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Saito's New Engine: FG-90R3

Old 02-18-2020, 07:43 AM
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No surprise re: Horizon. They must protect the brand. I think the Saito runs better with the modifications...that does not mean it won't run without them. Either way you have a great engine.
Old 05-01-2020, 05:05 PM
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Can somebody please share Rays contact information?

thanks!
Old 05-01-2020, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by jraycut
Can somebody please share Rays contact information?

thanks!
This is Ray's contact email address. [email protected].
Old 05-02-2020, 06:00 PM
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Thanks!
Old 05-05-2020, 08:33 PM
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Default Rebuild.

Originally Posted by ForcesR


FG90R3 main rod failure due to engine over rev in flight.
This is what happens with an FG90R3 when the RPM is set to 6800rpm on the ground and you go flying and use full throttle on a slight descending bank. It may not happen on the first or tenth flight but it will happen, the engine will eventually over rev and cause the main rod to fail...!!
hello mate. Did you manage to rebuild your engine? Im after some info on setting the timing up
Old 05-06-2020, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by jimboq8
hello mate. Did you manage to rebuild your engine? Im after some info on setting the timing up
jimboq8, yes I did. As per firing order. Set #1 at TDC install cam for that cylinder with the timing mark centered. Turn crank 240 so #3 is TDC, install cam for that cylinder with the timing mark centered. Turn crank 240 so #2 is TDC, install cam for that cylinder with the timing mark centered.

Roger
Old 05-06-2020, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by ForcesR
jimboq8, yes I did. As per firing order. Set #1 at TDC install cam for that cylinder with the timing mark centered. Turn crank 240 so #3 is TDC, install cam for that cylinder with the timing mark centered. Turn crank 240 so #2 is TDC, install cam for that cylinder with the timing mark centered.

Roger
sweet. Thankyou for that mate. Was exactly what I was after.
Old 05-13-2020, 05:51 PM
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Hi all,
I just wanted to get some other thoughts / opinions on my new Saito FG-90.

Two of the cylinders have quite deep casting void's in the exhaust outlets, the distributor contacted Saito and they came back stating its: "It is not faulty or defective, It is no problem at all on performance".
I understand one might get little pin holes etc from casting, just surprised with the void's. I'm not new to Saito owning FA-125's, FG-20, FG-14, FG-19 and FG-60 and have owned a DLE 55 and haven't seen this before till now.
but i understand the 90 has much bigger cylinders, does anyone else's FG-90 have these voids, is this of a concern or normal?





Void in exhaust


Old 05-14-2020, 10:08 AM
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Default Frustrated with my engine

Originally Posted by jimkron
No surprise re: Horizon. They must protect the brand. I think the Saito runs better with the modifications...that does not mean it won't run without them. Either way you have a great engine.
I finally gave up after following all the manual breakin instructions, Horizons instructions and recommendations. I couldn't get it to run right no matter what I did. I sent it to Ray for the mods. He was very informative on the solutions necessary for it to idle at 800 rpm and have normal transition to full power. The BIGGEST bit of knowledge is that the recommended oil Redline is not designed for 4 stroke engines that the oil burns away clean failing to properly lubricate the lower end. He says the Klotz KL 200 has different characteristics and the oil remains to lubricate better though a bit more messy. Two of the cylinders are off by 5 degrees on ignition timing and Saito refuses to correct it. It is amazing what one must do to get a final good result out of a $1500 purchase.
Old 05-14-2020, 10:31 AM
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su27flanker, the voids are not an issue in the exhaust outlets, they do not affect my FG-90s power or performance. If the voids were in the intake side than it would probably be a problem as the fuel would have its free flow path into the cylinders interrupted possibly causing an unstable idle and or non-smooth power to throttle transition

Originally Posted by su27flanker
Hi all,
I just wanted to get some other thoughts / opinions on my new Saito FG-90.

Two of the cylinders have quite deep casting void's in the exhaust outlets, the distributor contacted Saito and they came back stating its: "It is not faulty or defective, It is no problem at all on performance".
I understand one might get little pin holes etc from casting, just surprised with the void's. I'm not new to Saito owning FA-125's, FG-20, FG-14, FG-19 and FG-60 and have owned a DLE 55 and haven't seen this before till now.
but i understand the 90 has much bigger cylinders, does anyone else's FG-90 have these voids, is this of a concern or normal?





