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NGH 38CC 4 stroke

Old 01-06-2014, 11:26 PM
  #426  
Mcubed
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Hi Guys

Regarding parts try (http://www.himodel.com/shop_for_parts.php?sku=NGH-GF38)
I have been running two of these engines.
One is the Pro version which is no longer available. Problems hard to start ran really rough, so rough it sheared on of the mounting bolts. The other one is the standard two ring version Hard to get the fuel up ( as it was on the Pro version) but once running pretty smooth.
Checked the valve clearances and adjusted both motors no difference the pro still rough and the standard smooth.
Checked the Ignition timing Pro 34 deg standard set to 43deg?
Checked the valve timing Pro timing dimple at TDC in line with small reinforcement under cam case IE vertical. Standard was set one tooth forward of this position ( IE toward the prop driver) . Adjusted Cam position on the pro motor to match the standard version.

I now have to smoothly running motors, they pull a 20X6 at around 6,600 and idle down to 1,700. with the addition of a small through muffler of a 26cc tuned pipe idle dropped to 1,400.

I suggest if you have a really rough running 38 look at the CAM timing.
Old 01-07-2014, 10:26 AM
  #427  
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Good info thanks Mcubed. Interesting, almost all the spares are on backorder, just like other stockists. Wonder when NGH will produce another batch of engines and spares. It's also interesting that the factory seems able to supply one-off spares upon request, but there are no spares to be supplied to distributors.

Strange how they do business IMHO.
Old 01-07-2014, 12:18 PM
  #428  
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Usually with Himodel, if you place a order for spares and they are on backorder, they can fill the order in a couple of days. HiModel, I think, it like just down the street a short distance from the NGH facility. I have ordered NGH parts on backorder before and they filled the order fairly quickly. I split a order into two orders, with one order for things still in stock versus another order with only the backorder items in it. Anyway it has worked for me in the past OK.
Old 01-08-2014, 12:50 PM
  #429  
misfitsailor
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Special thanks to SJN and Mcubed! I checked my Pro model NGH 38 and reset the cam as suggested. Then I modified the Hall sensor to retard the ignition timing. I have played with this engine since August, and now it runs smooth enough and idles slow enough to put in an airplane! The only thing I still do not like about the engine are the carbon fiber mounts, as they flex too much. I would probably buy the standard crankcase (they are dirt cheap!) and switch to a beam style mount, but no vendor seems to have crankcases in stock! I suppose I could fabricate aluminum pieces to replace the CF.

I ran the engine today for an hour total with 20x8 and 18x8 M.A. props. I have at least 3 hours running time now. I am once again excited about this engine and hope to fly it very soon.
Old 01-08-2014, 01:19 PM
  #430  
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Well I got my ngh 38 today and the hall sensor is broke and bent fins and a gouge on the front blue prop hub magnet I hope AMR has a new hall sensor.This motor will fit my plane perfect very excited about this motor too. If it runs good they could have a winner here. AMR is going to replace my hall sensor and blue prop hub Thanks for the good service AMR. Other than that the motor looks good. Now I can mount it and fit in my plane tell parts come. The bent fins I can straighten.
And AMR shipped this motor fast had it in 4 days.

Last edited by shorte; 01-08-2014 at 02:33 PM.
Old 01-09-2014, 01:39 AM
  #431  
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Originally Posted by misfitsailor
Special thanks to SJN and Mcubed! I checked my Pro model NGH 38 and reset the cam as suggested. Then I modified the Hall sensor to retard the ignition timing. I have played with this engine since August, and now it runs smooth enough and idles slow enough to put in an airplane! The only thing I still do not like about the engine are the carbon fiber mounts, as they flex too much. I would probably buy the standard crankcase (they are dirt cheap!) and switch to a beam style mount, but no vendor seems to have crankcases in stock! I suppose I could fabricate aluminum pieces to replace the CF.

I ran the engine today for an hour total with 20x8 and 18x8 M.A. props. I have at least 3 hours running time now. I am once again excited about this engine and hope to fly it very soon.
Hi misfitsailor

I agree the carbon fibre mounts are way to thin at 2.5 mm, mine are now fractured. I can not get a crankcase either and I am still waiting on a standard steel radial mount. So I am making a new mount out of 5mm alloy plate. I will make it wider than the standard or Pro mounts so the standoffs clear the carb.

It seems everyone is having trouble getting spares. Hi Models have just informed me that they cant get any at this time.
Old 01-09-2014, 10:54 AM
  #432  
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O.K folks, Hobbyking have these engines in stock now at $284 USD. Spare parts are still on backorder.

