Single battery setup question?
 

Hey guys I am putting together a Seagull Yak 54. I am going to put a Zenoah G-20 in it. My question is Troybuilt sells a device that you plug into the reciever and then to the battery plug on the Ignition and you use the same battery for the reciever. Has anybody used these and do they work OK to keep the reciever for getting interferance. I would like to do this setup for the weight savings??

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I believe you are referring to the Zeus by 42% Products. This new item just popped up for discussion around here recently, and I haven't heard feedback from those actually using them yet. I do know that I would recommend moving to a CH ignition circuit for a much lower draw ignition. Running the OEM high draw circuit with a product like this would be scary without a huge battery, which conflicts with the goal all together :)

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_92...tm.htm#9254158

ValleyView RC is also selling them:

http://www.valleyviewrc.com/Zeus%20f...20Products.htm

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I have fromco 2600 battery now in the one that I have in my Corsair and it does drain that battery quick. I plan on getting a new G-20 for the Seagull and I have heard that Horizon is getting a better Ignition for the motor. If not YES I will be replacing it with a RCEXL unit.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

The battery itself is a great absorber of spikes and RF noise.

I may be old fashioned, but I prefer to keep them separate. This gives me more flexibility in weight and balance.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Myself and my friend have at least 12 50cc gas planes flying on ONE A123 2300ma battery
Some with 8 servos and smoke systems
Lighter than a ni cad / nimd of that size and have MUCH more power..

We place a 1001N diod in front of the ignition to play it safe...

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

No thanks. I don't care how many people have done it.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

There are quite a few people that fly 2.4 mHz systems using one source of power for receiver and ignition pack successfully without a Zeus for quite some time now. I can't remember reading any instances of a person loosing a plane due to RF noise when using a single power source with a 2.4 system.
Has anyone ever hooked everything up to a scope with and without the Zeus device to see how much RF noise is actually getting to the receiver with a 2.4 set up?

Greg

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

It's always an option when flying on a 2.4 system, although ignition manufacturers recommend against it. For the insignificant amount of weight incurred from using a separate battery and switch that's offset by the enormous amount of additional rf safety I wouldn't do it. If you're flying a plane so small it can't handle the weight of an ignition battery it might be better off glow or electric powered.

If you're flying a 72mHz system you might be considered a couple bricks out of balance to run a single battery receiver/ignition system. I sometimes think manufacturers of certain products are trying to artificially move up that airplane expiration date. They are the only ones that end up with actual benefits from some of the products out there.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I guess I wouldn't be looking at it as the cost of another battery pack, or the weight savings of not having to haul around another battery pack.
I am looking at it as the convenience of a single battery chemistry. I can usually charge the two 2300 A123 in 20 minutes, but the 1700 mAh NiCad pack takes a few hours. By using A123 batteries with a 2.4 system, I can eliminate the need for a second charger, and I can be charged up and ready to fly for the day in 20 minutes or less.

Greg

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I ran a similar setup in my Ulti with one A123 pack. I added another set of positve and negative wires to the pack and used another switch for the ignition. I used a Fromeco regulator on the ignition side to step down the voltage. Worked great on 2.4. How far down does the 1001N drop the voltage?

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

While the debate goes on about the "one for all" battery or not, in your specific circumstance I'd recommend against it. One of the few gripes about the Zenoah G-20 is the comparitive high current drain of the stock ignition. Pretty much every review I've read on the G-20 has mentioned the high draw compared to pretty much anything out there. Not bad, it runs great.... just that the ignition is "thirsty". Also, the instructions for the G-20 are very clear not to run anything but a 4.8V ignition battery - what's the output voltage of the devices mentioned above, and are they adjustable if higher than 4.8-5.0V?

Even with the electronic 'gadget' in there to isolate any 'noise' from the rest of the system, all of that current draw from the ignition is still going through your receiver. Can it take it... probably. Is it a risk that I would take...... no. Especially in a 2.4GHz system drop the voltage a little low and you get a reboot. Ohm's law being what it is, that higher current draw could accomplish just that.

Just my 2-cents worth.....

