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Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Old 09-01-2011, 03:48 PM
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rcplanenut
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Default Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Let me start out with I really hope this doesn't turn into a brand war. I am currently flying a 35% Edge540 with a DLE111. It has been a great engine for the last 2 years, but I wish it had a little more power. So, my question is "What is the strongest motor in this size class"? I am looking at the DA120, Evo116 or the BME116.
Old 09-01-2011, 04:01 PM
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aussiesteve
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

All are excellent choices.

I have the MVVS 116 (Evo) and the BME 116 fitted in identical Yaks here. I find the MVVS to have a (very) slight edge over the BME for a 3d power curve. the MVVS is fitted with the MVVS 3204 Canisters and the BME is fitted with MTW TD 110's.
Old 09-01-2011, 04:31 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

For 3d? I prefer the BME 116. Because it's light, extremely powerful, extremely good for throttle response, and dependable.

Other engines do the same or similar but they ALL are heavier. Especially when the cannisters are replaced with stock mufflers. Once that happens the BME has a large edge over them all.

The weight wins in 3d because you want things as light as possible in most cases.
Old 09-01-2011, 05:22 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

I have a BME 115 with the carb block update in a SU 26 on MTD td75h cans.
It is a great running engine and way more power then needed in my app.

Also Tom over at BME is great for any service needs.
That my 2 cents
Old 09-02-2011, 03:32 AM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

give me the bme 116 or that is what i have sitting on the bench to use on something.....
Old 09-03-2011, 03:56 AM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Thanks for the input. Anybody have anything on the DA120? I guess thats the one I was hoping for.
Old 09-03-2011, 04:54 AM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D


ORIGINAL: rcplanenut

Thanks for the input. Anybody have anything on the DA120? I guess thats the one I was hoping for.
Tons of info on other sites. Can't go wrong with either of your choices.
Old 09-03-2011, 05:40 AM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D


ORIGINAL: rcplanenut

Thanks for the input. Anybody have anything on the DA120? I guess thats the one I was hoping for.

It's a good engine. More power than a DA 100 but not quite a BME 116 unless you pipe it. Both are well behind the output of an MVVS 116. The 120 is priced about the same as a BME and both have equal "customer service". Just to add to the confusion, a couple more great 3d engines overlooked on this list is the 3w 110 and DLE 111.
Old 09-03-2011, 06:10 AM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

TOM i think he already has the DLE 111
Old 09-03-2011, 11:02 AM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

I have the DA-120 with stock muffs on an Extreme Flight 110" Yak 54 and I love it. I fly tons of 3D on it. Perfect engine IMO. I've had many engines and it is reliable and a power house. I trust it down low any time. I pan caked mine in a few months ago and busted up my fuse really bad. Got in some weird air and could not keep it from stalling to the ground (in other words totally my fault). Sent the engine to DA because it hit the ground and broke the prop. They inspected it, cleaned the carb, and sent it back charging me only return shipping. Nothing was wrong with the engine. I love the DA-120. Right now it's turning a Mej 28x12 at 6400 RPM. Pulls the 29 pound Yak up out of a hover very quickly. Verticals are very fast.
Old 09-03-2011, 12:20 PM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Thanks Joe, I'm glad to hear you got your Yak back together. I'm looking to put this in my Edge for next year then replacing the airframe with the AJ Slick.

Jim
Old 09-04-2011, 12:24 PM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

I think I am going with the DA-120. Now, is it worth the extra money to go with canister mufflers vs stock mufflers. What are the benefits. I know the are quiter, but do they add enough power to justify the cost?
Old 09-05-2011, 10:16 AM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D


ORIGINAL: rcplanenut

I think I am going with the DA-120. Now, is it worth the extra money to go with canister mufflers vs stock mufflers. What are the benefits. I know the are quiter, but do they add enough power to justify the cost?
If your field doesn't require quiet engines, there's no benefit to going to canisters. Most don't add enough power to offset the weight increase. There are so many powerful engines available to use on stock in-cowl mufflers. For ultimate 3D performance, you need to keep the weight as low as practical.
Old 09-05-2011, 10:28 AM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Thanks for all the info I've ruled out the EVO because it's almost 2 lbs heavier than the others. I found some good info on cans vs stock mufflers on F...G's. My club only requires mufflers so thats the way I will go. Now it all depends on if the BME is still on sale when I am ready to purchase in a few weeks ( need to save my $$$).
Old 09-05-2011, 12:00 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Not to be rude but so far you have asked questions and ignored what everyone has told you. It would have been faster and easier for everyone else if you had originally asked something like "I've decided on a DA 120 with cans. Will this be a good engine?" Your mind was made up before your wrote the OP.