Void in exhaust

Old 05-14-2020, 10:54 AM
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I followed the break-in instructions and never had any issues with starting or with low idle or through the full power range. The FG-90 pulls like a freight train, runs like a well oiled Swiss watch right out off the box without having any of the Ray English mods. I am using Klotz KL 200 oil in both my FG-90 and FG-60R3. I am not criticizing you, you may of just had bad luck with your FG-90. A lot of us who have bought the Saito radial engines run them right out of the box agree with the old philosophy, "if it isn't broken don't try to fix it".

Originally Posted by flytaildragger
I finally gave up after following all the manual breakin instructions, Horizons instructions and recommendations. I couldn't get it to run right no matter what I did. I sent it to Ray for the mods. He was very informative on the solutions necessary for it to idle at 800 rpm and have normal transition to full power. The BIGGEST bit of knowledge is that the recommended oil Redline is not designed for 4 stroke engines that the oil burns away clean failing to properly lubricate the lower end. He says the Klotz KL 200 has different characteristics and the oil remains to lubricate better though a bit more messy. Two of the cylinders are off by 5 degrees on ignition timing and Saito refuses to correct it. It is amazing what one must do to get a final good result out of a $1500 purchase.
Old 05-14-2020, 11:21 AM
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Out of the box, my 90 never hit on the 3rd cylinder, cylinder 2 was missing, I run it like that for the breakin thinking it needed the breakin time. I changed the timing and got the 3rd cylinder hitting most the time, was able to get a good idle and transition to 3000 rpm then changed fuel to the 20:1 Redline, running better now on low end, as soon as throttle advanced past 50%, it would lean out and quit. I had to reprime the carb to restart. I even unscrewed the high end needle to 5 turns out without any response change. I was done. So help me understand your success vrs. My failure on Engines supposedly right outta the box? It doesnt follow logic. I do know the internet is full of examples similar to mine, Mr. English has modified closing 500 engines from all over the world, I dont believe it was just me. What do you make of it. I feel lucky you to have a flawless experience.
Old 05-14-2020, 02:06 PM
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flytaildragger; no it's not just you that had difficulty during break-in on the FG-90 and FG-60. You are correct the internet is full of examples similar to yours. The different engine forums through out the RC world also have owners of FG-90s and FG-60s that have similar results as mine during and after engine break-in. The attached video of an FG-90 after break-in is exactly how my two Saito radials run extremely well right out of the box after break-in. The only things I can think of that may explain why some have difficulty with Saito gas radial break-in problems is that they are new to the ownership of Saito gas radials and confuse the carb adjustments with the way they previous tuned glow engine carbs or 2 stroke gas engine carbs? I must admit it was a learning experience for me when I first purchased my first Saito engine many years ago and adjusting the carb was tedious, frustrating, and time consuming. Then Saito gas engine carb tuning was another tedious, frustrating, and time consuming experience, but I learned by trial and error what to do and not do. Then when I purchased the Saito radials I found that my previous Saito gas engine carb adjustments experience came in very handy while doing the break-in and carb tuning adjustments on the Saito radials.

https://www.faceclips.net/video/LPyH...o-fg-90r3.html
Old 05-16-2020, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ForcesR
flytaildragger; no it's not just you that had difficulty during break-in on the FG-90 and FG-60. You are correct the internet is full of examples similar to yours. The different engine forums through out the RC world also have owners of FG-90s and FG-60s that have similar results as mine during and after engine break-in. The attached video of an FG-90 after break-in is exactly how my two Saito radials run extremely well right out of the box after break-in. The only things I can think of that may explain why some have difficulty with Saito gas radial break-in problems is that they are new to the ownership of Saito gas radials and confuse the carb adjustments with the way they previous tuned glow engine carbs or 2 stroke gas engine carbs? I must admit it was a learning experience for me when I first purchased my first Saito engine many years ago and adjusting the carb was tedious, frustrating, and time consuming. Then Saito gas engine carb tuning was another tedious, frustrating, and time consuming experience, but I learned by trial and error what to do and not do. Then when I purchased the Saito radials I found that my previous Saito gas engine carb adjustments experience came in very handy while doing the break-in and carb tuning adjustments on the Saito radials.

https://www.faceclips.net/video/LPyH...o-fg-90r3.html
Old 05-24-2020, 03:42 AM
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Hello guys.
Did my first run on my FG90 yesterday and it runs great. Already 4 liters of Fuel burnt.
The default settings of 3 turns High and 5 turns on Low seems to be right to run it a little on the rich side. The first 2 liters I runned the engine very rich as recommended by Saito. As I squeezed oil inside the engine via the breather nipple before the first start, all the oil come out the breather nipple during running. What I have noticed on my last run on the test stand is that there is (almost) no oil coming out of the breather nipple during running. As I have the FG60 as well, I am a little concerned as there is coming oil from the nipppe during running.
What I see is that the opening in the nipple in the FG90 is smaller then the FG60, So there seems to be some differences regarding lubrication. Does somebody ever noticed this?
for the record I run the engine 1:15 at this moment.




