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why did you go Large?

Old 05-22-2010, 10:16 PM
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ES CONTROL
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Default why did you go Large?

My question is, why did you go 50 CCs or bigger and do you still fly small planes too?
Name some advantages to go this route and first steps I should take.
Old 05-22-2010, 10:41 PM
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DougB1
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I went first to a 1/4 scale Fokker DR1 because they ( 1/4 scale) fly better than smaller ones and can be seen easier. Then I went to a 1/3 scale Fokker DVII because they can be seen better and fly better than the smaller ones. GOSH, did I just repeat myself LOL Bigger is just more fun to watch and you can put more things in them ( like paintball guns) for sound effects. One draw back is the size, you just about need to get a trailer or a van to haul the bigger planes but what a WOW factor when people watch you start bringing the plane out of your hauler and setting it up, then out comes all the questions from the on lookers. What a rush.
Old 05-22-2010, 10:53 PM
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Edwin
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I can see them better. I still fly smaller 60 size and a few small 400 sized electrics. Electrics arent my first choice. I only do that when I cant get to the field, its a long drive.
Edwin
Old 05-22-2010, 11:03 PM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I like the way the larger planes fly, and they are definitely easier to see. The gas engines leave almost no mess on the plane. My only serious complaint about the glow engine is the oil getting all over the plane and eventually ruining the covering. If you have flown 60 size planes and feel comfortable with them, then a gasser isn't that much of a jump. There are considerations for the larger airframes- using strong enough servos and linkages, higher capacity batteries, and of course having room to store and transport them. Hit a couple of big bird events this summer and you can find out just about everything you need to know before jumping into this segment of the hobby. Most of the guys will be more than willing to show you how they have set up their planes for good flying and safety.
Old 05-23-2010, 03:40 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I happened on to my first big bird, a Nosen 1/4 scale L-4, partially built and for an amazingly good price. That got me started. Since I put a Quadra 42 in the nose I have converted to all gas. Love 'em! Storage in the garage is no problem (hang them from the rafters). The biggest negative is having to deal with transport to and from the field. Worth it to me.

My bigguns are mostly slow birds so ultra high spec servos are not necessary. On the point about big bird events: I used to enjoy going to them, but since they have become the property of the Extra/Edge/Yak "watch me hover!" group I have lost most of my interest.

Flame suit on.

Bedford
Old 05-23-2010, 08:33 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

1. Easier to see (self explanatory)
2. Better wind penetration - not as jumpy on short final, can be flown easily on days that may have previously been considered ""marginal" when flying smaller planes (More flying days available per season).
3. Gas engines. I've just about totally lost interest in nitro/glow power. No electric starter, glow driver or associated equipment to cart around.
Old 05-23-2010, 08:34 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

In one word.....reliability. Yes they are more expensive, but they fly 10 times better than small planes. The gas engines are a set it and forget it kind of thing. no more adjusting the glow engine for an hour only to have the ambient air conditions change. Power to weight is much better and landings are better.

I still have a Precision Aerobatics Addiction that I fly, but after that my smallest plane is 35%
Old 05-23-2010, 08:45 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I started on a 40 but now fly a 60. The 60 is more stable in the wind and can be flown in higher winds compared to the 40. I can't wait to go bigger but like said they are more expensive.
Old 05-23-2010, 09:33 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

ORIGINAL: beepee

On the point about big bird events: I used to enjoy going to them, but since they have become the property of the Extra/Edge/Yak ''watch me hover!'' group I have lost most of my interest.

Flame suit on.

Bedford
This is because once you learn to hover on small planes, the large ones do everything much easier. Everything happens in slow motion.

My only beef about big bird gatherings is they somtimes tend to showcase money and status more than the actual enjoyment of the hobby. Granted, that's fine for people to enjoy the hobby how they wish, but sometimes, not always, you see guys who barely know how to fly (or fly just enough to be REALLY DANGEROUS with the big planes) buy their way into the hobby, and show up with huge RVs and trailers to match the egos.
Old 05-23-2010, 10:30 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

Every step up in size I found the airplanes to fly better. That meaning, they land easier, are upset less by wind, easier to see, no oil residue, easier to work on, and most importantly they fly more true like full scale airplanes with regards to flight characteristics. And, its just plain cool to see such a large airplane on the ground, in the air, or on take off or landing. Very realistic and graceful in the sky.

