Too little, Too late
10-20-2008, 10:21 AM
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Too little, Too late
Nice try, Horizon...
So the new Evolution 50 swings a 23-8 Mejzlik at 6400...Whoopee..
A DL50 will turn it faster and cost less....So will a G62...And MANY others...
Like I said, nice try...You guys have the BEST line of engines on the planet already, called ZENOAH...Tried and proven for OVER 20 YEARS...You could have had a twin 124, made from two G62s, about 15 YEARS ago...I had one, made in Japan, from a company called Gen Engineering...It was made to be used on ultralights and was shown in that capacity at Oshkosh...I had the brochure, but it was in Japanese and not translated into English..
I have in my possession a 52cc twin, made from two G26s....
I converted my first Zenoah to EI in 1987...You could have had that also, Bill and I have been converting your engines for 21 years now...And with BETTER ignitions...AND less expensive...And with smaller lighter batteries....
Just a LITTLE foresight would have made you the WORLD leader in EI gassers....
You will get EXACTLY what you deserve, the Chinese are coming and have already made serious inroads into your business...CONGRATULATIONS from one who was once able to buy Zenoah engines at your already inflated dealer prices, but no longer can...I am one of Zenoah engine's biggest boosters, and will always take better care of my/our customers than you ever will.....
FWIW, one of my customers told me he called Horizon tech support for some info about his GT80....He was told by your tech rep on the phone that he should break in his GT80 at high rpm speed so that the pistons could go all the way up in the bores...GREAT information [:@]
FWIW...I don't know if things have changed, but the retail price of a piston for a G62 from a Red Max chainsaw dealer was $21.95...Your DEALER price was about $28.95...GREAT way to do business and protect dealers....
If i'm lyin I'm dyin...Moderators, if Horizon makes you delete this, we'll understand...
So the new Evolution 50 swings a 23-8 Mejzlik at 6400...Whoopee..
A DL50 will turn it faster and cost less....So will a G62...And MANY others...
Like I said, nice try...You guys have the BEST line of engines on the planet already, called ZENOAH...Tried and proven for OVER 20 YEARS...You could have had a twin 124, made from two G62s, about 15 YEARS ago...I had one, made in Japan, from a company called Gen Engineering...It was made to be used on ultralights and was shown in that capacity at Oshkosh...I had the brochure, but it was in Japanese and not translated into English..
I have in my possession a 52cc twin, made from two G26s....
I converted my first Zenoah to EI in 1987...You could have had that also, Bill and I have been converting your engines for 21 years now...And with BETTER ignitions...AND less expensive...And with smaller lighter batteries....
Just a LITTLE foresight would have made you the WORLD leader in EI gassers....
You will get EXACTLY what you deserve, the Chinese are coming and have already made serious inroads into your business...CONGRATULATIONS from one who was once able to buy Zenoah engines at your already inflated dealer prices, but no longer can...I am one of Zenoah engine's biggest boosters, and will always take better care of my/our customers than you ever will.....
FWIW, one of my customers told me he called Horizon tech support for some info about his GT80....He was told by your tech rep on the phone that he should break in his GT80 at high rpm speed so that the pistons could go all the way up in the bores...GREAT information [:@]
FWIW...I don't know if things have changed, but the retail price of a piston for a G62 from a Red Max chainsaw dealer was $21.95...Your DEALER price was about $28.95...GREAT way to do business and protect dealers....
If i'm lyin I'm dyin...Moderators, if Horizon makes you delete this, we'll understand...
10-20-2008, 01:02 PM
#6
RE: Too little, Too late
no complaints to me yet 
I think ralph has a point, the business model is def changing. I am not going to pretend to know the how's and why's but the Chinese knock off motors are starting to get better as they figure out the odds and ends of making reliable motors.. Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
I think ralph has a point, the business model is def changing. I am not going to pretend to know the how's and why's but the Chinese knock off motors are starting to get better as they figure out the odds and ends of making reliable motors.. Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
10-20-2008, 01:20 PM
#7
RE: Too little, Too late
ORIGINAL: SunShyne
Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
Mark
10-20-2008, 04:47 PM
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RE: Too little, Too late
ORIGINAL: mmattockx
..............I doubt they will make the effort to adapt given the attitude they have shown to this point, but you never know...
Mark
ORIGINAL: SunShyne
Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
Mark
10-20-2008, 05:30 PM
#9
RE: Too little, Too late
So much for Horizon as they made their bed so make them lie on it, but the real dark side of the coin is what will happen to us Zen lovers when Ralph and Bill stops working on them .... heaven help us then.
