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-   -   SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA (https://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/gas-engines-142/8862472-syssa-30cc-gas-made-usa.html)

AJsToyz 11-28-2009 08:44 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
I guess no one should say another word until people get they're engines ? Would love to talk about them but hard to comment on something you don't have. Does it really hurt to talk about the planes they are going in or other engines that were considered??

Truckracer 11-28-2009 09:06 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 

ORIGINAL: AJsToyz

I guess no one should say another word until people get they're engines ? Would love to talk about them but hard to comment on something you don't have. Does it really hurt to talk about the planes they are going in or other engines that were considered??
I guess I'm kind of a hard core old bas***d that would rather hear something intelligent about the subject of the thread or nothing at all. Even if you don't have an engine yet ..... and I understand your pain after waiting 1 day short of 3 months to receive mine, you could ask questions from those of us that now have engines. Or at least something along those lines. Y'all act like a bunch of old ladies at times ......

This isn't a social club, it is a discussion about Todd Syssa's 30 CC engine. Nuff said!

Damn, I'm starting to sound like RCIGN ...... and a whole lot of others that no longer post real technical info to these threads. Shame .... RCU is a great forum!

jedijody 11-28-2009 09:19 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
You're my hero!!!http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f.../thumbs_up.gifhttp://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f.../msn/49_49.gif

Antique 11-28-2009 10:41 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
I'm not saying anything bad about the engine, I had one in my hand at Joe Nall...It's a great engine.
I told Todd to send me one....
Problem with these forums is with mis information...NO 18-6 at 9300 makes 26 lbs of thrust..PERIOD....[>:]

craigteffe 11-28-2009 11:59 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 

ORIGINAL: Truckracer



ORIGINAL: Antique

Lets get real here....Must be numbers from ThrustHp...No 18-6 prop on the planet will give you 26 lbs thrust at 9300 rpm...18 lbs MAYBE....26 is closer to G62 numbers, IMPOSSIBLE to attain with a small engine, piped or not...
I will pay $1000 US dollars to anyone who can send me ANY 30cc class model airplane engine that will show 26lbs static thrust, measured with a scale on the tail wheel of my Phaeton 90 bipe.....Pipe or not...
Anyone ????
Ya know Antique (that would be RC for those who don's know) I posted my comments about my first impressions from actually running this engine in an airplane back on post # 1157. I thought that might stir up some discussion about this engine but the comments have been few at best. I stated that my engine turns a Xoar 18-6 at 8600 RPM the first day out and that the engine out performs my several year old Saito 180. The performance level of the SAP 180 meets my expectations.

From there, and after flying the engine several times since then, I think that Todd has the basis of a really great engine but it isn't quite where it should be yet. And .... I'll leave it at that. If serious modelers want to take the discussion further, I'm here to comment.

Frankly, this thread has turned into so much social babble .... very little discussion of Todd's engine.
So what are the short falls that you see with this engine?
Are you still using the 18X6 prop?
I have one on order and would like your thoughts. Todd told me that my engine would be shipped out today or Monday, I will wait and see if he delivers on his word.

I agree that these threads are becoming too social, I get these emails and updates just to see people talking about nothing to do with the engines. Its like these guys are just trying to get thier post numbers up.

Start other threads called social banter that way we don't have to look at all the crud.

PlaneKrazee 11-29-2009 12:28 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
Antique, Ralph?

I just cut and pasted the post. Ignore the thrust claims and look at the rpm.

As a side note for those interested, Tower now lists the DLE30 on thier site. With the $60.00 off deal they are only $260.00. They are backordered 'til January but hey, so is the SAP 180. he he.:D

PacificNWSkyPilot 11-29-2009 12:50 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
I listen when something relevant is posted. Until that happens, I'll talk about anything else associated with the engine, including what planes would be a good match.. Like it or not, that's relevant stuff. It's not OUR fault that we don't have the engines to talk about other aspects. When folks who have them DO talk about them, we all shut up and listen just fine. Then we've got YOU telling us we should shut up, a guy from California who is Todd's competitor telling you you're his hero, and another competitor calling the numbers lies. You don't seem to have a problem with that, though.

Oh, yeah, THIS ain't custard. Custard doesn't smell as bad as THIS does.

