Let's try again DL-50
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
You're right, thank goodness for people like Ralph (RCIGN1) who do and help us understand. Ralph usually elaborate a little more than that, however , which is also a good thing.
ORIGINAL: F1race79
I don't think most of you know how a pump carb works.
I don't think most of you know how a pump carb works.
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
I think ralph was short because wasn't this already covered in this thread somewhere? I seem to remember him mentioning that it can be repaired, in fact I believe he has offered to have someone send him the carb or entire engine and he will make it right. Maybe i am just dreaming...what do I know?
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
OK, a longer explanation...The brass piece is the high speed fuel nozzle...On most carbs there is no hole in the top..Some of the carbs have a very small hole in the top...A WTA6 is one of these....It's there so the owner can't make the carb too lean, even with the high speed needle closed...The normal setting on that carb when used on a G38 is from closed to 1/4 turn open...If an engine with one of those type carbs is run at high altitude it sometimes can't be set lean enough to run right...The Walbro on the DL50 I had here had a small ball pressed into the hole and was sealed with some type of clear sealer, there was not supposed to be a hole in it....
The small brass nozzle is drilled through from the side, 90 degrees to the top...Fuel from the cavity under the diaphram goes through a small hole in the carb casting to a space behind the high speed needle...from there it goes to the nozzle through another hole at the end of the threads, controlled by how far the taper on the end of the needle is out of the hole....If you spray carb cleaner into the high speed needle hole it should come out the end of the nozzle that protrudes into the venturi of the carb...If it doesn't there is something blocking the hole...
You can take a small number drill and carefully clean out the hole at the end of the threads...If you go too large it will make the hole too large for the high speed needle to work...
I have not seen a Walbro on a new engine with this hole blocked, but it could happen...It's not serious, it can be fixed as outlined above....
A WT 201 on a DA50 is an example of the hole at the end of the high speed needle being too small, it's just barely large enough for most props...When someone puts a 23-8 on one of these the high speed needle can't be opened far enough to let the engine run rich...A WT76A is the same size carb but has a slightly larger hole, so it works....A WT201 would be exactly the same if the hole was the same size as the hole in the WT76A...
It has already been proven that this works, it's here in the archives somewhere...
Long enough ?
The small brass nozzle is drilled through from the side, 90 degrees to the top...Fuel from the cavity under the diaphram goes through a small hole in the carb casting to a space behind the high speed needle...from there it goes to the nozzle through another hole at the end of the threads, controlled by how far the taper on the end of the needle is out of the hole....If you spray carb cleaner into the high speed needle hole it should come out the end of the nozzle that protrudes into the venturi of the carb...If it doesn't there is something blocking the hole...
You can take a small number drill and carefully clean out the hole at the end of the threads...If you go too large it will make the hole too large for the high speed needle to work...
I have not seen a Walbro on a new engine with this hole blocked, but it could happen...It's not serious, it can be fixed as outlined above....
A WT 201 on a DA50 is an example of the hole at the end of the high speed needle being too small, it's just barely large enough for most props...When someone puts a 23-8 on one of these the high speed needle can't be opened far enough to let the engine run rich...A WT76A is the same size carb but has a slightly larger hole, so it works....A WT201 would be exactly the same if the hole was the same size as the hole in the WT76A...
It has already been proven that this works, it's here in the archives somewhere...
Long enough ?
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Wait a second, I wasn't saying Ralph was short. I was pointing out that what F1race79 said was short "I don't think most of you know how a pump carb works." As in, what was his point? I was using Ralph as an example of an expert saying that when he says something, he gets to the point and answers questions that were asked.
I've got nothing but good things to say about Ralph. Please accept my apology for the confusion.
Gary
Edit: Thanks for the thorough explanation, BTW.
Edit2: In my original post, if you replace the word "that" with "you" in the second sentence, it would've been much more clear what I was trying to say. Sorry 'bout that.
I've got nothing but good things to say about Ralph. Please accept my apology for the confusion.
Gary
Edit: Thanks for the thorough explanation, BTW.