Yep, the Evo weighs 2 pounds more, but so does a DA 150. They are comparable in more ways than just weight.....
Old 09-05-2011, 01:16 PM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

TOM
You are being rude, not sure where you get off thinking you can read my mind. When I made my original post I was considering all 3 engines, but after reading all of the replies including yours and other research I have done since then I have it narrowed done to the BME or the DA with the stock mufflers. I know you are extremely helpful in these forums, but you also seem to have a problem with putting down people with less experience. I heard you say the MVVS/ Evo has the most power but I don't believe it's worth the extra weight.
Old 09-05-2011, 06:20 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D


ORIGINAL: Tired Old Man
It's a good engine. More power than a DA 100 but not quite a BME 116 unless you pipe it. Both are well behind the output of an MVVS 116.
A couple of weeks back, my club had a fly-in weekend and someone from a neighbouring club brought his 42% Edge (a PAU clone, I believe)
In this edge, he had an MVVS116cc with cans. Given peop-le would normally use a 150cc class engine in a plane of this size, it was quite an experience to witness a 116cc pull it out of hover in such an effortless way.
An extremely quiet engine as well and ran smoother than most I have seen before
Old 09-05-2011, 07:34 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

The selection of engines has, or more accurately has been, one resembling a marketing popularity contest, not one based of facts. Although I may have seemed rude to the the OP with my view, which was not the intent, it was not one I had until after he was informed about cans, then elected to purchase them anyway. I will not apologize for being analytical and arriving at conclusions, it's my job.
Old 09-05-2011, 07:42 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Pat, I really couldn't see anything rude in your response to the OP.
He asked for a comparison between three engines and got exactly that!

Whether he then decided to ignore all advice and go with the least desireable option is his problem.
Some people are too thin skinned!
Old 09-06-2011, 09:58 AM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

If you read my previous post you will see that I have decided against cans since my club only requires mufflers (I belive this was what people were saying). As far as the choice of motors it's still between the DA-120 and the BME116. You may not like that decision but it's mine to make. Yes I started out hoping the DA-120 would come out on top but I didn't know enough about any of the motors to be able to make a good decision. This was the reason for my OP. The Evo may be more powerful but I have decided it's not worth the extra weight. I know you said the BME would be a better choice and if I was only looking at the engine I would agree. As of today both companys have excellent customer service, but I have concerns about BME being there in the future. I am baseing this from this forum along with other forums on other sites I have looked at since I made my OP.
Old 09-06-2011, 10:03 AM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

apalsson,
Why do you feel I am ignoring what people are saying?
Old 09-06-2011, 10:43 AM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

What does make the 120 a good choice is the cannisters. if they were desired the three easiest engines to find cannisters for are DA, 3w, and MVVS. The BME requires a bit of extra effort since headers aren't off the shelf items. One has to use 3w headers for a BME.

I will not try to influence your choice , there's nothing wrong with it so why should anyone? But I would like to clear something up after one of your previous posts. BME, like DA and 3w, does not depend on the sales of model engines for continued existance. About the only reason I can see BME closing is about the same I can see for the other two. Only if they so desired to.

I share your concern about weight, but often wieght is not factored correctly in the decision making process. It's often mistakenly viewed as stand alone criteria, with factors seriously mitigating the weight ovelooked or discarded.
Old 09-06-2011, 05:29 PM
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rcplanenut
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

TOM
Why does cannisters make the 120 a good choice? Everything I've read about cans in this Forum and in others is the only real benefit is the noise reduction but with a little added weight and no gain in power. I guess I'm concerned about weight because I fly mostly 3D (or at least try to). I figured if I can use a lighter engine that will produce a sufficiant power to weight ratio then it won't be nessesary to use a heavier but stronger motor like the EVO. You do make a valid point about BME. I am still considering that motor.
Old 09-06-2011, 06:53 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

DA just makes the selection of cannisters as easy as possible for the end user. By offering sveral selections for cans, headers, and tuned pipes on their site the customer spends less time and effort seeking components to suit their pleasure.

I don't like cans or tuned pipes. Especially tuned pipes because they make the tuning process a long and painful one, one that may never be rid of "peakiness" at some point in the RPMband, while making throttle response tricky to get right. Cannisters are a necessary evil for some people. I just wlaked away from a club that recently mandated cannisters and noise rules for large planes because of one noise complaint. For me the cost to use them would be in the area of $500.00 and I'm not hacking up the belly of a Comp Arf for anyone. Not to mention a 3 blade prop, or the fact that headers always break, pipes split at the reflector, and re-using the silicone sleeves is nigh on impossible.

However, some people can't find a new location to fly that's within a reasonable driving distance and time from their home so they only have two choices. Cans or don't fly. They do have weight, and there should not be any power gain, but one has to make a call. Since I have a BME in my Compy the additition of cannisters would have less impact than if it was equipped with a DA or 3w, but they would still add weight to a 25-1/2 pound plane.
Old 09-07-2011, 05:26 PM
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Default RE: Best 100 - 120cc engine for 3D

Fly the DA 120 on stock muffs and you'll be more than happy. If noise isn't a problem then adding cannisters are just added weight and expense. Pipes will give you more power but they tend to make most engines peaky and the throttle response isn't very good. The 120 on muffs will yank a 30 pound plane around like no ones business

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