Enya 53 older style, poor idle
10-22-2010, 02:05 AM
#51
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Brisbane, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 340
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Enya 53 older style, poor idle
I had the same trouble with my 46-4C ended up buying a new twin needle carb from enya direct, runs like swiss watch now.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHYmE4NGEzY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHYmE4NGEzY
10-22-2010, 05:10 PM
#54
Thread Starter
RE: Enya 53 older style, poor idle
Thank you Luna. I'm really hoping to avoid that much expense, but it sounds like you're very happy with the result.
I watched the video...idle sounds great, and very steady; good top end too.
Jim
I watched the video...idle sounds great, and very steady; good top end too.
Jim
10-22-2010, 09:45 PM
#56
Thread Starter
RE: Enya 53 older style, poor idle
That looks similar to what I did with silicon tubing. Yours looks a little better, but I think mine is doing the job.
What I'm really wondering about is the possible effect of having a pitted needle. Maybe I'll just have to buy a new needle and see if it helps.
Jim
What I'm really wondering about is the possible effect of having a pitted needle. Maybe I'll just have to buy a new needle and see if it helps.
Jim
10-23-2010, 08:44 AM
#57
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Brisbane, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 340
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Enya 53 older style, poor idle
I don't think a pitted needle would affect the idle, it should only make peaking the top end a little inconsistent, You can always drop it in a drill and resurface it with saw file, so long as you keep the same angle of taper it should work fine.
12-26-2022, 07:43 AM
#59
After so much time (12 years!!), I have a very similar issue as Buzzard Bait was experiencing with my Enya 53 with older carb (the one with air bleed screw).
condition:
I am using 5% nitro, 16% oil, 11000 rpm (peak)with APC11x7 set 200-300 rpm richer for flying , 6Oz tank .
I use muffler pressure, and it is mounted inverted in a Kyosho Focke Wulf GP50 ARF.
Issue:
My ilde is around 3300 rpm, and after 10 seconds it usually dies ( generally 2 second before or after touch down) and this gets me nervous.
Flyng is ok, min-max, max-min transition are good, I have to close the air bleed to 1/4 ( at 1/2 it has a better idle, but it gets too lean in the mid range as tank empties during flyght , and would run erratic at midrange)
I d' like to know if somebody has solved a similar problem.
I am tempeted to switch the air bleed carb with the newerTN version, but I think it should work anyhow with the original AB.
There should be something wrong somewhere, and I wolud fix-it instead of covering up with a better design carb.
Thank you for your help
Paolo
condition:
I am using 5% nitro, 16% oil, 11000 rpm (peak)with APC11x7 set 200-300 rpm richer for flying , 6Oz tank .
I use muffler pressure, and it is mounted inverted in a Kyosho Focke Wulf GP50 ARF.
Issue:
My ilde is around 3300 rpm, and after 10 seconds it usually dies ( generally 2 second before or after touch down) and this gets me nervous.
Flyng is ok, min-max, max-min transition are good, I have to close the air bleed to 1/4 ( at 1/2 it has a better idle, but it gets too lean in the mid range as tank empties during flyght , and would run erratic at midrange)
I d' like to know if somebody has solved a similar problem.
I am tempeted to switch the air bleed carb with the newerTN version, but I think it should work anyhow with the original AB.
There should be something wrong somewhere, and I wolud fix-it instead of covering up with a better design carb.
Thank you for your help
Paolo
Last edited by ev2driver; 12-26-2022 at 10:28 AM.
12-26-2022, 08:10 AM
#60
Thread Starter
Hi Paolo, I wish I could help. I sold mine cheap to someone who was convinced he could solve the problem, but I don't know if he did. A friend had a 53 with the TN carb and it was a really nice engine. Good luck!
Jim
Jim
12-31-2022, 03:50 AM
#61
Hi!
Here we go!
Fuel: Use Castor oil 18-20% in your fuel or 18-20% all synthetic like Motul Micro or a blend of castor and syntetic oil! Never use less than 18%!
