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Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Old 05-01-2005, 09:54 PM
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varmato
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Default Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Well, I guess that the cheaper side of me won as I return from the second weekend of engine tinkering at the field with minimal flight time. I opted to put a Magnum XLS 52 engine on my new Ultra Stick 40 and it has been an interesting experience so far.

Here are the Pro's: When I can get the engine running well, the idle is sweet and slow, the high end is tremendous as compared to my OS 46FX.
Here's the Cons: Emphasis here on WHEN I can get the engine running well!

Last weekend the engine seemed to be doing fairly predictably, but I kept getting deadsticks after about 1-2 mins in the air. It felt from the ground that it was having a failure in transitioning smoothly from idle up.

Naturally I tinkered again and again with the idle mix and it seemed to help. I kept running it on the ground without incident and yet it kept eventually dying in the air.

After about the 8th deadstick, I decided to put it back on the bench where I broke it in on. I figured out something that was predictable about it's unpredictability. While the idle remained ok, the high remained ok, eventually after running it for about 90 seconds or so, the midrange would get extremely lousy and the engine would simply fail - slowing down prior to stop - at the low to midrange (I couldn't get it up past midrange).

So me and the field buddies (who had gathered round at this point) continued to tinker with the idle and high end and eventually just gave up on the effort because it just would not get predictable in it's running.

I have read the threads where the carb is questionable on the Magnums and I have an OS 46FXi (originally came on a NexStar) with a broken high speed needle valve assembly. I am about to move this carb assembly over, but I don't want to do it yet as the screws are of different thickness and it would require me to drill out some clearance on the body of the Magnum and I don't want to do this until I speak with Magnum support on the issue.

In summary, the Magnum XLS 52 experience has not been too satisfying and as much as I love tinkering with the engine, giving up two weekends without significant flight was just too painful.

Any thoughts amongst the masses?

- Vince
Old 05-01-2005, 10:17 PM
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RC-Captain
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

The low speed needle valve is moving from vibration. I wrecked today do to a dead stick using a MAG .28 xl engine. Just a minute ago I checked the setting by closing it and reopening it 3 1/2 turns which another guy in another forum recommended and it didn't match the setting previous before doing the recheck.

im going to but some teflon tape and put it on the screw so it won't move anymore.
Old 05-02-2005, 02:34 AM
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Ernie Misner
 
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

As I recall I just used the magnum screws when I put the OS carb on my 52. It ran much better but still wanted to hesitate at times during transition. By the end of the 1st season, with really very little running time as opposed to fiddling and tinkering time, the main bearings got noisy and it finally broke the crankpin. They were great and sent me a whole new engine, box, muffler and all right away. The new engine is still sitting there happily in the box. I'm not sure just how soon I will have the courage to see how this one fares... The first engine was extremely powerful on the top end though!

Ernie
Old 05-02-2005, 07:04 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Are you using it as a remote needle or do you have it directly in the carb?
Old 05-02-2005, 07:28 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?


ORIGINAL: Stiks

Are you using it as a remote needle or do you have it directly in the carb?
I am using the remote needle configuration. We were thinking that it could be this, but we can easily see that there is a consistent supply of fuel from the remote needle valve and there is not any foaming occuring within the tube from the remote to the carb. Bear in mind that if it were the remote needle, then we think that it would be causing a problem at all times once started. The problem generally was occuring after about 60-90 seconds. Therefore we don't think it could be the high speed, but naturally I can move that as a first option.

Getting the remote off of the high speed would probably require removing the engine from the mount. Something tells me that if I take this engine off of the mount, it probably won't be going back on if you know what I mean! :-)
Old 05-02-2005, 07:32 AM
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varmato
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

One more comment.....after the engine is broken in and I have it on the bench at home, I noticed a mechanical 'variation'. My old OS 46FXi with the carb and glow plug removed allows for the cylinder to move rather smoothly even when the engine is cold. The Magnum definitely has a 'tight' spot. It's hard to tell whether the tight spot is a bind between the cylinder and wall or if it's something else.....like a bearing? If it is something else, then what a piece of crap to break so suddenly....less than 2.0 hours of operation time.
Old 05-02-2005, 07:55 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

The remote needle would not be the problem, I fly with lots of them and they are not an issue. If it is an AB? engine the tight spot is quite normal and in fact is a good thing. I am not an advocate of engines from that origin but most seem to be OK.
Old 05-02-2005, 08:22 AM
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varmato
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?


ORIGINAL: hobbsy

The remote needle would not be the problem, I fly with lots of them and they are not an issue. If it is an AB? engine the tight spot is quite normal and in fact is a good thing. I am not an advocate of engines from that origin but most seem to be OK.
That's what I thought as well. As for the tight spot on the Magnum, it is somewhat tight - best way to describe it is a tolerance issue - it is definitely on a small area on the internals, but I figured that this is ok. It doesn't feel like a grind or anything like a bearing per se.