BJH

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I use only one charger to handle A-123, nimh, nicad, lead acid, or other lithium types. If you need several chargers to handle your batteries you've selected the wrong charger.

Not being arguementative but I've found that I obtain more than enough time on a single 2,000 ma AA nimh than I can use in a days flying with a 100 cc twin. So there's no need to re-charge an ignition battery at the field. If it's a multi day event I just do the charge at the end of the flying day. It's a rare day when I even have a need to re-charge the A-123's at the field. I get in 5 good flights before considering a charge, and that point still has a couple of flights remaining on the flight batts. I typically fly only 50 and 100cc sized planes so my stuff doesn't have much in the line of weight constraints. Others may have a different situation to deal with.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Or you can run dual 1100 a123's and have a full redundancy path to your only connection to the plane for .88oz (25g) weight penalty. You are now protected from switch failures, battery failures, connector failures, batteries coming unmounted in hard 3D flight, higher amp supply to RX & servos via 2 switch leads, cheaper switches, etc. all for the cost of an a123 (built em myself for under $20 each). Not to mention it might actually be cheaper because you can get away with using cheaper switches since you're running em redundant and don't need fancy failsafe or dual output lead switches. At least that's my conclusion on this stuff. :D I also use the diodes to ign.

Egan

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

TOM

I have both the Cellpro Multi4, Cellpro 4S, the Triton, and an Alpha4 charger. As you can see I can charge about anything. I guess it all gets down to the fact that I'm just too damn lazy to change my charger for a different battery chemistry, and to look forward 1 day to see what the weather is going to be like the next day. I wake up and say "this would be a good day to go out to the flying field". I don't want to be bothered having to try to shove a charge into those NiCad cells before I go out flying. Without the NiCads to hold my lazy butt back, I can leave for the flying field in about 20 minutes using a single battery setup.:D

I haven't converted yet, but I am talking myself into it.

Greg

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Go ahead there's plenty of Kool Aid to go around.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Why not just run an 1100 A123 in place of the nicad for ignition? I'm in the same boat you are, never know when the weather is going to be nice enough to fly.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I have two 2300mAh A123 batteries to balance out my Yak. It would be nice to just be able to run on these two batteries, and then I wouldn't have to buy any more batteries. When I remove the 1700 mAh pack the balance will be about perfect. I already have a voltage regulator to reduce the voltage for my electronic ignition.
I wish this question would get answered once and for all. I haven't read in RCU about anyone crashing a plane because of RF interference when using a single battery source for receiver and ignition, when flying with a 2.4 system, but you still have the people that still insist that you will certainly crash if you do this.[:@]

Greg

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Greg

You can hook it up like you want to and let us know how it works? Then we will all know.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Hey...You guys aren't throwing me under the bus.

Our flying season is over, so you will have to wait until March or April. I figure by then others will try.

Greg

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I think Sunday was my last flying day until late March or early April so I'm out of business at the flying field too.

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Good points but there's another option that's fairly easy to live with. I switched over to Eneloop nimh ignition batteries that I obtained from Batteries America. I was having some of the same thoughts you are but didn't want to deal with the risk management. The Eneloops hold a charge faaaaarrrr longer than general nimh batteries. matter of fact, up to about 90% of that charge for the better part of 6 months or so. Once I charge the Eneloop and the A-123's I just store and forget about it for a month or more at a time.

My God man, all ya gotta do is push a couple of buttons to set a different chemistry...;):)

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

I told you I was lazy.:D

Thanks for the lead on the eneloops. They certainly look good. That web site has about everything except A-123 cells.

Thanks again,
Greg

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

The diode is a IN4001 from Radio Shack @ 2 FOR 99 cents....
Each diode drops around 1.4 volts, so two would be almost 3vdc...
We have just been using one and works fine..
If your ignition REQUIRES 4.8 than I would use a regulator...
Walt

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

There's a thread on Flying Giants about the one TB sells. Zues is another one.

CR

RE: Single battery setup question?
 

Every 1N4001 through 6 series diode I have ever used has dropped .7 volts. I'd really like to see in one drop 1.4 volts.
Just my experience.
John