5-10% nitro is just fine. I run all my engines ,both four and two strokes on 5% nitro, 18-20% oil and rest methanol (mix my own fuel)
Glow plug: Always use an OS F plug. I know that all ENYA four strokes where delivered with ENYA 3 plugs so those must work too but all other four stroke should use the OS F plug so change to one of those to be safe!
Propeller: I would run a 12x6 APC , RAM or Graupner G-Sonic as hose are the best props, providing best performance and quietness.Wood props could be used too but hose are more brittle. You should aim for rpm around 8500-9000 with the correct prop for best performance on most sport and semi scale planes(like your FW 190). And go not over 10000 rpm as then the prop is too small.
Carb:The carb on those ENYA four strokes are very simple, using an air bleed carb, and as such will let the engine run and idle perfectly out of the box if the fuel is right and tank size and set up is correct. The correct idle needle setting is with the small hole half way open (same as on any other engine using air bleed carb). Twin needle carb is as easy to set up as with any twin needle carb. You first set the high speed needle to nearly max rpm ,holding the airplane nose straight up (to check hat the engine can cope with lower tank position). Then you set the idle needle so that the engine answers direct when you give full throttle.
Tank: 8oz or 240cc is the correct size and let you fly for around 10 minutes. & OS could be used too of course but will give less flying time. 10oz could of course also be used but anything larger will have negative inputs on how the engine runs and behaves as it makes the carb (high speed needle) settings more sensitive as the carb/engine could not compensate for the added height of fuel (fuel pressure) used and thus makes the engine run perfect at the beginning of he flight but runs leaner and leaner as more fuel is consumed. And finally stops due to running too lean.
Tank set up:
The tank should always be placed as close to he engine as possible and always have the centre of the tank in line,or slightly below a line drawn through the intake orifice of he carb! -That is very important ! Not following this and your engine will not run right!
Tank pressure: Is not needed but could of course be used if you like.
This is my experience from flying and running R/C engines for 47 years
Here we go!
Fuel: Use Castor oil 18-20% in your fuel or 18-20% all synthetic like Motul Micro or a blend of castor and syntetic oil! Never use less than 18%!
5-10% nitro is just fine. I run all my engines ,both four and two strokes on 5% nitro, 18-20% oil and rest methanol (mix my own fuel)
Glow plug: Always use an OS F plug. I know that all ENYA four strokes where delivered with ENYA 3 plugs so those must work too but all other four stroke should use the OS F plug so change to one of those to be safe!
Propeller: I would run a 12x6 APC , RAM or Graupner G-Sonic as hose are the best props, providing best performance and quietness.Wood props could be used too but hose are more brittle. You should aim for rpm around 8500-9000 with the correct prop for best performance on most sport and semi scale planes(like your FW 190). And go not over 10000 rpm as then the prop is too small.
Carb:The carb on those ENYA four strokes are very simple, using an air bleed carb, and as such will let the engine run and idle perfectly out of the box if the fuel is right and tank size and set up is correct. The correct idle needle setting is with the small hole half way open (same as on any other engine using air bleed carb). Twin needle carb is as easy to set up as with any twin needle carb. You first set the high speed needle to nearly max rpm ,holding the airplane nose straight up (to check hat the engine can cope with lower tank position). Then you set the idle needle so that the engine answers direct when you give full throttle.
Tank: 8oz or 240cc is the correct size and let you fly for around 10 minutes. & OS could be used too of course but will give less flying time. 10oz could of course also be used but anything larger will have negative inputs on how the engine runs and behaves as it makes the carb (high speed needle) settings more sensitive as the carb/engine could not compensate for the added height of fuel (fuel pressure) used and thus makes the engine run perfect at the beginning of he flight but runs leaner and leaner as more fuel is consumed. And finally stops due to running too lean.
