Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

I recently purchased my first actual gasser that I plan on keeping. I have successfully started the motor and it has great power and idles at a very low speed. The issue gets to be when I range check. If I get more than 20 -30 feet away the throttle jumps to 1/2 to full throttle until I move back towards the plane. There is no ground on the ignition or spark plug cap. I ran a plastic throttle cable thinking this could be the issue and also increased the distance between the CDI and RX.

The motor came with a Torch L7RTC.

Should there be a ground hooked up to the plug / cap? Should I try a different plug? Need to get it figured out before I maiden this biplane!

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Beautiful plane. Make sure the cap is pushed ALL the way down on the plug, if you don't you'll get RFI.

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

The ground is normally achieved through the braid and spark plug cap however adding another ground wire from the CDI to the engine wont hurt. Make sure your plug is an "R" type - resistive. This is normally identified by an R in the spark plug number. Ensure no metal to metal contact - I see you have already addressed this on the throttle linkage, and place the Rx as far away as possible from the CDI. Whether using PPM, PCM or 2.4 - make sure you address these issues as PCM or 2.4 will only mask the problem - not solve it.

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Cwhipple,
First of, welcome to the RCGF world of engines, I am sure the engine will serve you well for many years to come.
By the way that you describe not seeing any grounding of the ignition, I am sure that you have not pushed the plug cap all the way onto the sparkplug. The ignition is grounded by the outer (shiny metal) cap that surrounds the sparkplug as you push it over. Now, this is an extremely tight fit, and requires a bit of pushing force to secure it to the plug.
The outer cap must actually split open around the bottom a bit for it to sit tight. Please do not bend the plug cap, you can however turn it on.

I am sure that this is the issue, as the Rcexl Ignitions are very well shielded and do not produce stray RF.
The plug is a resistor plug, and the best of the Torch range, and as you say it runs well, your problem is not here.
The 45cc RCGF, although not the most modern reed valve rear induction etc. is a very user friendly engine, that will run like a clock for hundreds of gallons and provide you with power not normally seen by a 45cc engine.

Hope this helps, shout if you need anything else.
Andreas

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

The plug cap is loosely connected to the plug at this time. It is a resister plug. I will attempt to force the cap on the plug today and let you all know the results.

Chris

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Hi chris, thats where it all comes from, push it on tight (you should just barely see the hex of the plug) and your troubles will be history.
The Torch is a resistor plug it's a good plug.

Andreas

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

It is IMPORTANT to have that spring inside the metal cap
or you will at times loose the ground and get ALL SORTS
of servo glitching....

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Hey Chris

I can confirm what driesbabe is saying in regards to the rcexl ignition systems. They are all but bulletproof when used properly. Some of the caps that plug onto the spark plug can be tight and they need that extra push to connect.
The RCGF 45 engine is a joy to use. I have an old ACE BIG BINGO, and this engine hauls the plane across the sky. I know that you will have a blast with this engine. The plane you have it in is perfect!

Best to you.

Henry

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Ok guys.. I can walk about 30 large steps away from the plane until I get flutter in the rudder, throttle and elevator. That is with the antennae down. Is that enough range? I have placed the plug cap on completely. I have changed the rudder servo from a metal gear to a nylon gear. I have changed receivers from a R127 to R168.

Is 30 paces enough range?

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

What do you get with the engine off? If it's similar you're good to go.[sm=thumbup.gif]

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

I have three times the range without the motor running................................[>:]

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

At least one hundred feet (35 paces) is usually considered the acceptable range; however, you shouldn't see a drastic reduction in range with the engine running. Where is your throttle servo? Do you have a metal or carbon fiber pushrod going to the engine or choke? You should have around one foot of space between the engine and your radio components.

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

OK... You checked and tightened the spark plug. You pushed the cap on firmly on the spark plug.
We all basically agree that the rcexel unit is robust and should not be the problem.