I'm calling Magnum in about three more hours, so we'll find out what they say.

:-)
Old 05-02-2005, 08:47 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

There are a bunch of threads on the Mag 52 if you search.

The engine is not a good 3D type engine. It likes rpm. Seems to have been intended more as a speed engine.

From what I can see, the carb midrange/transition point is set up for turning smaller props, and looks like they may have even intended it for use with a tuned pipe/tuned muffler. Folks trying to use the engine to turn 11x6, 12x4, 12x5 props will run into problems.

Leaking screws- that can drive you nuts in any case.
Old 05-02-2005, 10:15 AM
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bigbri
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Had one, didn't keep it long. Replaced it with an OS like I should of in the first place. Buy it right the first time, you only have to buy it once
B-
Old 05-02-2005, 01:01 PM
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varmato
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

I have officially posted something now on the Global Services Customer Support forum:

[link=http://globalservices.globalhobby.com/globalforum/viewtopic.php?t=11630&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=]Click here for the Global Services Thread[/link]
Old 05-02-2005, 02:55 PM
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varmato
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Vince,

It does sound as thought something may be wrong with the engine.

Magnum Engines come with a warranty. So, if you cannot get it to run, simply return it to us.

Our service tech will read through the comments you include (so please include a note explaining the problem) and repair or replace the engine as necessary.

Magnum Service
18480 Bandilier Circle
Fountain Valley, CA 92708

Be sure to include your name/address/phone number with the engine.

Mike
_________________
Mike Greenshields
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Global Hobby Distributors
I just got this reply from Global Hobby, so I guess that I will send it in..... :-(
Old 05-02-2005, 04:03 PM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

I have a Mag .52 and yes the mid range is very touchy. I have the low end needle set at between 5/8 and 3/4 of a turn out. The Mags are very tight on the pinch at TDC. If you try to run them too rich you can kill this engine real fast. They need to get some heat in them to expand and make the fit right.

They do have some scary power on the top end. I have found that the Thunder bolt long, non idle bar plugs work very well. There have been posts that the Thunder bolt idle bar plugs work well too. I am running a MS 11X7 prop.


Dru.
Old 05-02-2005, 07:27 PM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Hello; years ago, I had a Magnum 65 Se. Powerful thirsty engine that wouldn't mid-range no matter what I (or many others) tried. I stripped the carb, expecting to find a little blade of grass covering a jet, or something minor. What I did find was the O-ring on the needle had a big bite out of it. It looked like the O-rings were made on a spine, and when torn off the spine, a bit of the O-ring was torn off too.

I took the engine back to the LHS, he ordered 6 new O-rings. When they came in, they were on a spine, I cut one off using a nail clipper, and managed to not nick it. I installed that and that was the end of the problem. I eventually swapped that engine for a Saito 80.

I don't know if this is any help in your situation, but have a look at that O-ring, and see if it has a nick in it.
Old 05-02-2005, 09:53 PM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Varmato,
Magnum has excellent customer service. try giving them a call or even sending them your engine. you can probably have the hobbyshop that you bought it from send it back free of charge. i actually went to a magnum sponsored engine clinic this weekend and found out the following few things that magnum offers as a service to its customers:

Free engine tuning
Free engine cleaning (if you plant it in the dirt due to a crash)
Free engine matching (if yer having problems tuning engines on a twin)
If you wreck your engine in a crash, they will "help you out" meaning get a great deal on parts if it's not free (i know a couple of people who have taken advantage of this)
and of course a bumper-to-bumper warrenty on all their engines, usually without proof of purchase

for the price of the magnums, you can't beat the customer service, if you are having so many problems with your engine, just send it in, their turn around time is 2-3 weeks.

Also my experience with tuning magnum engines (all i have) is if you start "tinkering" with both needle valves, you lose all reference of where you are and could spend hours trying to find the right place.
Old 05-02-2005, 10:24 PM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Thanks JCB. I will probably do just this. I have a voicemail waiting for me to talk with their customer support tomorrow. I'll post to the thread the results of the effort.
Old 05-03-2005, 09:14 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

Make sure your glow plug is good. Do the pinch test on idle. If engine dies quick your too lean, if engine speeds up a little your rich. if alot your way to rich. When you adjust low needle turn 1/8 at a time no more. Each time you adjust your low speed you have to set high speed. Contrary to a lot of opions . The high and low work togeather and can not be compensated on the high speed needle all the time. If your way out of whack start at factory settings. Low is best set to gain about 200 rpm before dying on pinch test.
Old 05-03-2005, 10:09 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?


