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Old 08-30-2014, 04:56 AM
  #27426  
Charley
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Originally Posted by Old Fart
What if barry is right .He and others say heat softens epoxy and that works for me too in the paint world which is my job.If the heat softens epoxy it would grip steel well.
It depends on the epoxy. Take Devcon aluminum epoxy, for instance; used to use it on McCullough chainsaw-engine blocks for go-kart mods. Cured it in an oven. OTOH, I once used hobby epoxy to glue a ply firewall into a balsa fuse, had it all blocked up but it moved after I left it. I used a heat gun to soften the epoxy; actually the epoxy disintegrated into little balls, easy cleanup with alcohol. After that I took to drilling and pinning firewalls before gluing.

CR
Old 08-31-2014, 03:41 AM
  #27427  
Rudolph Hart
 
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Pope i'm not sure what the problem is here,did'nt watch the video but you ain't far off gettin your own new product warning label.If the mods allow it have at it son.
Old 08-31-2014, 06:25 AM
  #27428  
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There is one born everyday
Old 08-31-2014, 02:03 PM
  #27429  
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Ok, scale event at the field on the w/end and a few truisms came back If you don't balance your a/c correctly it really won't fly all that well and usually ends up with damage to a/c Blom and Voss Bv141 landed tail first off the end of the strip. If you run out of fuel and forget the various laws of aerodynamics you generally crash. P47 ran out of fuel, lack of skill in unpowered flight meant a/c tip stalled and demolished a/frame.
Now big question, Has anybody flown a Hanger 9 Fokker DV11. If so what engine did you use. Hanger 9 recommend a Saito 82 but the one being flown on the w/end had a Saito 100 fitted and the guy said it was barely adequate. Thoughts please as I am about to put this combination together.
Old 08-31-2014, 02:19 PM
  #27430  
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Is that the bipe? If H9 recommends it, that means they flown it with that engine. The guy with the 100 might have not propped it right.

I flew my T-Clips today with the Saito FG-11. Wonderful combination! That Saito is so quiet, you wouldn't know it was gas. I spilled more fuel in the 20 minutes flying than I used flying. I corrected the fuel tank vent, I forgot to put a loop in it so it spilled gas when the nose was down, and in my taxi tests I put the nose down a few times. I put a 13x8 APC on it, it calls for a 13X7, so I need to get the proper prop, might have a bit more with the proper one. In any case, I have one tank through it, and about an ounce or two from the second tank and it is running great. Once I get two more tanks through it I will thin the mixture a bit by adding a quart of fresh fuel to the current gallon, I want to make sure there is plenty of lube, and it is getting it. I also put a crankcase scavenging system on, put a brass tube on the muffler with the end bent down and angled at the opening so that the exhaust pulls the oil out of the crank and it is working great. Burned my forearm on the muffler too. Once I get a few tanks through it I will find the right angle adapter and put the cowl on.
Old 08-31-2014, 03:05 PM
  #27431  
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Originally Posted by FNQFLYER
Ok, scale event at the field on the w/end and a few truisms came back If you don't balance your a/c correctly it really won't fly all that well and usually ends up with damage to a/c Blom and Voss Bv141 landed tail first off the end of the strip. If you run out of fuel and forget the various laws of aerodynamics you generally crash. P47 ran out of fuel, lack of skill in unpowered flight meant a/c tip stalled and demolished a/frame.
Now big question, Has anybody flown a Hanger 9 Fokker DV11. If so what engine did you use. Hanger 9 recommend a Saito 82 but the one being flown on the w/end had a Saito 100 fitted and the guy said it was barely adequate. Thoughts please as I am about to put this combination together.
It's DVII as in D-7 Roman numeral style.

Why have people started calling it DV-11 as of late. Would the the DVIII be DV-111?
Old 08-31-2014, 08:00 PM
  #27432  
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Originally Posted by Hobbsy
Now, as to using epoxy as a thread locker, if you've ever used a metal rod to stir epoxy, you'll note that epoxy is slick on things it can't soak into. It will just slide off. (Even when set up/hard) So I don't see it being effective at holding anything metal.
Try it sometime. I know that it fixed my 72 backplate problems once and for all. I've had it apart a few times since, so no fears over gluing my engine together. I think I used a dab on my 82, and an Evolution has muffler bolts with epoxy on them since they wouldn't stay put.