Tank set up:
The tank should always be placed as close to he engine as possible and always have the centre of the tank in line,or slightly below a line drawn through the intake orifice of he carb! -That is very important ! Not following this and your engine will not run right!
Tank pressure: Is not needed but could of course be used if you like.
This is my experience from flying and running R/C engines for 47 years
Last edited by jaka54; 12-31-2022 at 03:57 AM.
The following users liked this post:
Jesse Open (01-22-2023)
12-31-2022, 04:59 AM
#62
Thread Starter
I checked all those boxes except all castor fuel. That should not be necessary. I use part castor, and if I needed a different fuel to suit one engine I would not have that engine. I have decades of experience running RC engines too. This one was a no go.
The following users liked this post:
Jesse Open (01-22-2023)
01-07-2023, 01:34 AM
#64
Hi!
Tank set up:
The tank should always be placed as close to he engine as possible and always have the centre of the tank in line,or slightly below a line drawn through the intake orifice of he carb! -That is very important ! Not following this and your engine will not run right!
Tank set up:
The tank should always be placed as close to he engine as possible and always have the centre of the tank in line,or slightly below a line drawn through the intake orifice of he carb! -That is very important ! Not following this and your engine will not run right!
If it is possible to have the centerline of the tank level with the spraybar, sure, do it! But if it isn't possible, don't sweat it, because it is not near as important as the other points you mentioned: Good fuel, good plug, proper needle settings, proper prop-selection, are all WAY more important..
I can tell you this: I once built and flew a homemade paramotor contraption powered by an OS FP10, that relied on throttle for altitude control, and it had the tank 4" below the engine (design related, the tank had to be below the prop arc, nothing I could do about it). Worked perfect, the only thing noticable was that the engine picked up RPM when flying tight turns due to the G-forces leaning out the mixture a bit, which coincidentally turned out just right because turns required a bit more power anyway, but it never presented a problem with the engine, never had a stall, flame-out or other issue. It simply ran and ran, 20 minute flights were no problem at all.
Sure, aerobatic planes are an entirely different story, but even in those cases, an inch of difference between spraybar and tank centerline will not cause all that much trouble unless it is for competition use and every detail counts.
Admittedly, I do have 7 years less experience, but that's still 40 years (and my first 3 or 4 engines all were Enya's by the way
)...
01-07-2023, 08:09 AM
#65
But how about flying inverted?? Did your tank set up work there too?
I'm aware that all glow engines can run just perfect with the tank lower than what I suggested, but my recommendations was for an airplane set up for aerobatic flight.
I'm aware that all glow engines can run just perfect with the tank lower than what I suggested, but my recommendations was for an airplane set up for aerobatic flight.
The following users liked this post:
Jesse Open (02-06-2023)
01-08-2023, 06:01 AM
#66
There are a lot of falsehoods in the old ways people use to set these simple machines up. Saying an OS F plug is the best bet is BS. Some guys poopooed using an idle bar plug in a 4-stroke, but it works. And in my experience, a Fox Idle Bar plug as well as an Enya 3 outperformed the lowly OS F plug by enough of a margin to not be worth using the F plug.
Next - the airbleed trimmed carbs from Enya work quite well for most people. One must make sure the metering groove is meticulously clean. If using muffler pressure, stop using it and set the carb so the idle is a little too rich. The engine will miss occasionally and burble a little. This is normal and it will rarely quit. The Enya .53 is based on the .46, which didn’t come with a muffler initially. I believe the heads and cams are the same between the two, so aside from displacement, they should run virtually the same. This assuming everything mechanically is good and proper.
Airbleed trimmed carbs are a bit of a compromise as are two needle carbs. When a TN carb works better than the AB trimmed carb, it’s a matter of the TN carb allowing a slightly better balance of mixture control.