Edit2: In my original post, if you replace the word "that" with "you" in the second sentence, it would've been much more clear what I was trying to say. Sorry 'bout that.
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
F1 Julius was right....
Carbs are mostly misunderstood, and the people who don't know how they work posting ways to fix what they don't understand only add to the confusion...
No offense intended to anyone who really knows...
Carbs are mostly misunderstood, and the people who don't know how they work posting ways to fix what they don't understand only add to the confusion...
No offense intended to anyone who really knows...
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Well so sorry to insult all of you experts who are masters of the carburater and sorry to those who I "confused". My intentions was just to chit chat how my DL50 was running and issues I had. I thought thats what these forums were for...
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
But whatever, you all enjoy.
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
But whatever, you all enjoy.
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
ORIGINAL: maxun
but if this break in a power up, and you are in front of the prop will be a disaster. my 2 cents. Happy flying.
but if this break in a power up, and you are in front of the prop will be a disaster. my 2 cents. Happy flying.
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
ORIGINAL: Bosshossv8
My ignition , which is one of those in the mose recent picture...plastic wrapped CH chinese made , has been A#1 on a Fromeco regulator at 5.0v. Perfect starts, never a hint of kickback.
Mine does not stumble...yes it does sound like a DA at a 1/4 thrott, but it is breaking in, and I have not leaned it out completely on the low end yet, transition is not a problem at all.
Here are my videos on RCU.
[link=http://www.rcuvideos.com/view_video.php?viewkey=b637cc42bb997841e11a]Maiden after two tanks on ground.[/link]
[link=http://www.rcuvideos.com/view_video.php?viewkey=ee58f9d64e1e47aa4e58]Tach reading after 2 flights on second day.[/link]
[link=http://www.rcuvideos.com/view_video.php?viewkey=b05e74e1ecb164430bfa]second day flights.[/link]
My ignition , which is one of those in the mose recent picture...plastic wrapped CH chinese made , has been A#1 on a Fromeco regulator at 5.0v. Perfect starts, never a hint of kickback.
Mine does not stumble...yes it does sound like a DA at a 1/4 thrott, but it is breaking in, and I have not leaned it out completely on the low end yet, transition is not a problem at all.
Here are my videos on RCU.
[link=http://www.rcuvideos.com/view_video.php?viewkey=b637cc42bb997841e11a]Maiden after two tanks on ground.[/link]
[link=http://www.rcuvideos.com/view_video.php?viewkey=ee58f9d64e1e47aa4e58]Tach reading after 2 flights on second day.[/link]
[link=http://www.rcuvideos.com/view_video.php?viewkey=b05e74e1ecb164430bfa]second day flights.[/link]
#486
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
ORIGINAL: rollingrookie
Well so sorry to insult all of you experts who are masters of the carburater and sorry to those who I "confused". My intentions was just to chit chat how my DL50 was running and issues I had. I thought thats what these forums were for...
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
But whatever, you all enjoy.
Well so sorry to insult all of you experts who are masters of the carburater and sorry to those who I "confused". My intentions was just to chit chat how my DL50 was running and issues I had. I thought thats what these forums were for...
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
But whatever, you all enjoy.
I don't think that the insult was directed at you....There have been a lot of posts about carbs, especially with the DA 50, where there have been some "fixes" that have been questionable...Some were so wild in my opinion you just as well had sat down beside your engine in the dark, lit some candles, then threw fairy dust in the air---While chanting---"Fixing a Walbro carb is so easy a cave man could do it..." Viola--The carb is better than new!!![:@]
What you did to fix the blockage in your carb was correct---I think the major point that Ralph was driving home is that if you use the wrong size drill bit you could ruin the carb...
Kevin
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
ORIGINAL: rollingrookie
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
[]
John
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
ORIGINAL: rollingrookie
Well so sorry to insult all of you experts who are masters of the carburater and sorry to those who I "confused". My intentions was just to chit chat how my DL50 was running and issues I had. I thought thats what these forums were for...
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
But whatever, you all enjoy.
