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Old 08-26-2014, 04:13 AM
  #27376  
Hobbsy
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Pate, If your plane had a transmission you could down shift and let it rev but we're stuck with constant load and no way to reduce it other than to reduce pitch or diameter and that makes it impractical/inefficient .The little .30 runs so well at 10,500 I'm happy with that.
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Old 08-26-2014, 04:26 AM
  #27377  
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fnqflyer, not retired yet, but looking at it soon.

My friend flew Cliff Robertsons Spit for years and would buzz our house. Although the sound of a Merlin is sweet and we have several around with the Mosquito gang, just cannot get my blood flowing like the physical assault you receive when a large radial starts up and flies by.

p.s. Even a small radial or two can do the same. Back when a teenager I used to help load mail on a pair of Beech 18 Bugsmashers, (one with conventional gear) and got a ride or three out to Peelee Island. No headsets back then and the short stacks off the P/W 985's didn't help my hearing much.
Old 08-26-2014, 02:48 PM
  #27378  
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Old Fart, those OS engines were "specials" that OS produced for the Car racers. Wilder cams and slightly bigger valves. The torque band was crap for us but interesting, and I would still like one. The SC version of the Saito 30 was what we called a "grenade", pull the pin (open the throttle) and watch it explode, great idea on paper but never saw it in fact. Your 12K with the 30 could be increased marginally with blowing the nitro out to 50% and using "heli" oil (dreaded synthetic) at no more than 20% but the motor would be put to better use at my place than you doing that to it, especially if you don't compete.
Varience of the stated RPM figures on any of the current 4 strokes can be achieved by a/ nitro content, b/ oil content, c/plug length and heat range, d/ fuel delivery method and of course e/ prop design and size, not to mention composition. And all of that is before you get into the mechanicals, if you must. But then you lot all knew that didn't you
Old 08-26-2014, 02:52 PM
  #27379  
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Cougar, round engines and the tail on te ground do it for me with one exception, 4 Alison 501's (T34's) on an Electra (L188c) / Orion. I think the Spitfire is grossly over rated much prefer a big Alison (P40 etc) or a big radial eg Sea Fury. And in all of that comes the Beech and Lockheed radial twins and the B727-200 (best pax jet around both maintenance and looks wise) Oh yes Cougar, you'll never give up aviation if you have the passion. "Retirement" is upon me but not working on full size a/c.
Old 08-26-2014, 06:33 PM
  #27380  
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Originally Posted by FNQFLYER
Old Fart, those OS engines were "specials" that OS produced for the Car racers. Wilder cams and slightly bigger valves. The torque band was crap for us but interesting, and I would still like one. The SC version of the Saito 30 was what we called a "grenade", pull the pin (open the throttle) and watch it explode, great idea on paper but never saw it in fact. Your 12K with the 30 could be increased marginally with blowing the nitro out to 50% and using "heli" oil (dreaded synthetic) at no more than 20% but the motor would be put to better use at my place than you doing that to it, especially if you don't compete.
Varience of the stated RPM figures on any of the current 4 strokes can be achieved by a/ nitro content, b/ oil content, c/plug length and heat range, d/ fuel delivery method and of course e/ prop design and size, not to mention composition. And all of that is before you get into the mechanicals, if you must. But then you lot all knew that didn't you
OldFart, l'm with you! l have a O.S. 90 and a Saito 91. the Satio is a around a year are two newer? Than the O.S. (Not knocking the O.S) and l may be rong? The real only thing l don't like about the O.S. is that the plug is in the front, (The years go by so fast l have a hard time keeping up with when l relly got them?) l know l have more time on the Satio. The Satio seem's to be the Harley Davidson of the two in power, starting and EZ's of tunning. The O.S. l had to use a pump to make it behave! One click of the needle valve may be too much on the O.S. and there both inverted. LOL..... Go Satio! =-] P.S. Brother said he's comming next week? Will see. ='-{
Old 08-26-2014, 07:27 PM
  #27381  
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Originally Posted by FNQFLYER
4 Alison 501's (T34's) on an Electra (L188c) .......

....... and the B727-200 (best pax jet around both maintenance and looks wise)
I'm with you on the Electra but I just have to point out that you forgot about the beauty of the original, unstretched DC-9.

I was never a jet mechanic, but my dad was for Delta. He always said the L-1011 was the best maintenance wise.
Old 08-26-2014, 07:42 PM
  #27382  
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Wow what a nice engine. Ran my first tank of gas through the FG-11. When I first went to run it, it would pop, and I was like, huh? had spark, had gas, then realized the needle was all the way in, DOH. Ran it out one full turn, and it fired right up. After 10 minutes I wasn't satisfied with the oil residue, there was hardly any at all, so I mixed in 4 more ounces into the gallon, drained the tank and refilled it, NOW I am satisfied with the oil, there was PLENTY of it all over the plane. I ran it by the book one tank at 4000 RPM WOT setting it really rich. It ran over an hour on the 10 ounce tank. Every so often I would lean it out and peak it a bit, and move the throttle up and down and very nice transitions, I am going to love this engine. While it was running I would feel the engine and it was warm, but not hot enough to burn, only hot spot was the exhaust pipe.