ORIGINAL: speedster 1919

Make sure your glow plug is good. Do the pinch test on idle. If engine dies quick your too lean, if engine speeds up a little your rich. if alot your way to rich. When you adjust low needle turn 1/8 at a time no more. Each time you adjust your low speed you have to set high speed. Contrary to a lot of opions . The high and low work togeather and can not be compensated on the high speed needle all the time. If your way out of whack start at factory settings. Low is best set to gain about 200 rpm before dying on pinch test.
Thanks Speedster. This approach was pretty much tested back and forward, so it isn't a needle setting other than to say that I can't get a reliable relationship between needle setting and the performance of the engine.
Old 05-04-2005, 08:33 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

I had a 1/2 dozen dead sticks with mine before it started to behave. I'm certain it just may need a little more break-in time? On the fuel circuit, seal anything and everything that has a "thread" with hi-temp silicone to eliminate any sources of an air leak, including the carb. and the retaining screws. Sounds like things are going lean on you once you burn a little fuel off, so make your needle adjustments with minimal fuel in the tank.
Old 05-04-2005, 10:28 PM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

My Magnum 52 required quite a number of runs before the motor would run well. It tends to blow a lot of OS #8 plugs too. I went through 2 plugs with only 1 dozen flights. Mine had bearings that went bad so I shipped the whole thing to Global Hobby for replacement. No response so far after 10 days. I replaced it with OS 46FX and Jettstream tuned muffler, expecting to get 16k rpms with new set up in my F20. This is more pricey but much more power than the Magnum could ever muster, and less headache with tuning problems and bearings issue which is priceless...[:-]
Old 05-05-2005, 01:52 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?


ORIGINAL: kmtranmd

My Magnum 52 required quite a number of runs before the motor would run well. It tends to blow a lot of OS #8 plugs too. I went through 2 plugs with only 1 dozen flights. Mine had bearings that went bad so I shipped the whole thing to Global Hobby for replacement. No response so far after 10 days. I replaced it with OS 46FX and Jettstream tuned muffler, expecting to get 16k rpms with new set up in my F20. This is more pricey but much more power than the Magnum could ever muster, and less headache with tuning problems and bearings issue which is priceless...[:-]
Some of this was right in line with what I experienced including the blown OS #8 plugs. I think that I went through 3 of them before I eventually changed over to a Fox plug with an idle bar. The Fox plug has apparently been surviving quite well.

I do believe that there is probably some mechanical issue, so I am curious as to what they find. I would feel a bit better if they do find something wrong with it, otherwise my frustration will be higher that it is this hard to tune.

I am going to probably ship my in this weekend. I'm not certain if I'm going to replace it or use the Magnum 52 on the same plane. I might just shelve the Magnum 52 and try it on the bench before my next 40 size aircraft. If it works well, then fine. If not, then I'll trash it and go with a lesson learned.
Old 05-05-2005, 06:25 AM
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turbo.gst
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

I helped a friend with a Magnum .28XL try to fix a rough spot in transition. We tried everything we could think of( at the time). We changed plugs, props, tank position, fuel tubing, different tank, and cleaning the needle assy. You had to settle for one click either rich or lean on idle. It would be the lesser of two evils to keep it rich. It just had a burble that was disturbing on transition. It would never let you fully trust it-- you know that dreaded dead stik at the worst time===== CRUNCHED PLANE.

I had read a few threads where guys claimed that nitro would make an engine less critical on settings. I never really gave it alot of credibility. One day he brought the plane out after a storage session. The only fuel we had was YS 20/20. Guess what, the engine no longer had a rough spot. In fact it had considerably more punch and made flying more fun. WE had been running 10 or 15% fuel, with 20 % oil. We then decided that for that engine, the 20% nitro made all the difference in the world. It might be worth a try........

Good luck,
Turbo
Old 05-05-2005, 06:55 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

You had to settle for one click either rich or lean on idle.
I'm not doubting you, but I have the same engine and the low speed needle doesn't click. It sounds as if you were using the high speed needle to adjust the idle. Just a thought.
Old 05-05-2005, 07:16 AM
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turbo.gst
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?

RC fiend.

Not even close to accurate. We were trying setting the idle needle. Then, you set the high end. As we are trying to get the needles balanced. Also, after the fuel was changed, the engine ran fine. I just get my other brands to run fine without having to use 20% nitro.

Turbo
Old 05-05-2005, 08:16 AM
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Default RE: Magnum XLS 52 - A 'Hunk of Junk'?


ORIGINAL: turbo.gst

IWE had been running 10 or 15% fuel, with 20 % oil. We then decided that for that engine, the 20% nitro made all the difference in the world. It might be worth a try........

Good luck,
Turbo
Interesting. I'm running 15% Wildcat now and 15%Powermaster - both with the same response. I'll consider this, but I haven't yet heard of an engine that REQUIRES that when the manufacture states as low as 5% in the manual.

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