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Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Old 08-06-2008, 03:23 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

DWR,
Great!!! How many flights did you get in, and how was the landing? I am on a 600' paved strip with a pond at each end, so landings for me are a bit hairy every time. What is your field like?
It's a crowd pleaser, aint it?
Old 08-06-2008, 03:36 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hi Richard, The elevator trim was up and it took a bunch, like a dozen clicks. I did do a lot of full throttle flying and the plane is VERY stable. I flys very much like the GP GB only smoother.
The speed looks good and fast and I would say scale like. I used the recommended 75mm balance point. Wind was near calm so I got no help there on landing. Flew just the two flights but will fly again tomorrow. Already checked out everything post flight and found no issues. DWR
Old 08-06-2008, 03:44 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hi Jim, we are lucky and have very long fields at near 90 degrees to each other. Mostly cow pastures next to us. No trees close to approaches unless we really swing way out wide. It is about as perfect as you could ask for. It is an all grass field. That makes takeoff/landing easier too. I have seen your video and your field looks way tight! But that makes you guys good pilots.

And yes everybody just loves the Gee Bee. It is a show stopper for sure. Of course everyone is most interested in the landings. If this plane does nothing else it sure demands full attention on landing. What a rush! After two flights it was getting hot out and I had had enough for the first day. Wanted to get it back to the shop and check it inside and out. DWR.
Old 08-06-2008, 04:00 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hey DWR,
If you think of it, can you check your dihedral. One thing that seems to be different on all of the carf Gee Bee's is the dihedral. The manual tells nothing about it. The full size gee bee had 4 1/2 deg. I find that my plane flys better with about 4 deg. It will be interesting to see what yours and RichardGee's has.
Old 08-06-2008, 04:36 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

DD,

Not sure how to accurately check my plane's dihedral ?

It seems to be set by the mating of the flat surfaces of the wing root and filet, but can certainly vary based upon flying wire tension/length.

How do you recommend we take an accurate reading of actual dihedral?

If I can do it, I will check and post.
Old 08-06-2008, 04:56 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

RichardGee,

I used a smart level. I guess you could use an incidence meter or any type of digital level. Just lay it on the spar area with the plane as level as possible. The 4 1/2 deg. is each side, not combined. Won't be long till your airborne also.
Old 08-06-2008, 04:58 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Dwr,,Congrats! It gives us all a boost to know that there is another successful flying Gee Bee out there.
Gives me more resolve to stay busy on mine,but I foresee mine being a winter build and spring test flight
I'm currently building the motor I hope to use,and that is a project in itself.I'm converting a 123cc Stihl O84 Chainsaw, and should be able to test run by the end of this month., Danny
Old 08-06-2008, 06:25 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Jim, I checked mine with an incidence meter after I had tuned the flying wires and got 3 1/2 degrees. I think the number could vary 1 degree due to flying wire set up. Most important is to get both sides the same and of course as square as possible to the root on the fuse. Oh by the way I did put in the aileron differential suggested in the manual and the rolls I did today were very axial. I think
I won't be messing with that. Did you put the differential in your set up? DWR.
Old 08-06-2008, 06:31 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hotrod, thankx for that. Sounds like 123cc will be plenty. What will it weigh? And hey, winter project? I didn't think Texas was up north? DWR.
Old 08-06-2008, 06:42 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Jim, come to think of it there is likely some variation in dihedral due to the who is measuring and the calibration of the tool. That could easily account for plus or minus half a degree. DWR
Old 08-06-2008, 07:21 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