Well so sorry to insult all of you experts who are masters of the carburater and sorry to those who I "confused". My intentions was just to chit chat how my DL50 was running and issues I had. I thought thats what these forums were for...
For my first gas engine I thought I did pretty good because it wasn't running and I made it run. Sorry to waste everyones time. I thought this was a hobby and supposed to be fun, not putting others down because they are still on the learning curve.
But whatever, you all enjoy.
In reality for something being so simple and having only 4 moving parts, its mind boggling the number of way it can be put togather. Of course there is only right way.
To move up to the Pro class only requires about $35 worth of special tools. Then you can resize the jets for custom engines...[:@]
But practice on junk carbs first , cause your going to ruin a few.
#490
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Being new here I've noticed posts on RCU can be a bit harsh perhaps because of the enormous size of the user base. For those easily offended, thicken your skin, shrug it off, and keep contributing! For those quick to offend, ask yourself: would I say that to someone I work with every day? The seeming anonymity of the internet can embolden us, like flipping someone off in traffic that we'll never see again. Problem is we do see each other again.....
#491
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
CreateCruncher...........VERY WELL PUT..............[sm=thumbs_up.gif]
I have been following this thread on the DL 50 sense well before the last one that closed down and there are some that forget that they were once beginners at this.
These gas engines are all very new to me and most of the information has been terrific. I placed an order with Bob a few days ago and will be putting this engine in a TF GS P51 with the Keleo Exhaust system.
I'm really hoping that folks here will not slam me or any other (Becasue they should have know)......Why do you think we are here along with other threads.....Trying to learn from some of the best.
Thanks in advance and hope you won't mind the dumb questions. Of course I have always been told there is no such thing.........
Later all
Mike
I have been following this thread on the DL 50 sense well before the last one that closed down and there are some that forget that they were once beginners at this.
These gas engines are all very new to me and most of the information has been terrific. I placed an order with Bob a few days ago and will be putting this engine in a TF GS P51 with the Keleo Exhaust system.
I'm really hoping that folks here will not slam me or any other (Becasue they should have know)......Why do you think we are here along with other threads.....Trying to learn from some of the best.
Thanks in advance and hope you won't mind the dumb questions. Of course I have always been told there is no such thing.........
Later all
Mike
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
I took my carb off and removed the high speed needle. The orifice hole is approximately a drill #65. I can insert the drill to a depth that would reach to the side of the brass orifice/ball check assembly and then it sounds and feels like it hits metal. There is no flow through from the NV to the venturi. It owuld appear as if the side of the brass orifice was not drilled or is not aligned.
RCIGN1,
Should I drill this out to .035-.037?
RCIGN1,
Should I drill this out to .035-.037?
#493
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Number Size Drills
Diameter in Inches No. Dia.
1 .2280
2 .2210
3 .2130
4 .2090
5 .2055
6 .2040
7 .2010
8 .1990
9 .1960
10 .1935
11 .1910
12 .1890
13 .1850
14 .1820
15 .1800
16 .1770
17 .1730
18 .1695
19 .1660
20 .1610
No. Dia.
21 .1590
22 .1570
23 .1540
24 .1520
25 .1495
26 .1470
27 .1440
28 .1405
29 .1360
30 .1285
31 .1200
32 .1160
33 .1130
34 .1110
35 .1100
36 .1065
37 .1040
38 .1015
39 .0995
40 .0980
No. Dia.
41 .0960
42 .0935
43 .0890
44 .0860
45 .0820
46 .0810
47 .0785
48 .0760
49 .0730
50 .0700
51 .0670
52 .0635
53 .0595
54 .0550
55 .0520
56 .0465
57 .0430
58 .0420
59 .0410
60 .0400
No. Dia.
61 .0390
62 .0380
63 .0370
64 .0360
65 .0350
66 .0330
67 .0320
68 .0310
69 .0292
70 .0280
71 .0260
72 .0250
73 .0240
74 .0225
75 .0210
76 .0200
77 .0180
78 .0160
79 .0145
80 .0135
Diameter in Inches No. Dia.
