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250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

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250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Old 05-24-2011, 10:40 PM
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fillopygeesi
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Default 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Ok this may be dumb but I was wondering. If someone was to build a 1/4 scale plane such as I would love to build a 1/4 scale tbm avenger (wouldnt happen any time soon =( $$$) . Engines to power such a plane are very expensive, cheapest Ive seen so far is the DLE 222cc for around $1700 to 1800!!! and other brands more. I was wonder what others thought of using this engine. http://www.northerntool.com/shop/too...5693_200355693

Has anyones tried somthing like this? I know it has a shipping weight of 40lbs wittch would obviously be way to heavy. But take off all the stuff you wouldnt need such as the heavy cast iron flywheel, clutch, magnito, fuel tank and all that plastic shouds and Im sure theres more. Modify it with better exaust, electronic ignition, and take out the govenor (or at least turn up the rps or somthing) Seems that this could work and be a heck of alot less expensive. I know this stile of motor dosent rev much rpms but with a 36x20 prop I woudnt think you would need but about 3000 to 4000 rpm. Just a thought
Old 05-24-2011, 10:43 PM
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fillopygeesi
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

LInk was messed up its a Briggs & Stratton 250cc 11 ft/lbs torque engine. You can just google 250cc briggs and stratton and tons of them show up for around $250 to $350
Old 05-25-2011, 04:21 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?



With the right equipment and some ingenuity it could be mounted to an air frame but even if one was satisfied flying nice smooth level circles, never banking more  than about 30 degrees, never going inverted, never going vertical, I seriously doubt there is an ARF anywhere that could take the pounding a 250cc single cylinder would punish it with for more than a few minutes before pieces starting falling off.

There are many more reasons it would not work well but once parts of the airframe start falling off they're all moot.

Old 05-25-2011, 04:25 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Aircraft engines are all about power to weight ratios. The Briggs engine, while fine for it's designed role, is heavy, and way down on power comparatively speaking. Probably not a very good plan for this application.....
Old 05-25-2011, 04:25 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

I rode a 750cc AJS single back in the day. Every low RPM firing stroke would propel the bike like a jackrabbit. Great fun though at the higher revs.

Richard/Club saito #635
Old 05-25-2011, 05:30 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Although the entry price sounds good the weight and vibration from a 250cc industrial single would be terrible. After ordering a 3w 342 the other day I can definately appreciate the lower price of the B&S.
Old 05-25-2011, 06:36 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Here is another low RPM air cooled engine...lots of torque....just kinda heavy ! Capt,n
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Old 05-25-2011, 06:44 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

It's not a crazy idea.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_10...m.htm#10030664

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mO5oY9YjPk
Old 05-25-2011, 07:13 AM
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fillopygeesi
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Seems like after you took off all that extra you wouldnt need it would lighten it up quite a bit, I mean Im sure it would still be a bit on the heavy side. As far as power gos somehow those mower racing boys get lots of power out of them. I know you could get more just playing with govenor and maybe exaust. But you guys are right about vibration, after watcing that vid that Gkamysz post looked like it was gonna shake apart. Defanatley have to come up with some type of good rubber mounted system. But not sure if rubber mounts allowing engine to shake around there for prop shaking around would disturbe flight.
Old 05-25-2011, 07:45 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

You would need a mount that provided roughly 3" of lateral motion in a full circle, and that mount would not be simple like a few rubber mounting pads. It would require multiple tiers of mounting system.

All this stuff has already been done and the results provided reams of data proving the concept of a large displacement single on a small airframe to both impractical and destructive. Essentially if one desires to step up into the big leagues they have to accept they are going to spend a lot more money to do so.
Old 05-25-2011, 08:04 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Richard,,,I had a Matchless Typhoon G80TCS single, brand new in 1960...When did they make a 75o single ? the 750 at the time was a twin...
Old 05-25-2011, 08:19 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?