Unfortunately for me I cancelled my order with Hobbyking and went with AMR in Canada. Nothing wrong with their service as recommended by TPerks, but I got hammered by New Zealand customs because the freight charges (higher than Hobbyking's) put me over the thresh-hold (15% of the value has to be less than $60.00 NZD) for import taxes and I ended up having to pay another $120.00 NZD to have it released for delivery, still havn't got it yet, hope it isn't broken like some have been reporting. The extra cost to me is not AMR's fault, I just can't buy any more engines off them because the postage from Canada exposes me to the import taxes as mentioned. I do recommend their service though, so if you live in a pert of the world that is closer for postage or has different tax regimes, then they are still probably worth dealing with.
Old 01-09-2014, 04:18 PM
  #433  
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Anyone using a beam mount with this motor ? The only 1 I can find that might work is a aero works 120 mount I think Dubro Motor Mount 1.20 2/4-Stroke 688 mount won't fit because it hits the carburetor. my stock mount hits the carburetor bracket so I would need to grind off a little on the corner of the bracket. Any input on a beam mount I don't think a saito fg36 mount would work can buy those for 25 bucks. Anyone know what the dimension of the saito fg36 mount is?
Old 01-09-2014, 04:45 PM
  #434  
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Originally Posted by shorte
Anyone using a beam mount with this motor ? The only 1 I can find that might work is a aero works 120 mount I think Dubro Motor Mount 1.20 2/4-Stroke 688 mount won't fit because it hits the carburetor. my stock mount hits the carburetor bracket so I would need to grind off a little on the corner of the bracket. Any input on a beam mount I don't think a saito fg36 mount would work can buy those for 25 bucks. Anyone know what the dimension of the saito fg36 mount is?
Hi shorte, I have just recieved my NGH GF 38. I am also looking at mounts, I have a Greatplanes 1.20-1.80 beam mount and a Sullivan 4-stroke flexi-mount coming. Will take a good look at those when they arrive and see which one looks like it might suit best.

Tyor, what mounting were you thinking of using to fit your engine to your ESM Aichi?

Regarding AMR shipping as mentioned in my earlier post today, the engine shipped undamaged. Looks good!

Does anyone know whether it matters which crankcase nipple connects to which carburettor inlet manifold nipple? Nil instructions on any of this and this is my first Gas engine. Also wonder how you get a good fit on the spark-plug cap, do you just force the bejesus out of it until it fits all the way down onto the spark-plug pole? Seems very tight if that is the way, but then I would understand that you wouldn't want it coming off!!!!!
Old 01-09-2014, 04:54 PM
  #435  
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Hi Alfiev
I would love to find a mount like the saito fg36 aluminum mount the great plane probably will work but I don't like the adjustable part of the mount. And I had 2 blue carb gaskets from a zenoah g26 motor that worked perfect on each side of the heat spacer on the GF38

carburetor inlet manifold nipple ether one will work doesn't matter. But I will be using the center for the carb pressure and the other one for oil and yes to the spark-plug.

Have you mounted the standoff mount on your motor? Mine came with the new button screws for the carb but the mount still hits the carb mounting plate and my plate was bent over 90 degrees so I had to straighten it to 90 so there is no stress on the manifold when bolting it on the head.

I also took the velocity stack off so the screws now fit all the way in the manifold I might get longer screw to put the velocity stack back on .

Last edited by shorte; 01-09-2014 at 07:06 PM.
Old 01-09-2014, 05:33 PM
  #436  
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I looked at the saito fg36 and it looks like it will work just re-tap 2 mount screw I wish I knew how wide the fg36 is..... saito don't show the width of it.
Old 01-09-2014, 10:15 PM
  #437  
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FG-36 distance between mount holes: 64mm across (as per Saito manual)
Old 01-09-2014, 10:43 PM
  #438  
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Originally Posted by ALFIEV

Does anyone know whether it matters which crankcase nipple connects to which carburettor inlet manifold nipple? Nil instructions on any of this and this is my first Gas engine. Also wonder how you get a good fit on the spark-plug cap, do you just force the bejesus out of it until it fits all the way down onto the spark-plug pole? Seems very tight if that is the way, but then I would understand that you wouldn't want it coming off!!!!!
Hi Alfiev, enjoy your engine.
I hope that pic. will help you.. Edit: Seems my comment was wrong.
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Last edited by Turk1; 01-10-2014 at 12:11 AM. Reason: Correction
Old 01-09-2014, 11:35 PM
  #439  
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Thanks Turk, looks good! I just have to sort out the mounting and I will be able to bench run it.
Old 01-10-2014, 02:18 AM
  #440  
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Hi ALFIEV