1 .2280
2 .2210
3 .2130
4 .2090
5 .2055
6 .2040
7 .2010
8 .1990
9 .1960
10 .1935
11 .1910
12 .1890
13 .1850
14 .1820
15 .1800
16 .1770
17 .1730
18 .1695
19 .1660
20 .1610
No. Dia.
21 .1590
22 .1570
23 .1540
24 .1520
25 .1495
26 .1470
27 .1440
28 .1405
29 .1360
30 .1285
31 .1200
32 .1160
33 .1130
34 .1110
35 .1100
36 .1065
37 .1040
38 .1015
39 .0995
40 .0980
No. Dia.
41 .0960
42 .0935
43 .0890
44 .0860
45 .0820
46 .0810
47 .0785
48 .0760
49 .0730
50 .0700
51 .0670
52 .0635
53 .0595
54 .0550
55 .0520
56 .0465
57 .0430
58 .0420
59 .0410
60 .0400
No. Dia.
61 .0390
62 .0380
63 .0370
64 .0360
65 .0350
66 .0330
67 .0320
68 .0310
69 .0292
70 .0280
71 .0260
72 .0250
73 .0240
74 .0225
75 .0210
76 .0200
77 .0180
78 .0160
79 .0145
80 .0135
#494
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Skypilot, I thought of doing the same thing, butI munged mine up .
Snaer810, can;t wait to see the install photos of the Keleo exhaust....I bet you are going for a much higher pitch prop for that warbird than the 3d'ers...what size and pitch?? 20-12?
I am actually looking at 50cc twins....and the P-38 seems like the one ....I wonder what it would take to reverse one of these babies??
Ralph?
Snaer810, can;t wait to see the install photos of the Keleo exhaust....I bet you are going for a much higher pitch prop for that warbird than the 3d'ers...what size and pitch?? 20-12?
I am actually looking at 50cc twins....and the P-38 seems like the one ....I wonder what it would take to reverse one of these babies??
Ralph?
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Posted by no gyro
If you really want to get the DA50 rich, put the WT76A carb on it like Ralph said. He sent me one a year or so ago for my DA50, and I could richen it up enough to drop the WOT rpm 500 rpms.... After doing that, I decided to drill out the HS orifice on the WT201 just like Pe describes. You can't make it as rich as you can with the WT76, but it's flyable this way. Here's my finding on that:
I got my carb drilled out today to where it is dead on, just like the WT76 that Ralph sent me. The origianl fuel passage on the high speed setting is a shy .035". I cleaned it out with a .035 drill bit and that didn't do anything, so I went to .040". Still not enough, so I went to .043. That was getting close. It allowed me to screw in the low 1/4 turn, and not be too lean, but I was still 2 1/2 turns out on the hs needle. I drilled it again at .046", and that got it. Low needle at 1 1/8 turn, and the hs at 1 1/2 turns, and that put me on the rich side.
I got my carb drilled out today to where it is dead on, just like the WT76 that Ralph sent me. The origianl fuel passage on the high speed setting is a shy .035". I cleaned it out with a .035 drill bit and that didn't do anything, so I went to .040". Still not enough, so I went to .043. That was getting close. It allowed me to screw in the low 1/4 turn, and not be too lean, but I was still 2 1/2 turns out on the hs needle. I drilled it again at .046", and that got it. Low needle at 1 1/8 turn, and the hs at 1 1/2 turns, and that put me on the rich side.
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Boss,
To reverse it I think you would want to rotate the barrel and piston 180* to keep the flow of gases working properly and then you would have to do something with the ignition. I have no idea I'm guessing based on the design of the piston skirt and porting.
The following is a link provided by rcign1:
http://www.aerocorsair.com/id27.htm
To reverse it I think you would want to rotate the barrel and piston 180* to keep the flow of gases working properly and then you would have to do something with the ignition. I have no idea I'm guessing based on the design of the piston skirt and porting.
The following is a link provided by rcign1:
http://www.aerocorsair.com/id27.htm
#497
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
Hey Boss,
Well to tell you the truth this is my first warbird build and first gas installation..............