FG60

FG90
Old 05-24-2020, 08:18 PM
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I have both too, the FG60 & FG90 and yes the FG60 has more oil coming out of the crank case vent nipple when running than the FG90. It's nothing to worry about, both of the engines internal components get proper lubrication by piston blow by oil. I know this because I was curious and took both engines apart to check for lubrication after break-in. The FG90 also has a larger deeper reservoir than the FG60 to collect blow-by lubrication oil before it reaches the nipple outlet hole allowing the excess oil to vent to atmosphere.
Old 05-25-2020, 02:42 AM
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Originally Posted by ForcesR
I have both too, the FG60 & FG90 and yes the FG60 has more oil coming out of the crank case vent nipple when running than the FG90. It's nothing to worry about, both of the engines internal components get proper lubrication by piston blow by oil. I know this because I was curious and took both engines apart to check for lubrication after break-in. The FG90 also has a larger deeper reservoir than the FG60 to collect blow-by lubrication oil before it reaches the nipple outlet hole allowing the excess oil to vent to atmosphere.
Great to hear!
Thanks for your info.
There is now 5 liters of fuel through the engine. Engine runs really great.
-prop: Menz 24x12
-idle: 850 RPM
-Max: 6100 RPM
The only mod I have done is installing a MMM prop hub.
Old 06-03-2020, 12:28 PM
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Default i had made an comparison

Here is an video on YT on my channel maikrotex with an comparison between the original and a meier ring collector


Old 06-18-2020, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Didier
Great to hear!
Thanks for your info.
There is now 5 liters of fuel through the engine. Engine runs really great.
-prop: Menz 24x12
-idle: 850 RPM
-Max: 6100 RPM
The only mod I have done is installing a MMM prop hub.

Hello guys,
Today I maiden my Zero. After some adjusting , the Zero flew great.
I have the CG on 170 mm and it was perfect. My sliding canopy in air worked great as well.
The only problem is the Biela 22x12 3B "semi-scale" is way to light for my FG90R3.
It runs around 6400 rpm on the ground and greater then 7200 rpm in the air, so I had to throttle down all the time. The engine is still new, so I guess the revs will increase.
The Zero flew like it was in "low gear" all the time so lot of revs and not that much speed. Due to noise regulation I want to stay with a 3 blade (It makes to much noise now anyway)
I am looking for more pitch like 22x14 3 blade. Anyone any experience with this size of prop? What brand?
Old 06-19-2020, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Didier
Hello guys,
Today I maiden my Zero. After some adjusting , the Zero flew great.
I have the CG on 170 mm and it was perfect. My sliding canopy in air worked great as well.
The only problem is the Biela 22x12 3B "semi-scale" is way to light for my FG90R3.
It runs around 6400 rpm on the ground and greater then 7200 rpm in the air, so I had to throttle down all the time. The engine is still new, so I guess the revs will increase.
The Zero flew like it was in "low gear" all the time so lot of revs and not that much speed. Due to noise regulation I want to stay with a 3 blade (It makes to much noise now anyway)
I am looking for more pitch like 22x14 3 blade. Anyone any experience with this size of prop? What brand?
Hi Didier,
What is the weight of your Zero?
I think 6400 rpm is pretty high, mine is running max. 5.800rpm on the ground with the Biela 22 x 12

Carlo
Old 06-19-2020, 02:53 AM
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Hello Carlo,

My Zero weights 14.1 kilo (31 lb) without fuel.
Strange that there is so much difference in RPM. My engine runs cool and still on the rich side.
Old 06-19-2020, 04:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Didier
Hello Carlo,

My Zero weights 14.1 kilo (31 lb) without fuel.
Strange that there is so much difference in RPM. My engine runs cool and still on the rich side.

Hi Diedier,

I checked again, my FG-90R3 runs on the ground 5200rpm
Maybe you have the wrong pitch on your prop.

Old 06-20-2020, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Carlo Vangompel
Hi Diedier,

I checked again, my FG-90R3 runs on the ground 5200rpm
Maybe you have the wrong pitch on your prop.
Hey Carlo,

I double checked it. It is really a 22x12 stamped on the back side of the prop. I'm gonna borrow a Engel 23x12 3 blade. I report my results later.
Old 08-16-2020, 10:24 AM
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My yesterday's flight with the Zero and FG90R3.
Awesome engine and airplane combo!

Old 08-16-2020, 10:38 AM
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Fantastic :-)
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