You know, I'm building a plane, doing a plane build here on RCU, and for the I-don't-know-how-many-ith-time it didn't come again as promised this week, so I've been juggling balls and doing whatever to try and keep the folks attention. I'm trying to stay cheerful, but you know, I'm just not too dang happy right now. Let's just say you wouldn't LIKE me when I'm angry. I'll try the restrained route by telling you that my social babble has as much right to be here as your grumbling about my social babble in the absence of ALL news about these engines. And we socialites, the whole lot of us, we all are waiting for our engines, and we're not bringing competitors in here with us, we're just waiting for our engines.

Deny it if you like. I'm certainly not the hero of the guy in California who sells gassers.

I'm the guy putting one of Todd's Engines in a plane being built right here in the great forums of RCU. Or trying to.

~ J ~

AJsToyz 11-29-2009 07:01 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
Sorry for being social , a few of us are just that way.:D I will take any good input on this engine though.

Andy

AA5BY 11-29-2009 08:47 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
This thread is intriguing. Most who compose a list of data do so honestly. Is the 26lbs thrust possible? I'd think the claim needs as much disclaiming as proving. A Zenoah G-20 stock will produce something exceeding 10 lbs of thrust... I know this because it will take my 10lb USL straight up and out of sight. Tony Clark claims that a pipe on it will increase power by 40%... so that is 14lbs of thrust on a 20cc.

The 18x6 Vess is evidently a hot prop because if one has followed the discussions on the MLD-28, it is the prop of choice by those flying that engine after having tested everything else. Could a 30cc engine produced 12lbs more thrust than a 20cc Zenoah? I'd not bet the back forty that it couldn't. Evidently the 18x6 Vess is simply more efficient that any thing else out there and pipes are capable of upping the power by 40%. The results are a bit staggering but unbelievable? I'm not so sure.

Syssa Aircraft 11-29-2009 09:10 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
The testing was done on an engine test stand with a linear bearing and a digital pull meter. Frankly, I expected to see somewhere around 22 lbs with the pipe...I was shocked to see that much as well with the pipe...but the digital scale is accurate..and it was done a couple times with results that were very consistent. Normally on a new engine, with stock muffler, (without the tuned pipe) it is somewhere between 17.5-18.5 pounds depending on the air density. There was no computer generated thrust numbers here...just numbers that were taken right off the scale meter on the test stand. This was around 200-300 ft ASL and the air temp was around 55 F or so....so the air was nice....but even at 80 degrees ambient, I'm sure it will be about 24 lbs or so.

This will be a blast to fly in the 78 EF Extra that is designed to accept the pipe that was used. Cant wait to get it!

AJsToyz 11-29-2009 09:16 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 


ORIGINAL: craigteffe


ORIGINAL: Truckracer



ORIGINAL: Antique

Lets get real here....Must be numbers from ThrustHp...No 18-6 prop on the planet will give you 26 lbs thrust at 9300 rpm...18 lbs MAYBE....26 is closer to G62 numbers, IMPOSSIBLE to attain with a small engine, piped or not...
I will pay $1000 US dollars to anyone who can send me ANY 30cc class model airplane engine that will show 26lbs static thrust, measured with a scale on the tail wheel of my Phaeton 90 bipe.....Pipe or not...
Anyone ????
Ya know Antique (that would be RC for those who don's know) I posted my comments about my first impressions from actually running this engine in an airplane back on post # 1157. I thought that might stir up some discussion about this engine but the comments have been few at best. I stated that my engine turns a Xoar 18-6 at 8600 RPM the first day out and that the engine out performs my several year old Saito 180. The performance level of the SAP 180 meets my expectations.

From there, and after flying the engine several times since then, I think that Todd has the basis of a really great engine but it isn't quite where it should be yet. And .... I'll leave it at that. If serious modelers want to take the discussion further, I'm here to comment.

Frankly, this thread has turned into so much social babble .... very little discussion of Todd's engine.
So what are the short falls that you see with this engine?
Are you still using the 18X6 prop?
I have one on order and would like your thoughts. Todd told me that my engine would be shipped out today or Monday, I will wait and see if he delivers on his word.