The downsides are there also. I crashed one of my 40% airplanes into a stand of trees once. $6K. ouch! They are big and need a full size van or trailer for the 35% and up sizes. They are more expensive and more bulky to store in your workshop or move around from shop to trailer, etc. You need a larger runway to handle them so many local clubs can't accommodate them.

I still fly smaller airplanes, but only rarely. I have an small foam electric P51 and a 26cc gas (XtraFun) that I fly a few times a month. I don't fly any .40 glow stuff anymore and really have no desire to. Once hooked on the larger airplanes, its hard to go back.

ORIGINAL: wind junkie
My only beef about big bird gatherings is they somtimes tend to showcase money and status more than the actual enjoyment of the hobby. Granted, that's fine for people to enjoy the hobby how they wish, but sometimes, not always, you see guys who barely know how to fly (or fly just enough to be REALLY DANGEROUS with the big planes) buy their way into the hobby, and show up with huge RVs and trailers to match the egos.
There are some of those at any field or event regardless of the airplane size. I've seen just as many guys show up at the local field in their expensive cars with a number of very nice glow planes, and no real flight experience to match. I don't think its at all related to the size of the airplanes! We had a guy show up in a Mercedes with is new 1.20 size P51 wanting someone to teach him how to fly it. Nice trainer!


ORIGINAL: beepee
On the point about big bird events: I used to enjoy going to them, but since they have become the property of the Extra/Edge/Yak ''watch me hover!'' group I have lost most of my interest.

Bedford
I agree, and its turned me off as well. Granted, I like to hover as much as everyone else, but where you have several of them tying up the runway all day long flying just isn't as much fun anymore. For years I went to all the events I could anywhere from So Carolina to Canada, and as far west at Illinois. As some events started turning into hoverfests, I just crossed those events off my list. But it got to the point that I've skipped most of them, and the last couple years all of them. I even sold my RV and trailer since the kids grew up and out of camping and I wasn't using it for events anymore, so it sat a lot collecting dust.

As a result I didn't go to any of the big events for the last few years, mostly flew at the smaller local events (New England states), and spent a lot more time at our club field. I get far more air time, many times with all the airspace all to myself, and even have less distance to travel. I also realized I was missing a lot by not joining in on the local scene. So I guess it was a positive outcome in the end.

My only real beef with constant hovering on the field is safety. Since the planes are close to the pit area while hovering, and recovering from a mistake can easily bring the airplanes in over the pits, I feel I need to keep one eye on the planes hovering. The closer I am to the flight station, the more I need to pay attention. Its hard to totally relax with one eye on the hovering airplanes all day long. I've seen too many pilots (good and bad) miss a beat and recover the planes coming low and right over the pit area. Some events limit the hovering to specific times during the event, and some others have them push the planes hack to the outside edge of the runway. Either are reasonable solutions IMO, especially since there are events (Huckfests, etc) just for people who just want to hover or go nuts all day long.
Old 05-23-2010, 10:43 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I did it because I like the big warbirds. You can do alot more detailing to them. Also I like using gas instead of glow fuel.
Old 05-23-2010, 07:11 PM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?


ORIGINAL: wind junkie

ORIGINAL: beepee

On the point about big bird events: I used to enjoy going to them, but since they have become the property of the Extra/Edge/Yak ''watch me hover!'' group I have lost most of my interest.

Flame suit on.

Bedford
This is because once you learn to hover on small planes, the large ones do everything much easier. Everything happens in slow motion.