For blindnuts on firewalls I usually use thinned epoxy that I have mixed with alcohol for fuel proofing and get it into the threads. I thread in the bolts later. No problems backing the bolts out if needed, and the epoxy holds when reused. Been doing that for 7 or 8 years of kit building. On engines, I just swab in the threads and either use the bolts right away, or later. It never seems to act like a glue, rather more of a gripper in the threads. I suspect it improves metal to metal contact. It sure stops threaded hardware from vibrating and backing out and doesn't hurt anything.
Old 08-31-2014, 08:07 PM
  #27433  
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Yep, it's gone and follow up comments.
Old 09-01-2014, 01:31 AM
  #27434  
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No i hav'nt flown one trev but look at a couple of vids on youtube.It shows a laser 70 flying one at scale and what seems to be an overpowered one with a saito 82 which looks to be too rich at low throttle settings,and an fa82 will suck the paint right off a laser 70
Old 09-01-2014, 01:42 AM
  #27435  
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Hey acdc you posted a pix a while back with the brass line set up ? it looks neat and tidy,glad it works well.I hear castor is wonderful for burns like you just suffered off that nasty hot running gas engine.You just sniff the castor and nitro while running a nitro fuelled glow saito,takes your mind right off it..
Old 09-01-2014, 01:49 AM
  #27436  
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Originally Posted by SrTelemaster150
It's DVII as in D-7 Roman numeral style.

Why have people started calling it DV-11 as of late. Would the the DVIII be DV-111?
No,D is the roman numeral for 500..so that could be 507? what d matter
Old 09-01-2014, 05:52 AM
  #27437  
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Originally Posted by Old Fart
No,D is the roman numeral for 500..so that could be 507? what d matter
What's the Arabic equivalent to DR-I?
Old 09-01-2014, 03:03 PM
  #27438  
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Gee, I got some interesting responses to my post and thanks. I'll be testing / running in the 82 in my Sig Senior trainer / experimental machine and I thought I would match the weight in the SIG to that of the DR7 (DV11) but going by the comments I think it might be a needless exersise. Old fart I got a Lazer 70 in a trade the other day so that could also be a distant option. accdii from the information I have gathered on Saito gas good repeat good quality oil is paramount and the gas engines once they have some fuel run through them (about 10 oz) are reasonable tolerant to variation in mix as long as good repeat good oil is used. Also using them in a sports environment rather than competition. Now a little secret for those interested. A while ago I came up against an Enya 53 that ran like the clappers, better than any I have ever seen. My mate some how got hold of it and we pulled it apart and found it had a ceramic liner and slightly changed timing. I have fitted a similar liner with a hand lapped piston to an OS 32SXH and we achieved an increase of 3,000rpm and the engine is still in one piece. No other parameters (fuel mix or prop) where changed. Next is to test the theory on a 56 or 62 or maybe a worn out 65
Old 09-01-2014, 03:06 PM
  #27439  
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Keep us posted, that's good stuff.
Old 09-01-2014, 05:07 PM
  #27440  
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What happened to the post? I got this email:
"the pope has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - Welcome to Club SAITO ! - in the Glow Engines forum of RC Forums - RC Universe discussion forums for RC cars, rc trucks, rc airplanes, rc helis, rc boats, rc jets, rc electric helis, rc electric planes and more.

This thread is located at:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/show...4&goto=newpost



But when I clicked on the link, the post was not there.

Last edited by blw; 09-01-2014 at 05:23 PM. Reason: Edit for profanity
Old 09-01-2014, 05:24 PM
  #27441  
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RC- Fanatic- I had to edit the profanity out of your message. That's why the original post was deleted.
Old 09-01-2014, 09:52 PM
  #27442  
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[QUOTE=blw;11869904]I learned about using epoxy by accident when fuelproofing a firewall and getting it in the blindnut threads. Now, I use it on engine backplates, those blindnuts, and for the threaded muffler attach bolts. I mix it up normally and swab some in the threads and let it dry. Bolts will thread right in and stay put. No vibrating out anymore. The epoxy gets chewed up some when you thread in a bolt and holds. I think the advantage is that it gets screwed into boogers , has better mass in the threads, and just stays there holding the threads like thousands of little blobs. It doesn't harm anything.

