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3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Old 02-24-2005, 12:21 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

pictures....
Old 02-24-2005, 02:14 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Pictures, maaaaaaaaaaaaaany pictures can be found here: http://www.txsquadron.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2016

As far as the CG issue is concerned, the first flight with the aft CG it practically torque-rolled hands free. . . my flights on it yesterday with a more forward CG (set just aft of neutral trim upright and inverted) were with winds gusting to 13 knots so it wasn't hands free, but it was actually quite comfortable hovering and torque-rolling keep in mind I don't have expo and I fly it most of the time on high rates, and with the CG at 3.5 inches it is pitch stable enough to draw nice lines provided the wind isn't turbulent. I don't think this thing is in any danger of poor torque-rolls at any flight worthy CG to be honest, but I will slide the battery up to the front end of the range today, on this windless day and report back a more accurate appraisal. There is some rock in the harriers to counter, and they do lessen in magnitude as the CG moves aft, that said, there is ample control response in the harrier to fly out the rocking. Keep in mind that the rocking is also made worse by higher wingloadings, and while I haven't weighed mine yet I'm sure its heavier than mose 3DF planes will be with all the paint and glue I used.
Old 02-24-2005, 02:54 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Here are a couple pics:


















Old 02-28-2005, 09:23 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Thanks for the help Bret. I dont know about anybody else but my instructions have nothing to do with the new wing. That was frustrating till you helped.
Thanks
Old 03-01-2005, 04:36 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Thanks!

Glad to know it's helpful! It probably increased my build time by 10 fold, but it's nice to have done it!!

The Manuals that come on the CD should have most of the kits updated for the G-Force wings (just look for the _PRO at the end of the names) if not you can downlaod them here: http://www.3dfoamy.com/manuals.htm

Despite this, as some of us (myself included) have found there are spots that could be clearer in the manuals for first tiem 3DF builders. For me it was the tailfeathers that I messed up on (EDIT: and the AXI motor mount). . . the manual text made me think that I should slide the stab forward into the centering notch, the photos were correct but poor quality as I printed them on my junk printer, so the text was used which is not actually applicable as the stab should be slid BACK towards the tail. . . I realized this once the glue cured. . . and now think that I have almost worked up the courage to try to move my horizontal stab and elevators back 2/3 of an inch where they should have been for better neutral blance upright and inverted. I need a spatula sized Xacto I think!!
Old 03-01-2005, 05:05 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Me too!!

I almost started cutting a slot for the spar......until I found other directions.....

Thanks and keep up the good work!!!
Old 03-02-2005, 03:53 AM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Tonight I worked up the courage to get out the Xacto saw and excise my horizontal stab/elevator assembly from the fuse so that I can move the surfaces back towards the rear of the fuse cutout where they should have been glued in the first place. I have had some issues with neutral pitch trim when rolling from upright to inverted such that when trimmed for level upright flight (at speed) a half roll to inverted requires aft stick to maintain level inverted flight, moving CG forward had less effect on this dynamic than usual so I think the tail position may be a factor. I will let you all know. This is actually sort of handy when in the low speed high alpha 3D realm as things like rolling harriers and such require a little less stick movement on the elevator, but for easier IMAC style flying I'd like the inverted qualities changed some.

Old 03-02-2005, 07:34 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Hey Bret,
Thanks to your help here is the edge.
You are right about the aileron linkage. I will have to figure out where to get some cf rod.
The wife had fun with the sharpies
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Old 03-02-2005, 07:46 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Wow! Looks Great. Pretty handy to have an artistic wife with a flair for R/C around eh!! It looks almost like watercolor with the blending. . . pretty cool!!

Oh and by the way, the sharpie works OK on the control horns too.

Let us know how the maiden flight goes.

Have fun!!
Old 03-02-2005, 08:07 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

She actually hates my planes- just talerates them The colors are the only part she enjoys. If that makes any sense your doin better than me. LOL
Old 03-02-2005, 09:05 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread


ORIGINAL: Slyder
I will have to figure out where to get some cf rod.
I had some waiting on my back porch when I came home tonight. Picked it up from Tower. It was $4.39 for two 24" pieces of .040 diameter.
Old 03-02-2005, 09:35 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

There you go Slyder! Just wait on I&C's backporch and some more cf rod might show up!
Clark
Old 03-03-2005, 03:36 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

[sm=lol.gif]
Old 03-03-2005, 04:33 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

So where is everyone setting the CG at on these? The manual says 2-2.5" but that is for the old. Is it the same?
Old 03-03-2005, 07:20 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

My manual lists the CG at from 3-3.5. I have been flying at 3.5 and it is a rather tailheavy location, I would suggest for the first few flights that you run it at the forward range as these are clearly 3D friendly CG ranges that Levi suggests. Check the 3dfoamy.com site for your updated manual, you can simply donwnload it, and your aircraft may be a little different than my Raven (though not that much I doubt).