My only beef about big bird gatherings is they somtimes tend to showcase money and status more than the actual enjoyment of the hobby. Granted, that's fine for people to enjoy the hobby how they wish, but sometimes, not always, you see guys who barely know how to fly (or fly just enough to be REALLY DANGEROUS with the big planes) buy their way into the hobby, and show up with huge RVs and trailers to match the egos.
While I agree with these statements to a certain degree, not all are like this. Head to any IMAC event and see what I mean. Everyone I have ever dealt with in IMAC, no matter who they are and that includes the big names are extremely approachable and always willing to share information or just sit and talk. Most IMAC events you will find 50cc on up and a good range of planes. I can be seen flying my Carden Extra or my Carden Cap, both 40% planes, but you can always come talk to me.

Another thing I see a lot of is the IMAC community is always willing to lend a hand, it's not uncommon that when a pilot has an issue others will step up and help, even to the point of lending them a plane, I've done it several times and have seen it done even more.

The 3D crowd that most of you are referring to are basically "stick bangers" they can do things but as soon as they get out of shape, you need to find cover. Then you have the really good ones that are a joy to watch, they can put the plane into any position they want and keep it there. A lot of them have flown some sort of precision (IMAC, Pattern, F3A) in their lives and have learned the skills needed to be great at 3D. The ability to fly precise always helps with 3D.

Now as to way I went big, it was always part of my plane to get to 40% size planes. The reasons are many but I like the feel and look of a large plane, my eyes and reactions have slowed with age and large planes give you time and are easier to see.

Do I fly small planes, yep, still do. My smallest is a SIG Four Star 120 with an Evolution 35cc gas engine. I use this plane to relax with. It's nothing for me to grab a chair and do 20 minutes of nothing but touch and goes with this plane. Why, simple, I was taught to fly on a Four Star 40 glow plane and have always loved the way they fly. They are simple, nice fat wing, can slow to a crawl and I do mean a crawl and are generally good are "normal" aerobatics. I wanted one large enough to handle gas as I can use the same 5 gallon can I use for my big planes so all I need is the gas can, a battery charge and battery source and a few minor tools for a day at the field and I really do not need more than a single allen wrench and 7/16th socket and ratchet but I do take all of the above every time, just in case.

Oh yea, cleanup happens about every other flight and that depends on the engine and if it's still on breakin oil or not. But yes, generally gas engines are a set and forget for the person that flies at the same elevation all the time, but as a traveling competitive pilot, I do have to change mixtures every so often but not much more than a 1/16th of a turn on each needle.
Old 05-23-2010, 09:44 PM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

Whether they fly competition, hover all day long, or just want to fly around the patch, camaraderie has never been an issue in any of the events I've attended. I've had well know pilots hand me the controls to their $15+K jets and allow me to take it for a spin. When I crashed an airplane at an event, I was offered multiple airplanes to fly rather than have to pack up my RV and head home. If I had a servo fail, there were a dozen people offering to give me one to keep me flying, and ask for a tool and you had better duck from all the tools flying your way.

Regardless if it's an IMAC event, IMAA, AMA, or just a local even of giant scale pilots, I have yet to go to an event where pilots were unapproachable. In all, I've found giant scale pilots to be very helpful of newcomers, unknown pilots from out of town, or even their dire hard competitors during contests.

The only time I've seen unruly behavior is when it came time to setup canopies on the flight line at Joe Nall. I could only laugh at the silly bickering that went on every year. I just setup 20 feet away, pulled out my chair, and watched the comedy unfold
Old 05-23-2010, 09:50 PM
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Edwin
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

Like a man and wife setting up a tent. BTDT!
Edwin
Old 05-23-2010, 09:59 PM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?


ORIGINAL: Edwin

Like a man and wife setting up a tent. BTDT!
Edwin
Or backing up a large RV with a trailer in a tight campground!

