be able to maiden the new, bashed craft in another day or two, weather permitting. I am thinking of calling it an Arupy, but starting the name with an "A" might seem a tad odd. I do want to suggest were the design came from, more or less, and give credit for the principle concept. I would tend to think others from this thread have and are doing the same sort of things to save a few coins for future needs and recycling planes and parts when possible. Sure seems like a good idea to me anyway.
If one isn't concerned over cost of the hobby and is more focused on flying as many models as possible, as soon as possible, I would suspect the pilot to purchase craft that are pre-built and fly the bigger "gasers". I started out with the standard trainer many moons ago, got out of the hobby for an extended period, and then decided to go again. For me it made more sense to go electric, foam, light weight, and park flyer size for the convenience. This has been a good decision for a number of reasons, one of which has to do with the choice of flying sites are many, rather than few as is the normal case with the larger gaser models. I don't need a large site, paved runway, or other expensive and limited access requirements to launch a park flyer and fly as long as I can stand it. If the park flyer happens to take a tumble, repairs are much easier on the coin bank, and often of no consequence if I want to pick up the model, brush off the dust, or grass clippings,and go again. The newer EPO and EPP foam options have proven the better investment and more crash resistant that I first thought possible. The fact the Nutball kit was made of EPP foam has a lot to do with my option to recycle the craft, even if the changes were more than most would bother with. This new "Arupy" should fly just fine, but if it don't, I can scratch out a new version for less than $20 with new EPP foam. Something most of us would give a great deal of thought about if we are restricted by our collection of coins.
If one isn't concerned over cost of the hobby and is more focused on flying as many models as possible, as soon as possible, I would suspect the pilot to purchase craft that are pre-built and fly the bigger "gasers". I started out with the standard trainer many moons ago, got out of the hobby for an extended period, and then decided to go again. For me it made more sense to go electric, foam, light weight, and park flyer size for the convenience. This has been a good decision for a number of reasons, one of which has to do with the choice of flying sites are many, rather than few as is the normal case with the larger gaser models. I don't need a large site, paved runway, or other expensive and limited access requirements to launch a park flyer and fly as long as I can stand it. If the park flyer happens to take a tumble, repairs are much easier on the coin bank, and often of no consequence if I want to pick up the model, brush off the dust, or grass clippings,and go again. The newer EPO and EPP foam options have proven the better investment and more crash resistant that I first thought possible. The fact the Nutball kit was made of EPP foam has a lot to do with my option to recycle the craft, even if the changes were more than most would bother with. This new "Arupy" should fly just fine, but if it don't, I can scratch out a new version for less than $20 with new EPP foam. Something most of us would give a great deal of thought about if we are restricted by our collection of coins.