Here are the most recent manuals.

http://www.3dfoamy.com/manuals.htm

I wonder if I sit on I&C's porch a YS 1.10 will show up. . hmmm. . .
Old 03-03-2005, 08:31 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

If you kick the door in you'd find one in the Yak! I'll leave some cookies and milk in there too.
Old 03-04-2005, 05:26 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Ohhh. . handy, I was thinking of the EF Yak with the 1.10. . . that will save me from having to wait for one of those to show up. . I'll be right over
Old 03-04-2005, 05:28 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Flight report with tail in correct location will have to come on monday, I am out of town till then. . . I am chomping at the bit though, a new 9303, a new tail location on the Raven. . . good thing it's too windy and rainy to fly a foamy anyway. [&:]
Old 03-09-2005, 10:09 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

yesterday I had two flights, and today I had three on the new tail and transmitter. I had to remove most of the exponential I dialed in as I am simply not yet used to it, 21 years of high rates and no expo has given my thumbs a reluctancy to move large amounts on the sticks, setting it at no more than 20% was OK, but I still flew better with none. I had my first motor mount fail, not at the fuse joint, the plywood itself split in half, causing damage only to my motor and ESC wires, but the fuse was fine. I replaced it with a second AXI mount of Levi's the day before yesterday. I flew it lightly yesterday on the new mount, but it was a bit too windy to really report on anything. Today was still a little bit windy, but I flew at a park with the cover of trees and buildings to lessen the windspeed a bit.

Today I could see that the tail moved back did improve the pitch tracking and stability by a noticable amount. My 3 flights today each had the CG in different spots and the model was most well behaved all around at about 3.25 inches aft of the LE. It would still climb a little when inverted at speed, but at lower speeds it was neutral, and near 3D speeds it required a forward push on the stick for level flight. The pitch tracking was better too as it was easier to draw good lines. There is still a deadspot in the aileron response, it's right at the speed between flying and 3D'ing though in the harrier it has a nice roll response, and of course when flying on the wing it has more than enough. Rolling harriers were easier than on the shocky, mostly because the models stores more rotational energy in the roll so it presents better, being more stable and consistant as it rolls, this also makes it a little easier to fly through the figures as it simply feels more solid, even with wind. I noticed a little more pitch coupling in the Knife Edges today, buty nothing unusual, and once the KE coupling is dialed out it is content to fly around KE as long as you are.

It was starting to really come together at this point!

I did some snap roll and spin attempts on the third flight which had the CG at around 3.75 inch aft of the wing LE which were strange, the snaps would not snap the aircraft would pitch through the snap into very high alpha flight or even do the worlds smallest immelman. I went up high and went for an upright spin, it didn't really turn into a spin it more or less spiralled down very slowly and gently ina harrier with healthy pitch oscillation where it appeared to fly in and out of the stall. I tried this one with no aileron (a full scale style spin) and intended for the next spin to use aileron which I expected would give me a better spin. I didn't have the chance to though. . . as I exited the spiral harrier and turned back to head away from me I heard a rather loud pop and saw foam fly, then the engine and speed control could be seen dangling from below the aircraft I had some roll control but couldnt turn and decided to just glide it straight ahead and did a greaser harrier landing into the grass. The fuse forward of the wings was not in good shape though. [&:]

There really was nothing on this flight that was what I would call hard aerobatics other than that I attempted three snap rolls, and did one outside tumble on a upline into a torque roll. . . nothing out of the ordinary through so you can imagine my dismay when I saw my nose explode. . . in level, 1/3rd throttle, 1 g flight no less.

In any case I am a bit bummed.

Needless to say my next plane will not use the front firewall mount.


I got video yesterday and today which I uploaded to the ftp, link in main build thread.

Here are some pics, see the rest at the main build thread:

I found all the parts except the carbon fiber crossbeam. Here you can see how the motor mount failed, this is much like the first ones failure, at the bottom screw hole, as well as at the top of the cooling holes in the mount. Note that the bottom portion of the mount broke at the screw hole despite the patch of ply that I epoxied over it!

You can see that the prop disc actually rotated downwards and cut clear through the fuse foam below and behind the motor mount. . . note the paint on the leading edge of the prop and how it lines up with the foam placed next to it.



The damage to the left side was pretty bad, you see the fuse side rail damaged all the way back, as well as the split in the wing.


I guess it's time to fly the sim or full scale for a while till I get in a better mood. . .
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Old 03-09-2005, 11:34 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

After analysis of the point of failure on the two mounts this is a proposed modification to the mount to beef up the week points of the current mount.




This will eliminate the weak points from the half moon cooling cut-outs, as well as the real problem, the screw hole at the six o clock position.

Photoshop work done by TX-Deck
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Old 03-11-2005, 02:52 AM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

I just found out that the AXI mount is supposed to be built twice as thick. I had two kits and got a bag with two mounts in it, and with no instructions assumed that the mounts where 1 for each kit, turns out that I should have laminated the two together before mounting in the aircraft. Too bad I didn't find that out before the Raven had to suffer for it

I am not sure how the motor and ESC fared in all this, and I haven't really mmessed with it just yet. . . hopefully the gear is still OK.

One thing is for sure, I had fun, even if for only 10 flights. . .

The Raven I built for my nephew used a stick mounted Himaxx setup that was pretty darn solid.

If I build another it will probably use the backplate mount, but at least now I see what the trouble was. [&:]
Old 03-11-2005, 11:30 AM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Man, sure wish you uploaded the pics through RCU so they were not so large... takes long time to view on dial up
Old 03-11-2005, 04:25 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

Yeah, I've got 5 different threads (at other BBS) on the subject so uploading each pic in each one would be a rather time consuming endeavor given that I already have them in the master thread, so for now I'll delete the pics and just leave them on my main build thread so those who want to see them can. . . but that is really going to hammer those out there on dialup. That's why I was posting just a few of the full set here.
Old 03-11-2005, 05:32 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

I hear ya.. maybe sizing the origionals to a decent (700-900 pixels wide) size would make life easier for all of us?

Like to see them though.
Old 03-11-2005, 06:48 PM
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Default RE: 3D Foamy Raven Build Thread

They *should* all be at 800 wide.

Given the demise of the Raven I won't be posting too many more pics though [&:]

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