ORIGINAL: fillopygeesi

Seems like after you took off all that extra you wouldnt need it would lighten it up quite a bit, I mean Im sure it would still be a bit on the heavy side. As far as power gos somehow those mower racing boys get lots of power out of them. I know you could get more just playing with govenor and maybe exaust. But you guys are right about vibration, after watcing that vid that Gkamysz post looked like it was gonna shake apart. Defanatley have to come up with some type of good rubber mounted system. But not sure if rubber mounts allowing engine to shake around there for prop shaking around would disturbe flight.
If it didn't disturb your flight it might certainly disturb your cowl. If your time is worth at least minimum wage, by the time you're done you will likely have invested enough to buy a properly designed engine made for model aircraft use.

Old 05-25-2011, 08:22 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

The guys flying ultralights with the Briggs V twins is intriguing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKOrm...B7B335308358C6

A single 250 four stroke though would be tough on a model I have to agree. There aren't many cheap light alternatives to RC engines in this size range.
Old 05-25-2011, 09:46 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Jody,

I think you know how much engineering it takes to make an effective vibration mount for even a <30CC single[8D] Can you imagine what would be required for a 95CC single? It's already been done. A 100 twin is almost as complex.
Old 05-25-2011, 10:11 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?


ORIGINAL: Antique

Richard,,,I had a Matchless Typhoon G80TCS single, brand new in 1960...When did they make a 75o single ? the 750 at the time was a twin...
It would have been in about 1958. Our house had a bunch of English and Euro bikers. My normal ride was an Austrian PUCH 250 2 stroke twin. The AJS as I remember it was a big spindly English trials bike single 4 stroke, and i recall it as a 750cc. I could have been wrong all these years, but that is my recall on this one. We used to trade bikes for a day and cruise around to break the academic tension. Sometime a late night ride into NYC, return daybreak the next day.

What do you ride now? I have a friend with a Bonnevile 650, but he won't even talk selling. Don't know why because he is really a Honda type guy. I would love to have a Norton 850 Commando, but wouldn't we all. My grandfather rode a Henderson.

Sincerely, Richard/Club Saito #635
Old 05-25-2011, 10:18 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

We'll get moderated for this.
1978 1000 cc Harley chopper and a 1912 Model t...
Old 05-25-2011, 10:28 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

I would not be a first for me

My last big ride was a HD Sportster 1000 cc. I am in between bikes now after selling my dirt bikes, but I have a 66 TR4A in the garage and a 87 BMW E30 Eta in the driveway.

Richard/Club Saito #635
Old 05-25-2011, 10:38 AM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Ahhhh, a Henderson. That, the Vincent, and the Arial was some real 2 wheel engineering. Even by today's standards.
Old 05-25-2011, 01:45 PM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

Remember that the Briggs is a 4 stroke engine with an oil supply that must be kept essentially horizontal. You could have only very shallow takeoffs and fly with very shallow banks to keep the oil supply in a usable position.
Old 05-25-2011, 02:46 PM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

There are a lot of comments and results from the thread here on RCU that addresses Honda, Ryobi, Briggs and maybe others 4 stroke WE conversions for RC. Also several conversion kit mfrs provide the needed bits .
Old 05-25-2011, 02:48 PM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?


ORIGINAL: Tired Old Man

Ahhhh, a Henderson. That, the Vincent, and the Arial was some real 2 wheel engineering. Even by today's standards.
Never saw just how Arial connected all the internals of the square 4. Do you have an exploded view of that beauty? And the Vincent Black Shadow, gotta love that one.

Thanks
Old 05-25-2011, 03:07 PM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

No docs on the bikes, but here's a fairly large RC engine.
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Old 05-25-2011, 03:39 PM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?


ORIGINAL: Tired Old Man

No docs on the bikes, but here's a fairly large RC engine.
wow!!!!!!! me likes what prop a 36"?
Old 05-25-2011, 03:58 PM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?


ORIGINAL: Tired Old Man

No docs on the bikes, but here's a fairly large RC engine.
That's pretty cool! looks like 150cc per jug, maybe. How big?
Old 05-25-2011, 04:19 PM
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Default RE: 250cc Briggs & Stratton for large scale planes?

3w-342TS, ~170cc/jug, 38-16 two blade. 20+c.i, 18 lbs, 30 HP. You don't want to see what a 38" Fuchs will set you back. Yo consider landing very carefully if you use one. The plane it's going on should come in around 65-70 lbs, and be able to easily climb out of a hover.

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