So far its been a great project and the build has been going pretty good so far with a few snags along the way. But it would not be a challenge if there were not a few of those. I would love to build either the Edge 540 or Yak for one of these 50CC DL's, but thats going to have to wait for next fall I think.
The DL 50 should be a great package in the P51. Of course for break-in I'll spin a 22X8 and look at flying a 22X10 or 22X12 - 2 bladed. I figured if I wanted to have the bird look a little more scale I might have to drop down to a 21 or 22X8 - 3 bladed. I'm not going to be able to spin a scale 4 blade its just to much. But I have been in touch with Joe Boyed from Warbird Prop Drives and they are really trying to finish up the testing and production of their drive system with a constant speed 4 blade setup. It is really an awsome thing to behold............... The test platform is with the DA50 installed and I would expect from everything that I am reading here is that the DL would fit right in its place.
But I'm not going to wait on the WPD drive I really want to get this bird in the air this summer....LOL.
I'll definitly forward on the progress and install when I get into it.....should not be long if my engine gets here soon.
Thanks for your interest, hope you don't mind a few questions along the way as far as mounting preferences etc.
Talk to ya'll later
Mike
Well to tell you the truth this is my first warbird build and first gas installation..............
So far its been a great project and the build has been going pretty good so far with a few snags along the way. But it would not be a challenge if there were not a few of those. I would love to build either the Edge 540 or Yak for one of these 50CC DL's, but thats going to have to wait for next fall I think.
The DL 50 should be a great package in the P51. Of course for break-in I'll spin a 22X8 and look at flying a 22X10 or 22X12 - 2 bladed. I figured if I wanted to have the bird look a little more scale I might have to drop down to a 21 or 22X8 - 3 bladed. I'm not going to be able to spin a scale 4 blade its just to much. But I have been in touch with Joe Boyed from Warbird Prop Drives and they are really trying to finish up the testing and production of their drive system with a constant speed 4 blade setup. It is really an awsome thing to behold............... The test platform is with the DA50 installed and I would expect from everything that I am reading here is that the DL would fit right in its place.
But I'm not going to wait on the WPD drive I really want to get this bird in the air this summer....LOL.
I'll definitly forward on the progress and install when I get into it.....should not be long if my engine gets here soon.
Thanks for your interest, hope you don't mind a few questions along the way as far as mounting preferences etc.
Talk to ya'll later
Mike
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RE: Let's try again DL-50
ORIGINAL: Skypilot_one
Posted by no gyro
Posted by no gyro
If you really want to get the DA50 rich, put the WT76A carb on it like Ralph said. He sent me one a year or so ago for my DA50, and I could richen it up enough to drop the WOT rpm 500 rpms.... After doing that, I decided to drill out the HS orifice on the WT201 just like Pe describes. You can't make it as rich as you can with the WT76, but it's flyable this way. Here's my finding on that:
I got my carb drilled out today to where it is dead on, just like the WT76 that Ralph sent me. The origianl fuel passage on the high speed setting is a shy .035". I cleaned it out with a .035 drill bit and that didn't do anything, so I went to .040". Still not enough, so I went to .043. That was getting close. It allowed me to screw in the low 1/4 turn, and not be too lean, but I was still 2 1/2 turns out on the hs needle. I drilled it again at .046", and that got it. Low needle at 1 1/8 turn, and the hs at 1 1/2 turns, and that put me on the rich side.
I got my carb drilled out today to where it is dead on, just like the WT76 that Ralph sent me. The origianl fuel passage on the high speed setting is a shy .035". I cleaned it out with a .035 drill bit and that didn't do anything, so I went to .040". Still not enough, so I went to .043. That was getting close. It allowed me to screw in the low 1/4 turn, and not be too lean, but I was still 2 1/2 turns out on the hs needle. I drilled it again at .046", and that got it. Low needle at 1 1/8 turn, and the hs at 1 1/2 turns, and that put me on the rich side.
Skypilot
thanks for the info i have the same problem with my da,had the drill bits for sometime now just didn't have the balls to drill the jet out,i give it a try.