One thing that you can check right now, is to remove the spark plug wire, and twist the top of the sparkplug. (the metal cap). This part is screwed on, and it is possible that it is loose and rattling. Twist the top part on tight again, reinstall the spark plug wire cap, and give her a go again. This booboo has happened me on occasion with the TORCH plugs.

It is possible that any RF from the spark is getting into the servo wires. One way to check and confirm is to put a ferrite ring on the servo wires. If you now get the range, we know the problem area.

Hope this helps!!

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

What is a ferrite ring? New term for me. I have nylon running to the throttle and manually actuate the choke. I already checked the tip of the plug and it was tight. Tomorrow I am going to pull the ignition and mount it all the way under the motor. That is as far away as I can get. I had a metal servo on the throttle originally and have changed to nylon...

Next question, I hvae no book for the plane. How do I find the CofG if I ever get this thing running![:@]

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

For a pretty good explanation of what a ferrite ring (also known as a choke) go to

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrite_bead


You can buy them at most electronic stores (Radio Shack) or discount electronic surplus stores (on-line too!). These things are easy to get.
Good luck!

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

I thought you did get it running, you said it runs nicely. All you need to do now, is to locate the glitch and you are away. I have had good luck re-routing the antenna when there have been problems.

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

It does run nicely. It just starts to glithc when I am 30+ feet away.

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Chris,
I had the same problem with one of my planes. Here is what I did. I could not really move things around without too much of an effort.
1. Try and locate the problem. Is the noise there always, or is it only there when all servos are plugged in? Unplug them one by one at the receiver and see what happens. (Sometimes vibration makes a bad connection worst)
2.take the antenna out of the plane (that is if it's in the plane) have someone change the antenna orientation as you stand where the glitches start.
(It might be that you are close to something within the plane)
3. Put ferrite beads on the extension wires close to the receiver. (About one inch)
4. Twist the extension wires and then put ferrite beads on.
5. Move everything as far away from the Ignition unit, it's cables and it's battery as possible.
6. Check that the Ignition wires don’t rub against anything e.g. the exhaust.
7. Check all switches for bad connections (bypass them)
I will stand by the saying, that rcexl. Ignitions are very well shielded, I think that your problem is vibration at some connection?
Andreas

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

It's pretty well documented that the vast majority of gas engine glitching issues are blamed on the ignition. What seems to fail to get out after the fact is that the vast majority of what was called an "ignition induced" radio issue turned out to be another component that was either worn out, defective, or improperly installed. The RC Exl ignitions work very well when installed correctly, and it has already been noted that the plug cap was previously improperly installed. It also possible that the plug cap was damaged internally during an installation and removal process. If the internal cap spring has been stretched out it could be arcing.

Time to go through the rest of the flight system to verify that everything else was done correctly with quality components.

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Tonight I will bypass all the switches. I will also buy a new extension that will allow me to move the ignition further up by the motor. I will add a ground from the ignition to the motor and take a deep breath! If this does not fix the problem I am not sure what to do. I have tried multiple rx's with no success. The servos are all brand new Futaba metal gear minus the throttle servo. It is nylon as well as the throttle cable.

I appreciate all your help and we will keep plugging away. WOuld a Ferrite bead placed on the plug wire make a difference?

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Chris,
Is it difficult to start the engine? If you turn the engine over by hand with the ignition on, do you hear a click noise when the magnet passes the hall sensor? If so, then Tired Old man is right, it could be that the cap is damaged and the spark is leaking somewhere.
Andreas

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

The motor fires right up and the only time I hear the spark is when the plug is pulled out of the motor to ensure I am getting good spark. I noticed on my volt watch that it goes crazy when I rev the motor up. That is the lights jump all around.

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Chris,
Judging by your last comment, there are sparks flying somewhere. are you very sure that your plug cap is on tight?
Check it all again with someone if you can, sometimes 4 eyes see more than two.

Andreas

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Chris, By sparks, I mean RF!

RE: Electronic Glitch - 45cc RCGF range issues
 

Oh, by the way bypass the Volt spy also!