Karol
Karol
10-20-2008, 05:36 PM
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RE: Too little, Too late
ORIGINAL: karolh
...., but the real dark side of the coin is what will happen to us Zen lovers when Ralph and Bill stops working on them .... heaven help us then.
Karol
...., but the real dark side of the coin is what will happen to us Zen lovers when Ralph and Bill stops working on them .... heaven help us then.
Karol
bad ju ju.. bad ju ju take that back [:-]
10-20-2008, 05:45 PM
#11
RE: Too little, Too late
ORIGINAL: apriliamille
eek! dont think it.
bad ju ju.. bad ju ju take that back [:-]
ORIGINAL: karolh
...., but the real dark side of the coin is what will happen to us Zen lovers when Ralph and Bill stops working on them .... heaven help us then.
Karol
...., but the real dark side of the coin is what will happen to us Zen lovers when Ralph and Bill stops working on them .... heaven help us then.
Karol
bad ju ju.. bad ju ju take that back [:-]
]Karol
10-20-2008, 05:47 PM
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RE: Too little, Too late
ORIGINAL: mmattockx
As Ralph noted, Horizon got comfortable with a monopoly on the Zenoah line and charged extortionate prices because of that monopoly. That attitude, coupled with very inadequate customer service has left them open to competition who are making quality products at reasonable margins and offering actual support to their customers. Horizon will have to adapt or fade in the face of this competition. I doubt they will make the effort to adapt given the attitude they have shown to this point, but you never know...
Mark
ORIGINAL: SunShyne
Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
Good for consumers, bad for Horizon
Mark
10-20-2008, 07:03 PM
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RE: Too little, Too late
Good to hear you again, Ralph. I plan to send you a couple of engines this winter once the snow starts to blow.
I think the Chinese engines and the poor dollar exchange rate against the euro is making selling the European engines a bit tough too.
Elson
I think the Chinese engines and the poor dollar exchange rate against the euro is making selling the European engines a bit tough too.
Elson
10-20-2008, 07:58 PM
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RE: Too little, Too late
The great thing about Zenoahs you don't have to get them from Horizon. There are literally thousands of them sitting on shelves out there. If you love Z's like I do and you are vigilant, you can find good deals on the whole line of them.
I have found new and barely used Zenoahs online for half price or less and sent them to Ralph to be converted.
So now I have engines that will last 10 or more years with a lifetime guarantee on the electronics at a value price.
I have found new and barely used Zenoahs online for half price or less and sent them to Ralph to be converted.
So now I have engines that will last 10 or more years with a lifetime guarantee on the electronics at a value price.
10-20-2008, 08:37 PM
#19
RE: Too little, Too late
I agree wholeheartedly. Unfortunately I've never had the opportunity of meeting either of those two gentlemen, but just in talking to Ralph via the telephone as I've done on a few occassions, and his willingness to share his vast knowledge of our engines and the excellent quality of his work speaks volumes of the man. An A+ in my book.
Karol
Karol
10-20-2008, 09:38 PM
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RE: Too little, Too late
I've never done business with Horizon directly but judging from the threads on here regarding their price increases on EVERYTHING plus the lack of service they seem to think they can do about anything they like and still survive. Only time will tell!
10-20-2008, 09:51 PM
#21
RE: Too little, Too late
I just want to say that I am sure glad I printed out many of Ralph,s postings starting years ago. I knew if my puter crashed or I lost my internet service...at least I would have his data printed out. also times when you do not feel good...again just pritnt it out and use Ralph,s good tips later on. Like Karolh said "it speaks volumes of the man. I was real lucky to meet Ralph at a USRA Pylon race a couple of months ago. I wish I could have talked with him more but he had to help with the event and We had to leave for home....a very very long drive. It was worth it all...and would do it again. Best regards Capt,n P. S. Take care Ralph
10-21-2008, 12:14 AM
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RE: Too little, Too late
I must second that. I cannot say enough good things about Horizon service. I sent in a pcm xp9303 for service that they some how lost in shipping. Three days later I had a brand new 2.4 X9303 and R921 receiver for no charge. They have always taken care of anything I have sent in. Horizon doesn't make the products they just sell them.
10-21-2008, 09:42 AM
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RE: Too little, Too late
You will get EXACTLY what you deserve, the Chinese are coming and have already made serious inroads into your business
10-21-2008, 10:14 AM
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RE: Too little, Too late
Henry is sending me one soon, will report....One of the pictures shows a cylinder like a G62...About time someone made a rear carb reed valve engine from a 62...