My Engine actually has the two lines reversed as to the picture supplied by TURK1. There is some logic in this as the rotating crank flings any excess oil to the outer edges of the crankcase where it is scavenged and transferred to the intake manifold, IE the lower vent should be connected to the intake and the central port connected to the carb pulse port (the one nearer the carb on the intake manifold ) as there is less stray oil at the centre of the back plate.
In practice there is probably little difference either way.
I have used a T piece to connect the lower port and the one under the Cam case and feed both to the intake. This stops oil getting all over the inside of the cowl and helps prevent the cam running dry.
Old 01-10-2014, 12:48 PM
  #441  
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This morning I flew a plane with this engine for the first time! What sounded loud and sharp on the ground sounds just great in the air, no muffler needed. Power is good, and idle is reliable. The only problem I have is those carbon fiber mounts. They get softer with each run.

After removing them I can see that one has cracked. Today's project will be to make 5mm thick alloy replacements!
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Old 01-10-2014, 04:14 PM
  #442  
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I had some 45mm evolution standoff mount and it fits closer to the firewall and makes it as long as a dle 30 . dle 30 is 160mm long and with the 45mm evolution mounts it bring ngh 38 at like 163mm long and it bring the HI LOW needles 1/8 from fire wall. I used some easy off oven cleaner to remove the blue anodized aluminum and polished it to a shiny aluminum.
I don't like the blue anodized on the motor.
Old 01-10-2014, 04:53 PM
  #443  
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I made up 5mm aluminum mounts to replace the wimpy carbon fiber ones. The difference is amazing! The shaking is completely gone. Any remaining vibration is similar normal 2 stroke vibration. I am using the stock stand-offs. I am looking forward to flying this plane again next week!

To summarize; if you are stuck with the "PRO" model, retard cam one tooth, retard ignition (cut one slot in pick-up to allow greater rotation), and lose the CF mount parts. Don't worry about the 3 ring piston, it works fine.
Old 01-10-2014, 04:57 PM
  #444  
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This motor would be perfect in a Aero works 30cc trainer gt arf QB [h=1][/h]
Old 01-10-2014, 08:16 PM
  #445  
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Mcubed, are you sure the 'T' in the vent line is a good idea? According to NGH, one line from the intake to the rear cover is to provide a little raw fuel mix to the crankcase, needed as there will not be much unburned oil getting down past the rings to lube the lower end. It is true that the flow in that line goes both ways, but overall, fuel mix is consistently added to the crankcase. Judging by the steady production of oil leaving the forward nipple, there is an overall flow from the rear to the front of the engine. This setup also prevents "wet sumping", a buildup of oil in the crankcase, as excess oil can vent out the front nipple. If we "T" both nipples to the intake, there is no flow through the engine. This is my understanding, anyhow.

I run a long hose from the forward nipple, down and out in my inverted installation. It leaves only a couple of drops of oil on the underneath of the fuse. A vented catch can could also be used.
Old 01-10-2014, 08:32 PM
  #446  
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Shorte, I just checked out that Aero-Works trainer. Looks very nice! Drop doors and all. I would want to convert it to a tail dragger, of course...
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Last edited by misfitsailor; 01-10-2014 at 08:35 PM.
Old 01-11-2014, 01:49 AM
  #447  
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A couple of photos of the new mount and the cracked CF mounts. I s this similar to what you made Misfitsailor?
You may be right about the vent line, I will do some more running tomorrow and try it without the T piece.
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:54 AM
  #448  
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Here is my motor with new mount and polished hub and mount I used that I am going to put on my scratch built stick. I think these stand offs are better than stock makes it the same length as a dle 30 and the motor don't stick out as far.
You can see I used zenoah blue carb gasket on the manifold.
With motor and battery and ignition all up weight is 49.75 OZ. It is lighter than my zenoah g26 at 59 oz
I will be using a zoar 18x8 laminated. I wish the muffler would rotate.
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Last edited by shorte; 01-11-2014 at 07:56 AM.
Old 01-11-2014, 08:05 AM
  #449  
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I have mounted my engine on the ESM aichi d3a1 val. I used the stock mount from ESM. Hope it will not break, but it may take som vibration.from the engine.

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Old 01-11-2014, 08:17 AM
  #450  
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Nice that mount will make a lighter motor.
Nice to see another option for a mount.

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