can you use a starter without spinner ?
#1
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (38)
can you use a starter without spinner ?
how can you use a starter if you dont have a spinner on the prop ? is there anyway to
belt start it ? i'm using a torque master 90 starter and it seems to turn the Q75 over , but it wont stay
on the prop washer alone. it wont get the right amount of spark fliping by hand, its a CH IGNITION,
and its got a good solid blue spark. ?????
thanks rcu
belt start it ? i'm using a torque master 90 starter and it seems to turn the Q75 over , but it wont stay
on the prop washer alone. it wont get the right amount of spark fliping by hand, its a CH IGNITION,
and its got a good solid blue spark. ?????
thanks rcu
#7
My Feedback: (29)
Ive worked on just about every brand made and have not encountered any gasser that would not hand start provided everything was in proper working order and adjusted correctly. The OP has stated in his first post that it has a CH ignition. We don't know if that ignition is pre synchro spark or not. CH ignitions did not need a minimum activation rpm like a DA or 3W ignition does. Perhaps more detail from the OP will shed some light.
#9
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
I've started some glow engines with an electric starter and no spinner, with no problems. On my DLE-20 I have used an electric starter, mainly just for convience . Seems that if I had not flown the model for some time, it took quite a few hand flips to draw fuel, thus the electric starter made it easier. But after it had fuel, starting after the initial start was easily done by hand.
Once again, I guess it just comes down to " whatever floats your boat ", or whatever is easiest for yourself.
Once again, I guess it just comes down to " whatever floats your boat ", or whatever is easiest for yourself.
#11
My Feedback: (29)
True turn should make a hub that will work but I would think if you are dead set to use a starter on a 75cc engine you would want as large a diameter interface as you can get. The only way I can imagine a torque master starter spinning this engine is with the compression release pulled.
#12
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I have a Miller persuader that I used on 24V. I used it to start a ZDZ 80,BME 102,G62, RCS 44 and G45.
It made starting those engines much easier. Especially the ZDZ. Its high compression and a bit cranky.
The Zenoahs were mag engines and I had many bloody hands trying to start those with the stupid spring.
Thats why I got the Miller.
I never used a spinner on the RCS. I always used the starter with the insert turned around.
Currently I have a DLE 30,an NGH 26 and an RCGH 15. I just use a standard starter running on 5 A123 cells for those
I dont use a spinner on the NGH.
For the really big engines they have now you would need a cart to carry a starter for those. But they are slower to respond so you can get your hand out of the way in time.Also you heve more leverage with those big props
It made starting those engines much easier. Especially the ZDZ. Its high compression and a bit cranky.
The Zenoahs were mag engines and I had many bloody hands trying to start those with the stupid spring.
Thats why I got the Miller.
I never used a spinner on the RCS. I always used the starter with the insert turned around.
Currently I have a DLE 30,an NGH 26 and an RCGH 15. I just use a standard starter running on 5 A123 cells for those
I dont use a spinner on the NGH.
For the really big engines they have now you would need a cart to carry a starter for those. But they are slower to respond so you can get your hand out of the way in time.Also you heve more leverage with those big props
#14
My Feedback: (29)
Then something is amiss. Have you checked timing? What adjustments other then needle settings have you done? Do you drain the tank after each session? Was the engine run, put away for a time longer then a couple months and then run again? Is the fuel tank mounted lower then the carb and on CG? What brand filters are you running and where are they placed? What is your filling method, fuel valve, fuel dot, 3 line system? These are all things that can contribute to an engine that won't start easily. Please give us some details, what engine? Describe you starting process. Is this all the time or just the first start of the day?
#15
Wow, so many people trying to convince the guy not to do what he wants. That's what I love about this forum - ask a question and get told all the reason why your question is wrong. It's a question, it deserves an answer.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
#16
My Feedback: (29)
Wow, so many people trying to convince the guy not to do what he wants. That's what I love about this forum - ask a question and get told all the reason why your question is wrong. It's a question, it deserves an answer.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
NOTES FROM OUR TECH DEPARTMENT This is a Hobbico TorqMaster 90 Deluxe 12V Starter.
It is designed for starting Glow Engines up to .90 cubic inches in size.
*** 2-Year Warranty ***
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #f0f0f0"]FEATURES[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
An Aluminum Starter Cone with V-Groove for Boat Starter Belts and
Round Rubber Insert for Airplane Spinner Cones.
Starter has Self-Adjusting Carbon Brushes for Longer Lasting Useage
and Constant Contact with the Armature.