I vowed never to be that couple and ordered my RV with a rear view camera from day one It came in real handy one year when I was going to the Maine Jet Rally and ended up going down a dead end street. I needed to backup the rig for over a mile! I got real good at it by the time I was able to finally turn around.
Old 05-24-2010, 07:22 AM
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Edwin
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

A mile! Thats dedication!
Edwin
Old 05-24-2010, 08:49 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I went large and now am going back to .60 some. I like the bigger planes but I don't like all the setup, hauling trailer etc. etc. so I have not been flying my bigger birds lately. In fact, I have sold some of them. There are several kits that are out of production in the .60-.90 size and I have focused on building up a collection now to have later. My interests change in the hobby and I am always changing my fleet-guess it keeps my interest. The big planes do have a different feel to them which I like. Good luck!
Old 05-24-2010, 09:58 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I went big because I was getting sick a tired of $20-$30 a gallon for glow. Also, my 4 stroke threw a prop that hit me and that was the last straw. I said enough with all this glow garbage, I'm going gas.

Just started w/ the big stuff and I'm never looking back. Bigger really does fly better.
Old 05-24-2010, 10:29 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?


ORIGINAL: Edwin

A mile! Thats dedication!
Edwin
I had no choice as there was no way to turn around, no side street, and being a 40' RV plus another 14' of trailer, no driveway was big enough to even back in and turnaround. I just checked google maps, and it was actually about 3/4 of a mile. Great practice for backwards RV racing though
Old 05-24-2010, 11:29 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I have seen tow vehicles with hitches on both ends. That would not have helped in your case, but how about a hitch on both ends of the trailer? You could unhitch, turn the RV around and then connect up to the other end of the trailer?!? But I guess there was not even room to turn the 40 foot RV around by itself?

Sincerely,

Richard
Old 05-24-2010, 03:41 PM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I didn't even have much room to turn around the RV. I thought of unhooking the trailer and leaving it parked, then turning around the trailer, backing up and re-hooking up the trailer. I knew I couldn't manhandle the trailer 180 degrees since it didn't have a wheel on the post, so that killed that idea. I do like the idea of hitches on both ends of the RV and/or trailer, but if I ever spend the money to do that, i know for a fact I'll then never need it
Old 05-27-2010, 09:12 PM
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wind junkie
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

I didn't mean to make a big deal about my statement. I know folks are free to enjoy whatever they wish and you're going to get camaraderie in many forms. I guess I just meant I didnt' enjoy "being nervous" all the time when I could see planes that were flown on the edge in ways that should really be practiced on foamies in private.

I love aircraft of many sizes. Each has its charms.

One thing I will say however is after going to the last few NEAT fairs last and seeing the really impressive power systems which can be used on big birds, I can categorically say I'll never build a big warbird with an electric powerplant. I MISSed the NOISE! (and the smoke!)

Old 05-28-2010, 12:58 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

1. The wow factor. I jumped straight from park fliers and a couple 40 sized glow planes into a 30% Edge w/ DLE-55. I LOVE this plane.
2. Gas. No more explaination is needed on this.
3. The looks of a giant bird in the sky.
4. Reliability
5. Flyability
6. Sound
Old 05-28-2010, 09:19 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

Mine was a accident. bought a gas engine because it was cheap. then had to find a plane. They've only gotten bigger was there. Thought I'd never fly turbines. found one cheap. Guess what! Have a Habu electric thats my smallest. Even the jet is 73" wing. Dennis
Old 05-28-2010, 10:53 AM
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Default RE: why did you go Large?

Reasons -

Cleaner (little or no fuel "goo" when using gasoline)
Easier to see (eyes getting old)
More realistic flight characteristics (slower, thumbs getting old too)
Engines less finicky and more realistic sound (gasoline)
Construction techniques (I like to cover w/ fabric/paint over built-up frames)
They LOOK GOOD
More for the money - doesn't really cost much more than smaller planes/engines
Easier to "detail" scale models
If "scratch" building, can use a lot of "off the shelf" components like woods, fabrics, paints, fasteners, etc.
Less need for "micro tools", shop tools are fine
Fuel is cheap and available everywhere
Engine conversions are cheap and fun to do (weedies)
I have about 50 1/4 scale and bigger kits in storage

Drawbacks -
Transport (not a problem for me as I always have a large vehicle)
Storage - need a LOT of space, might not be as big a problem for those with a basement, but I live in Florida (NO basement)
Building space - need bigger building board
Building times can be a little longer simply because there is more to do

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