I agree that these threads are becoming too social, I get these emails and updates just to see people talking about nothing to do with the engines. Its like these guys are just trying to get thier post numbers up.

Start other threads called social banter that way we don't have to look at all the crud.
Ok , just for the fun of it I put the 18-6 prop in a prop power calculator. These are not exact but do come in close enough for a baseline. The 18-6 Vess @ 9300 rpms will produce 21.21 lbs static thrust. No its not 26 but its pretty good for the size engine.

Andy

PlaneKrazee 11-29-2009 09:25 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
The Vess 18X6 is within 50 rpm +- of a APC 18X6W.

The APC doesn't flex but the Vess will spool up faster and will help save a crankshaft in a crash or propstrike. With the Syssa's small diameter crank I would probably recommend the Vess to be safe if you think you might contact mother earth.


If APC made a 19X7W it might be a good prop for this size gas engine and 3D. At 8000 rpm it would give about the same thrust and speed as a 18X6 @9000rpm but would make less noise. The 19X8W is a little too much to give max thrust and speed.

captinjohn 11-29-2009 09:53 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 


ORIGINAL: AJsToyz

Sorry for being social , a few of us are just that way.:D I will take any good input on this engine though.

Andy
I noticed that Andy...I see a lot of small photos with a purple creature!!!!:D:D I was hoping to see more photos of that SYSSA 30 doing anything...even just setting on a airplane!![X(] Remember, a photo is worth a thousand words. Best Regads Capt,n

AJsToyz 11-29-2009 10:52 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
I might be off for a week in December, if so I'll post some pics with my SAP 180 if I have it. I'll even post some tach #s no matter what the temp! :D

Have purple dude will travel. ;)

Andy

MTK 11-29-2009 11:06 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 


ORIGINAL: Antique

Lets get real here....Must be numbers from ThrustHp...No 18-6 prop on the planet will give you 26 lbs thrust at 9300 rpm...18 lbs MAYBE....26 is closer to G62 numbers, IMPOSSIBLE to attain with a small engine, piped or not...
I will pay $1000 US dollars to anyone who can send me ANY 30cc class model airplane engine that will show 26lbs static thrust, measured with a scale on the tail wheel of my Phaeton 90 bipe.....Pipe or not...
Anyone ????
I suggest that you buy the engine, equip it with the ESC40G pipe, set the baffle at 27 1/8" from the plug straight line, use the Vess prop, use a 100:1 fuel mix and run the engine in a 55 degree day with RH around 40%. Then stick your spring scale on the tail wheel and run it up. Then send your money to me....or, better yet, Todd

If an 18.1x10 apc prop turned around 7800 and produced around 21 lbs of thrust, it is quite likely that a 1500 rpm boost with a 6" pitch would indeed produce the values we found. I'll take the practical over the calculated any day

Matt Kebabjian, one of the three who witnessed and partook in the testing

PS- Subsequent running of the engine in a pattern test bed revealed that more power is available than we saw at first.... we were running the engine lean at the shop tests. The same 18.1x10 apc and pipe combination flew the overweight (12 lbs is overweight in pattern) and large model (nearly 1200 square inch wing) with excellent authority, better than the OS 160 that was in the model. It convinced me to use the engine, in essence as is, in my new pattern design, replacing the ZDZ40. The 40 cc produces a little more power but at the expense of weight, which I can't afford

Antique 11-29-2009 11:30 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
I'm not saying the engine will not turn an 18-10 at 7800rpm...It will...
ANY 18 inch prop with a 6 inch pitch, even at 10,000 rpm, makes only 22 lbs thrust...ANY SIX pitch prop....
A Mejzlik 18-6 at 9000 rpm makes a little over 17 lbs measured thrust...
A piped G26 turns 10,000 with the same prop....
I have a DLE30 here, and a tuned pipe...It turns an 18-8 prop at 8300 with the STOCK muffler...I have a Mac's Products tuned pipe, already tested it...forgot to write down the rpm, will do later..
Maybe Todd know the thrust, I'm quite sure he has not seen 26 lbs....
Todd ????
FWIW... I had Todd's engine in my hand at Joe Nall, told him at that time to send me one..If he remembers and has an extra, he will..