Easy-Press Start Switch makes Starting Easy Without Requiring Heavy
Finger Pressure and a built-in Finger-Guard promises Safe Starts.
Pre-Attached Alligator Clips for easy attachment to a 12V battery
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #f0f0f0"]INCLUDES[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
One TorqMaster 90 Deluxe 12V Starter w/5' Cord & Alligator Clips.
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #f0f0f0"]SPECIFICATIONS[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Winding Resistance: 1.3 ohms Brush width: 3/16"
Weight: 3lbs and 6oz Current Draw: 11.6A load
Armature length: 2" RPM: no load 4500rpm, load 3100rpm
# of commutator contacts: 10 or 12 Measured torque: 310 oz-in at stall
Shaft thread size- 6mm-1.0mm
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #f0f0f0"]REQUIREMENTS[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
A 12V DC power source such as HCAP0800 or HCAP0901
For some of us what the OP is asking and planning to do is just down right dangerous. We have all had starters jump off on us when using a spinner nut on a glow engine. Now imagine that happening while someone is pushing a starter onto a single bolt hub of a 75cc gasser while another guy is pushing the airplane toward him. Wouldn't the better option be to help the OP realize that if he has to use a starter to get the engine running then he has an issue, open a dialog with him to solve the actual problem?
#17
My Feedback: (5)
Wow, so many people trying to convince the guy not to do what he wants. That's what I love about this forum - ask a question and get told all the reason why your question is wrong. It's a question, it deserves an answer.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
Anyway to add to my first response. White Rook, to do this successfully you will need two hands on the starter to steady it side-side and keep it perpendicular to the crankshaft while another person holds the plane. You can do it holding the starter with one hand but it's much easier using two!
Last edited by flyinwalenda; 10-02-2014 at 03:32 AM.
#18
My Feedback: (29)
Ok this is getting ridiculous. You guys are making a bunch of assumptions to justify your point of view. The OP may be physically challenged enough to not be able to flip a prop but can push a starter hard enough against a 2" prop washer to spin a 75cc engine?? Really? Then you suggest a Higley or Dubro hub nut that does not even exist! My answers may not be what the OP actually asked but are based in 1. Safety first 2. helping the OP be successful in suggesting that he may have an issue with the engine if he needs to resort to a starter. Sometimes the correct answer is not one we really want to hear. Does not make it any less correct.
#20
My Feedback: (29)
No kidding LOL, especially when someone goes in and edits his post when it's pointed out that the items he is recommending were never made. Earlier he suggested that the engine could have a magneto ignition when post # 1 clearly states it is CH equipped. Obviously we lost the OP possibly because people are too lazy to do their homework before posting a suggestion. For those who haven't looked it up yet, this is a Q75. The one pictured has a single bolt hub, some were converted to 6 bolt hubs. True Turn makes spinner hubs for the 6 bolt set ups but I have never seen one for the single. As you can see it would be quite difficult to get a starter on this. I have my doubts about a torque 90 starter tuning this engine over. I have a Dynatron on 15V that struggles with my YS115.
Last edited by speedracerntrixie; 09-29-2014 at 03:28 PM.
#22
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
Wow, so many people trying to convince the guy not to do what he wants. That's what I love about this forum - ask a question and get told all the reason why your question is wrong. It's a question, it deserves an answer.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
So, to ANSWER YOUR QUESTION the first response from flyinwalenda is the correct one - turn the rubber insert around. It even says that in the manual for electric starters.
#24
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (38)
it doesn't work , it just chews the rubber up.
theres not enough to grip on just using the bolt head.
i'll figure something out.
the tourqemaster 90? no way , ignitions got a good fat spark , BUT , wont start , good fuel draw too.
i guess i'll try a real starter, its gonna be shelf material soon. the dang thing pops , but wont start.
theres not enough to grip on just using the bolt head.
i'll figure something out.
the tourqemaster 90? no way , ignitions got a good fat spark , BUT , wont start , good fuel draw too.
i guess i'll try a real starter, its gonna be shelf material soon. the dang thing pops , but wont start.
Last edited by WhiteRook; 10-06-2014 at 11:10 AM.
#25
My Feedback: (6)
Often times difficult starting comes from low compression and the ring being worn. It may feel like it has a lot of compression but still in actuality be low. The ring gap should be very tight; like .003". I've had engines that ran well and felt like they had good compression, but pick up 800 rpms and much easier starting characteristics with a new ring. I use Frank Bowman rings exclusively.
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