Now that makes sense, letting the epoxy harden, then thread the bolt in..... thanks!
Old 09-01-2014, 09:54 PM
  #27443  
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Isn't the Laser engine more of a collector's item rather than comparing to a Saito for power? One of our modeler's passed away and a NIB Laser (70 or so?) had a price of $100 on it. Maybe I should have picked it up. Anyone have a clue how much it might have been worth?
Old 09-01-2014, 10:40 PM
  #27444  
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Although this forum is listed under "glow engines" I thought the following might be of interest to Saito people who want to try a Saito gas engine.
I did post this on another forum but will repeat here my experience with the Saito FG-11

This is just to let people know I have had a very favorable experience with the FG-11. Installed it about 3 weeks ago and now had about 20 good flights.
Engine is mounted inverted, Evolution Oil, 2200mAH LiFe battery for ignition (but could use smaller capacity), Sullivan filter just before carb, APC 13x7 prop,
tank is close to engine just behind firewall about level with carb.
Getting 8800-9000 rpm at full throttle.

Some things that might help:
1. High-speed needle: It is difficult to set the correct high-speed needle despite having a tach. When running in on the ground, if engine dies as you advance the throttle I found mixture was too lean and richened it 2 clicks at a time until engine did not quit. I later held the model vertical with engine up, and richened it a bit one click or two so that engine kept running with no hesitation at full throttle.

However when flying and going into a loop the first time, the engine quit at the top of the loop. I then richened mixture two clicks and tried again. Next time the engine did not quit but stumbled. I did this several times successively richening two clicks at a time until the engine ran smoothly at full power during loops and verticals. I then did not touch the high-speed mixture for many flights with no trouble at all and never had the engine die while flying.

Next fine-tuned the low speed needle a little. Idle is now 2400 rpm and probably could get lower but have no yet bothered to tinker with it.

2. Starting: When air is in the fuel line after just filling tank, or between flights, the carb would not effectively suck the fuel up to the carb. With the Saito glow engines if the throttle was advanced and you spin the engine with a starter the fuel would easily fill the line and prime the engine. This did not work for me with the FG-11.
If you have access to the carb and stick your finger over the venturi then turn the prop you can prime the engine OK. However with a cowled engine, as I have, this won't work and starting the engine initially, or between flights, was sometimes a problem. I solved that as follows: get about 12 inched of Tygon fuel tubing and stick a short length of 1/8 brass tubing in one end. If the engine will not start due to air in line just before carb, insert the brass tubing into the tank vent line and blow into the tubing for a couple of seconds. This sends the fuel into the carb and the engine always started for me after that.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That is my experience hope it helps. .
Old 09-02-2014, 03:40 AM
  #27445  
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Ernie, I had a LASER .70 for a while and it is a fine engine, the less nitro the better. It turned a 13x6 at about 9,000 on 5% fuel. It was barely audible at idle.
Old 09-02-2014, 04:36 AM
  #27446  
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Default New project question

I just bought a pristine kit of a Carl Goldberg Skylane 62. I built a 1/2 a version in the 60's. I am thinking of a saitio 40 4 cycle for scale sound, 2 cycle for originality or electric to help my old back. The kit hasn't arrived and I'm not sure yet of a four stroke fit in the original design. With the demise of infernal combustion I am wondering what future support of saito engines might look like going forward if I go the four stroke route? Thanks for your thoughts.
Old 09-02-2014, 05:17 AM
  #27447  
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Originally Posted by skypup50
I just bought a pristine kit of a Carl Goldberg Skylane 62. I built a 1/2 a version in the 60's. I am thinking of a saitio 40 4 cycle for scale sound, 2 cycle for originality or electric to help my old back. The kit hasn't arrived and I'm not sure yet of a four stroke fit in the original design. With the demise of infernal combustion I am wondering what future support of saito engines might look like going forward if I go the four stroke route? Thanks for your thoughts.
"demise of infernal combustion?" So you're saying that "Hell Froze Over?"

Internal combustion will be around for a long time. Not just because of nostalgic reasons, but because of higher efficiency and future improvements.

Last edited by hsukaria; 09-02-2014 at 05:24 AM.
Old 09-02-2014, 06:31 AM
  #27448  
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Originally Posted by hsukaria
"demise of infernal combustion?" So you're saying that "Hell Froze Over?"