MTK 11-29-2009 12:43 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
1 Attachment(s)

ORIGINAL: MTK



ORIGINAL: Antique

Lets get real here....Must be numbers from ThrustHp...No 18-6 prop on the planet will give you 26 lbs thrust at 9300 rpm...18 lbs MAYBE....26 is closer to G62 numbers, IMPOSSIBLE to attain with a small engine, piped or not...
I will pay $1000 US dollars to anyone who can send me ANY 30cc class model airplane engine that will show 26lbs static thrust, measured with a scale on the tail wheel of my Phaeton 90 bipe.....Pipe or not...
Anyone ????
I suggest that you buy the engine, equip it with the ESC40G pipe, set the baffle at 27 1/8'' from the plug straight line, use the Vess prop, use a 100:1 fuel mix and run the engine in a 55 degree day with RH around 40%. Then stick your spring scale on the tail wheel and run it up. Then send your money to me....or, better yet, Todd

If an 18.1x10 apc prop turned around 7800 and produced around 21 lbs of thrust, it is quite likely that a 1500 rpm boost with a 6'' pitch would indeed produce the values we found. I'll take the practical over the calculated any day

Matt Kebabjian, one of the three who witnessed and partook in the testing

PS- Subsequent running of the engine in a pattern test bed revealed that more power is available than we saw at first.... we were running the engine lean at the shop tests. The same 18.1x10 apc and pipe combination flew the overweight (12 lbs is overweight in pattern) and large model (nearly 1200 square inch wing) with excellent authority, better than the OS 160 that was in the model. It convinced me to use the engine, in essence as is, in my new pattern design, replacing the ZDZ40. The 40 cc produces a little more power but at the expense of weight, which I can't afford
Here's a pic of the engine mounted. The stand offs are installed on a soft mount of my design, which itself is installed onto firewall. It gets crowded quickly because the choke baffle requires a minimun stand off length of 1.565 to clear. The engine does not require a soft mount... engine hardly shakes at any rpm down to 2500 or so. At idle it shakes a little bit but it's minor. Pattern peopl soft mount as much for saving equipment due to vibration as well as for noise reduction. My chin cowl just clears the cylinder

Matt Kebabjian

GSK 11-29-2009 01:38 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
Todd ,
Can you give us some idea how many motors you have supplied to date please?.
My mate is about to cancel his order as he is getting very frustrated with the delay in suppling his order after having paid for it .
I am trying very hard to convince him to wait but it is getting harder .

Thanks
Graeme

PacificNWSkyPilot 11-29-2009 02:04 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
GSK,

What's the order number?

Jimbo

GSK 11-29-2009 02:53 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
Not sure ,he has just left to travel home after staying for a few days . .
I think it is about 310 ,or around that number some where .
I hope he will hang on but he is getting very frustrated

Graeme

PlaneKrazee 11-29-2009 05:21 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 

[/quote]
My chin cowl just clears the cylinder

Matt Kebabjian
[/quote]


The Syssa is very short coupled from the propdriver to the cylinder.

PlaneKrazee 11-29-2009 07:00 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 


ORIGINAL: stevenchao



ORIGINAL: PlaneKrazee

Is that two weeks before xmas?;)
That is low, man. We all run into unforseened issues when introducing product. Heck, we thought we would selling the DPM (Dave Patrick) Super Cubs for a year already!!! Yet we are still on our multiple prototype. The important thing is that SYSSA produces a quality engine that they will be proud of. You go guys, Produce something that we can all be proud of.

Peace,
Steven Chao,
CERMARK
For many,

Two weeks before Christmas won't even be when they get an engine.:eek:

DamonR 11-29-2009 09:39 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
My Funtana is almost ready to fly, just waiting for a Graph Tech tail gear. I had to cut out more of the firewall to fit the the choke than I expected, but it is working. Hope we have good weather this weekend for the maiden.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHRi_A7jCIo[/youtube]

PacificNWSkyPilot 11-29-2009 11:25 PM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
Graeme,

Mine is 303 and it was supposed to go out anytime now. You friend should hang on, he's right there.

~ J ~

Tugboat1st 11-30-2009 12:15 AM

RE: SYSSA 30CC GAS MADE IN USA
 
I think Jim needs to go buy a cheap Chinese engine and take a Midoll.


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