Next - the airbleed trimmed carbs from Enya work quite well for most people. One must make sure the metering groove is meticulously clean. If using muffler pressure, stop using it and set the carb so the idle is a little too rich. The engine will miss occasionally and burble a little. This is normal and it will rarely quit. The Enya .53 is based on the .46, which didn’t come with a muffler initially. I believe the heads and cams are the same between the two, so aside from displacement, they should run virtually the same. This assuming everything mechanically is good and proper.
Airbleed trimmed carbs are a bit of a compromise as are two needle carbs. When a TN carb works better than the AB trimmed carb, it’s a matter of the TN carb allowing a slightly better balance of mixture control.
01-09-2023, 02:05 PM
#67
Thank you all for the hints, I know my application has some limits (i.e. inverted engine and consequently a tad too high tank) but I hoped that the air bleed carb could have been adjusted with an acceptable compromise.
The carb barrel is clean, the valve lash is ok, the inlet pipe is leak proof. the plug is a Enya n°3 new.
So far I tried :
-without muffler pressure, with all air bleed open I still had a too rich setting ( it quitted at 3300 rpm, or sometimes during low-hi transition) high needle valve 2.5 turn open.
-With the tank pressure, I had the midrange too lean due to the high speed needle valve only 1 turn open, or the idle too rich in order to have a correct midrange .
So I have made a "T" connection among the pressure nipple, the tank vent and a calibrated orifice, in order to limit the max tank pressure,
playing with different orifice holes (1,5 mm, 1mm, 0,8mm, 0,5 mm)
I have at the moment the best result with 0,5mm HS needle open1&3/4 turns: I still have a too rich min, it dies after 30 seconds at 3000 rpm, but I have yet to adjust it better .
I tried to fly in these days to test it, but weather was tricky (rain, fog, or windy with low and dark clouds), and having the engine not running reliably cost me a regluing of the fin so far. So I am waiting better weather to have a final verdict, meantime I ordered a TN carb...
I will keep you informed, as soon as I will have updates,
thank you again
Paolo
The carb barrel is clean, the valve lash is ok, the inlet pipe is leak proof. the plug is a Enya n°3 new.
So far I tried :
-without muffler pressure, with all air bleed open I still had a too rich setting ( it quitted at 3300 rpm, or sometimes during low-hi transition) high needle valve 2.5 turn open.
-With the tank pressure, I had the midrange too lean due to the high speed needle valve only 1 turn open, or the idle too rich in order to have a correct midrange .
So I have made a "T" connection among the pressure nipple, the tank vent and a calibrated orifice, in order to limit the max tank pressure,
playing with different orifice holes (1,5 mm, 1mm, 0,8mm, 0,5 mm)
I have at the moment the best result with 0,5mm HS needle open1&3/4 turns: I still have a too rich min, it dies after 30 seconds at 3000 rpm, but I have yet to adjust it better .
I tried to fly in these days to test it, but weather was tricky (rain, fog, or windy with low and dark clouds), and having the engine not running reliably cost me a regluing of the fin so far. So I am waiting better weather to have a final verdict, meantime I ordered a TN carb...
I will keep you informed, as soon as I will have updates,
thank you again
Paolo
01-10-2023, 03:27 AM
#68
Senior Member
I usually get hammered on for saying this, my first fourstroke was an Enya 46 in 1991, it had a poor idle and a rich midrange when running a Grey Graupner 12 x 6. I changed to an 11 x 6 and all the poor running characteristics disappeared. With the11 x 6 you could run it several clicks leaner, yep, I know that sounds backwards. A Fox Miracle plug helped the idle even more.
The following users liked this post:
Jesse Open (01-22-2023)
01-14-2023, 08:06 AM
#69
I usually get hammered on for saying this, my first fourstroke was an Enya 46 in 1991, it had a poor idle and a rich midrange when running a Grey Graupner 12 x 6. I changed to an 11 x 6 and all the poor running characteristics disappeared. With the11 x 6 you could run it several clicks leaner, yep, I know that sounds backwards. A Fox Miracle plug helped the idle even more.
01-18-2023, 12:19 PM
#70