Internal combustion will be around for a long time. Not just because of nostalgic reasons, but because of higher efficiency and future improvements.
I've been in this hobby over 50 years. I've heard people complaining about Horizon carrying fewer parts for Saitios and see the 40's are selling for $169.00 so I was wondering if Saito support was something I need to concern myself with. I love all forms of modeling and the realistic sounds and smells of 4 strokes. I grew up on 2 strokes. I went mostly electric or gasoline over the last 10 years including the helicopters I fly, as have others. I can definitely see that trends are changing just like they did going from kits to ARF's which is sad but true.

Infernal was a humorous reference to a saying my brother-in-law use to use referring to a cantankerous engine.
Old 09-02-2014, 08:41 AM
  #27449  
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Originally Posted by skypup50
I've been in this hobby over 50 years. I've heard people complaining about Horizon carrying fewer parts for Saitios and see the 40's are selling for $169.00 so I was wondering if Saito support was something I need to concern myself with. I love all forms of modeling and the realistic sounds and smells of 4 strokes. I grew up on 2 strokes. I went mostly electric or gasoline over the last 10 years including the helicopters I fly, as have others. I can definitely see that trends are changing just like they did going from kits to ARF's which is sad but true.

Infernal was a humorous reference to a saying my brother-in-law use to use referring to a cantankerous engine.
I am also concerned about engine spare parts over the next few years. I suppose for my 2-strokes, what will wear out are the bearings and rings (or piston/liner). Those are replaceable by other suppliers (except the piston/liner). Even the muffler and carb are replaceable with some adapter if they are damaged in a crash.

For 4-strokes, I see what you mean about unavailability of spare parts can shelf the engine. I see that Saito is adding gas versions of the glow engines while they reduce their glow engine lineup. Maybe going with gas Saitos is the way to go.
Old 09-02-2014, 10:01 AM
  #27450  
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Originally Posted by bjw4072
Although this forum is listed under "glow engines" I thought the following might be of interest to Saito people who want to try a Saito gas engine.
I did post this on another forum but will repeat here my experience with the Saito FG-11

This is just to let people know I have had a very favorable experience with the FG-11. Installed it about 3 weeks ago and now had about 20 good flights.
Engine is mounted inverted, Evolution Oil, 2200mAH LiFe battery for ignition (but could use smaller capacity), Sullivan filter just before carb, APC 13x7 prop,
tank is close to engine just behind firewall about level with carb.
Getting 8800-9000 rpm at full throttle.

Some things that might help:
1. High-speed needle: It is difficult to set the correct high-speed needle despite having a tach. When running in on the ground, if engine dies as you advance the throttle I found mixture was too lean and richened it 2 clicks at a time until engine did not quit. I later held the model vertical with engine up, and richened it a bit one click or two so that engine kept running with no hesitation at full throttle.

However when flying and going into a loop the first time, the engine quit at the top of the loop. I then richened mixture two clicks and tried again. Next time the engine did not quit but stumbled. I did this several times successively richening two clicks at a time until the engine ran smoothly at full power during loops and verticals. I then did not touch the high-speed mixture for many flights with no trouble at all and never had the engine die while flying.

Next fine-tuned the low speed needle a little. Idle is now 2400 rpm and probably could get lower but have no yet bothered to tinker with it.

2. Starting: When air is in the fuel line after just filling tank, or between flights, the carb would not effectively suck the fuel up to the carb. With the Saito glow engines if the throttle was advanced and you spin the engine with a starter the fuel would easily fill the line and prime the engine. This did not work for me with the FG-11.
If you have access to the carb and stick your finger over the venturi then turn the prop you can prime the engine OK. However with a cowled engine, as I have, this won't work and starting the engine initially, or between flights, was sometimes a problem. I solved that as follows: get about 12 inched of Tygon fuel tubing and stick a short length of 1/8 brass tubing in one end. If the engine will not start due to air in line just before carb, insert the brass tubing into the tank vent line and blow into the tubing for a couple of seconds. This sends the fuel into the carb and the engine always started for me after that.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That is my experience hope it helps. .
Other than running a 13x8 APC, what I am finding with the FG-11 is on the ground I tuned the HS to peak, reduced 200 RPM and then richened by 4 clicks and have good transition, while still on the rich side. Flew through loops and rolls and not even a hiccup. From what I can see, the FG-11 is just a spark plug, Carb and magnet on the whatchamacallit. Looks like with these parts it would be easy to convert any of their glow to gas. Compared to the DLE, this engine runs SO much better throughout the range from idle to WOT.

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