DWR,

I am at this point just fine tuning and experimenting. My plane flys very well now but I would still like to try a bit less dihedral just to satisfy my curiosity. I am using differential in the ailerons, 2 to 1 (twice the up as down) and that works well. Good luck in the morning, I am flying as well. Jim
Old 08-06-2008, 10:43 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Dwr,We are north here in Texas,just north of the Gulf of Mexico ! Where, in the middle of winter, the temps approach freezing sometimes.
But it does get dark early and that gives me more time to retreat to my shop to build.
As for the Stihl 7.4, as of yet,I have only weighed the components and looks like it will be around 7-8 lbs.Knowing that I will need the noseweight, I am leaving the magneto ignition for now.
A couple of questions,first after you added all the elevator trim ,how much was the elevators up from neutral after landing?
Secondly,how do you guys get to fly during the days in the middle of the week? Retired? Self employed?or Independently wealthy?
Some of us have jobs and are envious of you guys!
Best of luck,Danny
Old 08-07-2008, 03:14 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Bad news. The first flight went well, no problems. On take off on the second flight I was thinking how nice it tracks and climbs out when the engine quit. Crap. I was already 90 degrees to the left of my takeoff heading and had pretty good altitude so I stayed in the turn and had it pointed back to the field with still a good amount altitude. It was at that point I found out that the little pig with no engine running has a glide ratio of about one to one. It was obvious I was not gonna make the landing strip so I took what I had and set up to land in the tall grass off the strip. long story short
I have two wings to replace. One tip came off just outboard of the flying wires the other didn't depart but cracked top and bottom. Be advised that the laminated ply spars stop just outside the
flying wire locations and thats where the BALSA spars start.

Post mortum showed the clunk tube had departed the back of the stopper. I had transfered this tank from my Extra and since it was working just fine when I pulled it I did not pull it apart for a rebuild.
Stupid! That bad decision cost me big. Oh well. Remember to check EVERYTHING. ASSUME NOTHING. DWR.
Old 08-07-2008, 06:15 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

DWR,
My sympathies!
There is no airplane on earth, past or present, with which a dead engine presents more of a dire problem.
Good God, it's always the smallest things that come back to haunt us, isn't it?

What I have found with these larger, more complex, more expensive airplanes, is that the closer they get in size and price to the real thing, the more diligence they require as far as pre-flights and "annuals."

Certainly, when you transferred your tank, a quick disassembly and check out would have been a great idea...ahhh, 20/20 hindsight...

I have recently taken ownership of a QQ 102" Yak with only a couple flights, and also sold two 50cc IMAC planes. I checked the tanks on all planes and found that the pick up gas line had lost considerable flexibility and should be replaced. I ONLY thought to do this since I experienced a dead stick on an otherwise perfectly reliable plane whose pick up line had developed a "stiffy" and failed to pull fuel if the gas level fell below half.

No matter what brand of gasoline tubing you use, it seems they all get stiff or become loose after a couple months of gas exposure.

Hopefully, you are using "barbs" on all your brass tubes as well as tie wraps or safety wire to secure gas lines as well.

Hope you can get the R2 back in the air soon.
BEST OF LUCK.
Old 08-07-2008, 10:08 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hello!

When you mounted the DA-150 did you mount the motor centered on the firewall or to the right facing front to rear? We noticed the dome has a few degrees of right thrust. Please let me know...

Thanks,

Perry
Old 08-07-2008, 11:35 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

The engine is mounted to the left of center such that with the built-in dome right-thrust, the propeller hub intersects the centerline of the fuselage.

I accomplished this by mounting (bolting) the engine dome and setting the Gee Bee on its tail post - in other words, the Gee Bee is standing upright (nose pointing straight up) resting on a firm surface (rubber mat is perfect) so that the vertical fin does not risk damage, but so that the Gee Bee can sit upright without falling over too easily. It will remain reasonably steady resting on vertical fin (of course, rudder is NOT installed). It is HIGHLY recommended that you steady the fuselage with chairs or other structure on either side so that it is prevented from falling over.

I then set the DA150 on the engine dome and began adjusting its position so that all measurements taken from various positions "around the clock" - fuselage face to crankshaft center - were equal. I did this with a flexible tape measure. This was done in conjuction with "eye-balling" the engine position until all was right.

I marked the engine mounting holes and drilled them out.

I also found that the engine needed to be moved forward approx. 1/4" and built identical plywood plates - one for front of dome to space engine and one for back of dome into which I would sink blind nuts. I epoxied these ply plates front and rear and re-drilled engine mounting holes.

