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Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

Old 07-01-2002, 02:31 PM
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RedWing
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Default Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

This is a new engine.
I have done the break-in of starting the engine for 2-3 min and let it cool. I have repeated this about 10 times. I did take it up one day for a short 4 minute flight. No problems.
Friday after work I went to the field. Had some trouble starting it, got it started and tried to get it to run. Had to adjust the low and high end needle valves. On the ground I did point the nose in the air while at full throttle, no problems.
Took off and at the end of the runway at 40-50 feet and full throttle it quit. Had to put it in the weeds. Broke the prop and some damage to the front of the plane, minor.

Ok, what is wrong. I have a new tank, new lines good fuel, new plug.

What do I do now?
Old 07-01-2002, 03:59 PM
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w8ye
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Default Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

Either you are too lean. eventhough you held the plane vertically to check it. Peak the engine with the needle and then back down on the rich side 2-400 rpm. Then try the holding up and also the transition from idle to high speed.

Or your clunk has flipped backwards if you had bumped it from the nose previously.

Good luck,

Jim
Old 07-01-2002, 04:59 PM
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Jazzy
 
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Default Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

TT engines do take quite a while to fully break-in.
I've had the same happen to me. Usually it was because it was too lean or the low end wasn't set right.
They seem to like being run on the rich side as they tend to really unload in the air.
Run'em slightly rich+ for tons of power in the air.

Good Luck,
Jeff

(Sorry to hear about your damage. Now is not the time of the year for building or major repairs!)
Old 07-01-2002, 04:59 PM
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hilleyja
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Default Start a thought process here???

I have done the break-in of starting the engine for 2-3 min and let it cool. I have repeated this about 10 times.
My intent here is to start a thought process.

Correct me if I'm wrong, the TT 46 pro is an ABC engine. As such the break-in process should be a bit more rigorous than indicated above. My approach would have been:

1.) Leaving the low-speed needle at factory default, turn high about 3-4 turns out. Start engine, leave the glow on, and adjust the high until you get a good sloppy 2-stroke rich setting. You want to stay away from the sloppy 4-stroke setting here because it is an ABC engine and you want it to get hot. Remove the glow and let engine run until fuel tank (~8-10 ozs) is empty. Don't worry about idle or transition here. Let cool for about 10 minutes.

2.) Essentually repeat what you did with step 1 above for an additional tank of fuel. Don't worry about idle or transition here. Let cool for about 10 minutes.

3.) Start the engine as you did with 1 & 2 above, remove glow, but after a few minutes adjust the high speed needle for max rpm and then back off about 400rpm. Now bring the throttle down to the slowest idle you can get without stalling the engine -- it probably wont go much below 3000rpm. Shutdown engine.

4.) Restart engine and further adjust for lowest idle with glow still attached. Remove glow. If the engine immediately dies here I would start to think a new type glow plug would be needed. I recommend OS A3 or #8 for the TT Pro 46.

5.) After you've got an idle (still rough) and good transition its time to adjust for pure idle. The recommendation I see the most of is the finger pinch method. With the engine running at high idle, pinch the fuel line. If there is an immediate surge the engine is too rich -- close low speed needle 1/8th turn and repeat. Do this until the engine does not surge.

6.) Re-adjust the highspeed and if needed then the low speed using the steps above.

By the time your done with the above you should have an engine that starts relatively easy, idles like a dream, and transitions smoothly. Later as the engine further breaks in you might be able to coax a little more on the high end.
Old 07-01-2002, 05:46 PM
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Default Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

WOW Fast response.

Thanks Guys.

I have another new TT Pro 46.
I will look at the low end needle setting on that one and reset this one.

Then I will set the high end and keep breaking it in on the ground.

Will let you know how it is going.
Old 07-08-2002, 11:15 AM
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Default Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

OK,

Went to the LHS and purchased a couple of K&B glow plugs.
I think these are hotter that the Fox plug that I was using.
Reset the low end idle to 2/3 out from close.
Opened the high end 2 1/2 turns from close.

Started it, ran great.
Adjusted the high end a little.
Idled and ran great at the high end.
Transitioned great.
Put the nose of the plane up, no problem.
Pinched the fuel line and it ran for several seconds then started to gain RPMs.

The plug has made the difference.

No more Fox plugs for me. :disappoin

I still need to fly the plane to give a final approval but am happy for now.

Bill
Old 07-08-2002, 01:05 PM
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Default TT46

If you read your manual that comes with all TT eng. it warns against Fox plugs. I use OS A3 or K&b 1L with great results. None of my TT's will run on the miracle plug.
And don't worry about what anothers settings are, even if the same eng. Counting turns will get you in the ball park, thats it. Then you'll have to dial it in with experience.
Kirk
Old 07-08-2002, 04:47 PM
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RussianFlyer
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Default Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

Hi,

I own a TT Pro .46 as well and have been using Fox RC Long Plugs from the time I got it. So far I had no real problems with it except for a couple of dead sticks which were caused by me having too my much fun and running the fuel tank dry . Am I ruining my engine running Fox plugs?

I also had a similar dead stick problem when the engine was being broken in(at 3 tanks) and adjusted by a fellow club member. The engine idled and went through all the tests fine until the engine got up to around half throttle, at which point it just quit (on take off). Turned out it was the low end needle adjustment being set too lean. After richening the low needle the engine never dead sticked on me again unless it ran out of fuel.

Just pitching in my $.02

P.S.: In the instructions I got with the engine, it was written that the Pro .46 is a ABN type engine. I think it was listed in the beggining of the manual somewhere. And the fox plugs seem to last for quiet a while as well. I replaced one plug after it ran through a gallon and a half of fuel and was still good(replacement = insurance from failure) . The engine was purchased in the year 2000. Does anyone have any idea why the instructions are different from the current ones published? Did I get the Y2K Engine Edition? :devious:
Old 07-08-2002, 06:58 PM
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vertigo
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Default Fox RC long glow plugs

Russian,
No, you certainly will not ruin your engine using fox plugs because they are slightly on the cold heat range. If you're using 15% fuel the fox plugs are extra insurance against preignition if you get a lean run. If you're using 5 or 10% fuel you probably won't get the max rpm that you'd get if you used some of the hotter plugs mentioned above. I still use some of these fox plugs and as long as the needles are set correctly I never have deadsticks using 10% fuel.
I'm refering to the fox rc long plugs as I've never used the miracle plug. I cut the idle bar off the fox plugs, but if you do that clean all the cuttings out of plug.

Happy Flying
Old 07-08-2002, 07:45 PM
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ramcharger
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Default Thunder Tiger Pro 46 - Dead stick

The Thunder Tiger engines are ABN and not ABC. They used the
term ABC type engine - just like OS. George Aldrich indicated a few times on RCO that TT engines are ABN. As far as I know OS, Webra, TT, and YS have nickel lined sleeves. Generally ABN engines are ready to go after 1 or 2 tanks of fuel. The TT instructions call for a long RC plug preferrably an OS #8 or K&B - not a FOX.

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