It calls for 20:1, I mixed it 16:1 and when I really didnt see any oil residue I got it down to 12:1. After the next tank I will mix in a quart of fresh gas with what left and get it back to about 16:1. The oil that coated the plane was from the breather, so I devised a scavenger with a piece of brass tubing and fuel line. I just need to get a hose clamp, I dont think the zip tie would last very long. This one was so easy to start compared to the DLE, that took forever to get gas going.


Old 08-26-2014, 10:04 PM
  #27383  
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Hey guys, please enlighten me about using epoxy as a thread locker. Do you mean just using the resin, or the hardener by itself perhaps? Thanks!
Old 08-27-2014, 02:38 AM
  #27384  
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Acdc it's too good for words when a plan goes well eh ? are you sure your just not adding more oil to the mix because you miss cleaning up castor ?

Barry ps dc9 ? v constellation in beauty ?
Old 08-27-2014, 03:25 AM
  #27385  
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Originally Posted by Old Fart
Acdc it's too good for words when a plan goes well eh ? are you sure your just not adding more oil to the mix because you miss cleaning up castor ?

Barry ps dc9 ? v constellation in beauty ?
Aww damn, my secrets out!
Old 08-27-2014, 04:06 AM
  #27386  
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Barry, the hardest i was ever slammed into the back of an airplane was aboard an L1011 taking off from Atlanta and there were no empty seats. That thing launched as if Don Garlets was in the left seat

I still owe us a run of the 1.50 with the CH ignition set at 35 degrees. I was hoping i could get some 10% Wildcat fuel for that but the budget says no. 15% will have to do for now..
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Old 08-27-2014, 06:26 AM
  #27387  
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Originally Posted by blw
I'm with you on the Electra but I just have to point out that you forgot about the beauty of the original, unstretched DC-9.

I was never a jet mechanic, but my dad was for Delta. He always said the L-1011 was the best maintenance wise.
I never worked on passenger planes, only a couple of combat planes. But I was told that the L-1011 was always better that the DC-10. It is just the the DC-10 was rushed to the market to gain a larger chunk of the market to beat out the L-1011. That is why the DC-10 had some serious issues at first, like doors that blew out during flight.

Going back to Saitos, I do love my 91S. I will fly it this weekend, been using either a 14x8 APC or a wood 15x6. I have not flown my FA-82 lately, I will fly that plane too this weekend, weather permitting.

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Old 08-27-2014, 06:35 AM
  #27388  
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Originally Posted by Hobbsy
Barry, the hardest i was ever slammed into the back of an airplane was aboard an L1011 taking off from Atlanta and there were no empty seats. That thing launched as if Don Garlets was in the left seat

I still owe us a run of the 1.50 with the CH ignition set at 35 degrees. I was hoping i could get some 10% Wildcat fuel for that but the budget says no. 15% will have to do for now..
Contrary to popular belief, nitro does give a significant power boost when CDI is employed so the nitro won't be wasted. If you want to keep it simple & run the same fuel as you use in your GI engines.
Old 08-27-2014, 06:54 AM
  #27389  
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Thanks Dan, the HC 1.50 and the HC .80 are more friendly on 10% but keeping it simple is good policy.
Old 08-27-2014, 09:49 PM
  #27390  
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Still need some info on using epoxy as a thread locker.... thanks.
Old 08-28-2014, 01:32 AM
  #27391  
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Ernie i can't help with the threadlocker tho going by previous comments here there are plenty who can.I never use it on saito engines and have never had an engine bolt back itself out,ever.If that did ever happen i'd go back to something i used in the old motorcycle racing days,drill it and lock wire the bolt head to the nearest point.Lots of tiny drills round nowadays.
Old 08-28-2014, 01:55 AM
  #27392  
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Originally Posted by Hobbsy
Pate, If your plane had a transmission you could down shift and let it rev but we're stuck with constant load and no way to reduce it other than to reduce pitch or diameter and that makes it impractical/inefficient .The little .30 runs so well at 10,500 I'm happy with that.
Dave thanks for that,i should have elaborated on the question tho,if nobody knows the answer that's cool too.I'm wondering what the differences are between the fa30 and the fa30sc to allow twice the rpm.Cam,pushrods,rocker gear,valve springs,valves and seats would be much improved or have saito built such a strong engine that they can pull double the rpm we would ever do? that's an overly strong engine for production and less profit to saito.I'm obviously no mechanic,i'm a spraypainter suffering from a lifetime of solvent abuse but even i've heard of valve bounce.These 20k plus rpm figures i normally see on a 300k fourstroke/honda/yamaha/ducati moto gp engine and they run variable timing pneumatic valves.
Old 08-28-2014, 03:34 AM
  #27393  
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The automotive equivalent to propeller pitch/diameter is the torque converter. If you want maximum speed, prop your engine for the RPM where maximum torque is produced. The prop will unload @ speed & engine RPM will increase. If you want maximum thrust, prop the engine just a few hundred RPM less than the maximum HP range.