And for the record, I found the dome to be quite flexible such that I could grab the engine propeller hub and move the DA150 quite a bit due to dome flex. While apparently many modelers have flown the Gee Bee like this (with a 15HP engine hammering away), I elected to reinforce the engine dome with an 'T' pattern of ply "joists" that interlocked. This increased dome rigidity by a factor of 10.
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Old 08-07-2008, 11:40 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Approx how far to the left did you mount the motor? When you say left I am assuming standing at the tail looking toward the cowl.

Thanks,

Perry
Old 08-08-2008, 12:40 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

DWR,
Tough luck on the flame-out. It could have ended much worse, no doubt.I hope that you plan to fix and fly!
This fine thread has had build pics,finished plane pics,even flamed,show planes[kudos Dirtydingus!] But to keep everything honest,we need the carnage pics that are such a part of the Gee Bee heritage.
Also know that your mishap will possibly benefit the others here as we all learn from your experience.
Thanks Danny
Old 08-09-2008, 11:02 AM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

FINALLY!!! Gee Bee is balancing at the correct CG - 75mm aft of wing LE - 18% of chord.

Notice rudder servo moved all the way forward and lightening holes cut in rudder front and cockpit back.

These deviations from construction manual go hand in hand with DA150 on nose, TWO 4000 mah 6 cell NiMh battery packs, voltage regulators and DA ignition mounted on back of engine dome, engine air baffling glued and fiberglassed into cowl, a 2700 mah 6v NiMh smoke system pack and smoke pump mounted in front of CG, and both tanks directly over CG.

After battling CG for weeks, it is time to FINISH this porker and fly it!!!
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Old 08-14-2008, 07:49 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hey DWR
How goes the re-build? Are the wings in stock? Any other damage?
Old 08-14-2008, 08:52 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hi guys, I emailed my rep last night about new wings and have not heard back yet. There are a few fixes to make on the fuse but no big deal. The cake frosting let go around one wing root but the glass is ok. also have to repair rudder hinge points but the fin shows no damage. Could have been worse. If the wing tips were stronger it may have torn up the fuse a lot more. $480 bucks for wings tho....ouch.

Richard, glad to see you have the beast ready to go. have you checked the all up weight? Can't wait to here about the maiden. It is a great flier. It tracks very well on takeoff. Just needs a bunch of throttle on approach. I was pumped up on my first flight. If this airplane doesnt get the blood up nothing will. Good luck. DWR.

Old 08-15-2008, 10:02 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hi Guys,

I been reading this thread on and off, I bought one from off RCU awhile back and havent really touched it yet, I have 2 motor choices, Either a DA-150, or 3W QS-150, This model is not a arf in my opinion. I need motivation to finish. And look were it sits now.

Regaurds
Doug
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Old 08-15-2008, 10:19 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Doug,

You are are correct that the CARF R2 is not an "ARF" in the sense that we have come to expect these days... it is TONS 'O WORK, most of it spent engineering controls and fits and functionality of everything.

As far as engine, those who have flown theirs can offer their opinions as far as power requirements. My choice would be the HEAVIER of the two engines. You will NEED the nose weight.

Good Luck.
Richard
Old 08-18-2008, 11:29 PM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Hello!

The Gee Bee is coming along nicely. Ray Powell is doing the construction and with his Engineering background the results thus far seem superb. Yes in the conversations and visits with Ray this plane is not the typical ARF by a long shot to say the least. Please take a look at the pictures and look at the trick plywood tray he has built for the fuel and battery goodies. You will also notice if you look closely at the front of the fuselage you will see 2 dowl pins that the tray slides on and then bolts down at the rear.

Going to the back we are using a fults gear for a tailwheel. The rudder on this plane was off center and that was fixed as well. You may think by looking at the pics that the plane is coming slowly but looks are very deceiving. So far lots of hours have poured into this plane.


Richard Gee - Please tell me how the gyro is working out for you. We are curious...

Regards,

Perry
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Old 08-19-2008, 09:54 AM
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Default RE: Composite-Arf 33% Gee Bee R2 - First Flight - Pics - Videos - L@@K

Perry,

Beautiful job on the Gee Bee guts..!!

I do not have a gyro report as of yet, as I have yet to fly my R2.
Am making some last minute adjustments and plan to maiden this coming weekend, Aug.22, 23.

I will report once I have flown her.

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