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Old 08-28-2014, 04:33 AM
  #27394  
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Originally Posted by Ernie Misner
Hey guys, please enlighten me about using epoxy as a thread locker. Do you mean just using the resin, or the hardener by itself perhaps? Thanks!
l hope this will help there Ernie Misner! l use my wifes old nail polish or paint when l dont have any loctoite. I use the red on everything, l don't have good luck with blue.
Old 08-28-2014, 04:39 AM
  #27395  
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Originally Posted by Old Fart
Ernie i can't help with the threadlocker tho going by previous comments here there are plenty who can.I never use it on saito engines and have never had an engine bolt back itself out,ever.If that did ever happen i'd go back to something i used in the old motorcycle racing days,drill it and lock wire the bolt head to the nearest point.Lots of tiny drills round nowadays.
Yeah lock wire. When I was missile launcher teck early in the navy Every bolt got locked wired. And if some one stood next to my launcher too long I would attempt to lock wire them also (or at least use duck tape on 'em)

I have a ST 3000 powered plane that I still lock wire the wing bolts on even though it is a pain in the rear 'cause some low life piece of&(() stole my my lock wire pliers. I would like to clamp them up on their ______ and pull!

Lock wire pliers are expensive, at least they are out of my range on a very limited income.

Ken
Old 08-28-2014, 05:34 AM
  #27396  
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acdii, that sure is a pretty plane!!! Makes me want to bring out my Sig Rascal to fly this weekend.

It has an Irvine 40 rather than a Saito though. I considered putting a Saito in it, but the Irvine was doing such a good job. Maybe someday if I get ahold of a Saito 56 (or similar) for a good price.

Last edited by hsukaria; 08-28-2014 at 05:37 AM.
Old 08-28-2014, 08:01 AM
  #27397  
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I learned about using epoxy by accident when fuelproofing a firewall and getting it in the blindnut threads. Now, I use it on engine backplates, those blindnuts, and for the threaded muffler attach bolts. I mix it up normally and swab some in the threads and let it dry. Bolts will thread right in and stay put. No vibrating out anymore. The epoxy gets chewed up some when you thread in a bolt and holds. I think the advantage is that it gets screwed into boogers , has better mass in the threads, and just stays there holding the threads like thousands of little blobs. It doesn't harm anything.

The DC-10 got a bad PR rap. If you look they are still flying the crap out of them for freight, FedX, etc.

Okay, maybe a bare metal Connie looked pretty good like the all metal DC-3. I saw one of those a few years ago. The all metal finish B-25 is beautiful too.

I flew in a Constellation when I was about 8 years old. I saw Gen. Douglas MacArthur's Connie take off from a short field at Fort Rucker when the Army sold it to a private company in the late 1980's. It had sat outside at the museum for decades. I would see it outside my window every day when I was in flight school. Some mechanics got it barely flight worthy for a short hop for extended maintenance about 20 miles south. They dropped the chain link fence at the end of the runway but the 12' poles stayed in the ground. I was there at 6 am with a crowd to watch. The pilot ran up those engines and I wished he would just stay there and let me listen all morning. The runway was less than 2000' and he barely rumbled down it. It looked like a magic trick when he did a clean and jerk takeoff. He yanked back on the yoke and up came the nose and it jumped up in the air. The wheels and wings cleared the fence poles by mere feet. He didn't raise the gears and headed straight towards Dothan Airport staying at about 200'. What a sight and what a beautiful sound!
Old 08-28-2014, 08:19 AM
  #27398  
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I am still considering purchasing a used Saito 100. Is there anything about that engine in particular that I should watch out for?

By the way, the Air Force Museum in Wright Patterson AFB in Dayton, OH has a Connie on display at the Presidential planes hangar. If memory serves me right, It has a dummy of president Eisenhower in it.

Last edited by hsukaria; 08-28-2014 at 08:21 AM.
Old 08-28-2014, 08:27 AM
  #27399  
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Originally Posted by SrTelemaster150
Contrary to popular belief, nitro does give a significant power boost when CDI is employed so the nitro won't be wasted. If you want to keep it simple & run the same fuel as you use in your GI engines.
This may have been discussed already, but if nitro is mainly used as an ignition advancer, couldn't that function be performed by the electronic ignition timing? Or does the nitro allow for even more advanced timing, and consequently, higher brake torque (not to mention cooling because of the endothermic reaction it creates).
Old 08-28-2014, 09:00 AM
  #27400  
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HS, the 1.00, barring any kind of abuse is a very user friendly and reliable engine. no unusual quircks or bad habits. I bought one that had been run on synthetic only and had rusty bearings and cam. I replaced the bearings and only wiped off the rust on the cam, it shined right up. I know that some here cringe at the synthetic only dig but its an honest dig. It's the second rusty engine I've bought where synthetic only was part of the sale hype.

PS, that nitro% VS timing when using spark ignition, is a great question.
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