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Old 10-02-2006, 07:12 AM
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Hi

I think I have asked this before, but I can't seem to find the answar anymore.

Regarding fuel blends, I want to use a blend with 3-5 % castor in it. But which castor brand to use, and where to get it in Europe???.

Right now I am investigating how to get hold of some Castrol M castor oil, but it seems a bit hard to get.

I also notised that some of you use Powermaster blends with 15% nitro and synth/castor oil blend. But this mixture seems not to be a standard brand at Powermaster site ??? I can only find a Powermaster 5% nitro with 12/6 synth/castor blend !!!! Any idea ????
Old 10-02-2006, 07:32 AM
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http://www.powermasterfuels.com/products/sport.html

Right here
Old 10-02-2006, 07:48 AM
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Kaastrup, you could find out who distributes Klotz in Denmark. Klotz Benol is probably the best racing castor

http://www.klotzlube.com/linkss.asp None in Denmark, but can be found in your neighbouring countries. You can get it off ebay too
Old 10-02-2006, 10:15 AM
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Tx for the fast answer...
Old 10-02-2006, 11:00 AM
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

ORIGINAL: Bob93447

For Bill Robison.

I have a Saito 72 which is about 3 1/2 years old and which has accumulated about 70 flying hours (probably 80 hours total with breakin and taxi) powering a YCD 46. I'm running Powermaster 15% fuel with castor/syn mix with an OS-F glowplug. Lately, even after setting the valves, I've noticed a 200-400 rpm drop in peak power. Is this normal for a Saito or should I be looking for backplate leaks or some other ailment?

Thanks,

Bob

AMA # 93447
That is a LOT of flying for an RC engine [X(] Thats a pretty good feat to fly that many hours wihtout a crash The Saito 72 has a backplate problem. If it were my engine I would replace the backplate and the O-Rings in the intake manifold where it goes into the cylender. It sounds like yours did not have a problem, but its such a frequent problem I would do it to avoid it in the future. Im not sure what is causing your Saito to lose 200-400 RPM, it does not sound like an intake leak, but it may be a very small intake leak [sm=confused.gif] My second guess would be maybe the cam lobes are wearing [sm=confused.gif]

Is it possible to wear out a Saito in 80 hours running with proper care and fuel, I look forward to Dr. Robinsons thoughts on this also

JettPilot
Old 10-02-2006, 11:41 PM
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JettPilot

Thanks for the hint on the backplate. After my next flying session I will tear into the motor and try to see what is going on. Any ideas when Saito changed the backplate design? I did notice a bit of leakage recently that went away when I tightened the screws on the backplate. But I have also noticed an increased sensitivity to needle valve setting, as well as a much tighter setting of the high speed needle ( it is very rich at a setting of 1 1/4 turns out).

The reason that I have been able to put so many hours on my Saito without crashing is that my primary aircraft is the U-Can-do .46. It's far easier to fly than the trainers that I learned on in my early days of RC. Since I seem to have gotten one of the overweight versions, about 6 1/4 lbs., I haven't been able to get as far into 3-D flying as I had hoped, thereby avoiding a lot of ground contact.

Regards,

Bob
Old 10-03-2006, 12:13 AM
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For Professor Bill

A final update on my friend's 125 that lost 1000 RPM for no discernible reason:

He had the original engine returned to him after all and not a replacement new build as first alluded to.

The Australian Saito people alleged that my friend had taken his engine apart and had "tampered" with the cam gear fastener (it was apparently loose) and placed the power loss and noises squarely with this cause.

My friend had not touched anything other than the mixture needles and had certainly not disassembled the engine, so I am inclined to the opinion that the Oz Saito people are full of it!!

I am more inclined to believe that this was a quality control issue at the factory and for some strange reason they wouldn't (or couldn't) bring themselves to admit this.

They sent his engine back to him "repaired" with this unsatisfactory explanation, a slap on the wrist and the added admonition NOT to run castor in a Saito.

Cheers,

TC
Old 10-03-2006, 01:13 AM
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ORIGINAL: Thunderchild
They sent his engine back to him "repaired" with this unsatisfactory explanation, a slap on the wrist and the added admonition NOT to run castor in a Saito.
And that's why *I* import my Saitos from the USA rather than buying from Australia :-)
Old 10-03-2006, 01:19 AM
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I hear you Exjet. I think I'll be joining you.

TC
Old 10-03-2006, 12:46 PM
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ORIGINAL: Thunderchild

They sent his engine back to him "repaired" with this unsatisfactory explanation, a slap on the wrist and the added admonition NOT to run castor in a Saito.

Cheers,

TC
They are full of it [:@]

Its probably just one guy in charge of the operation there in Austrailia that does not have a clue about the effects of castor oil in a Saito. He is wrongly telling the entire country not to run castor in thier Saitos.

Someone needs to smack him upside the head for that.

JettPilot
Old 10-03-2006, 12:52 PM
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Haven't you guys heard?? Saito has jumped on the OS bandwagon and is now turning out junk engines so they can sell more of them. After you buy one and have a problem they refuse to honor the warranty and blame the owner for abusing the engine.

Why would Saito admit anything when it's easier to blame the user? It's just starting in Australia as a test area.

One question. What is a cam gear fastener?? None of my Saitos have a cam gear fastener. The only screw at all is the set screw that keeps the shaft that the cams and gear ride on from coming out. I have had this screw completely disapper and the engine still runs fine. By the time there might be a problem it should be obvious that the shaft was sliding forward. If it came all the way out the engine wouldn't run at all as the gear teeth would have been ripped off.
Old 10-03-2006, 01:46 PM
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I have instruction sheets that came with Saito engines that say DO NOT USE castor oil. I ignore them but that's what they say. I would bet the Aussie guy is quoting those instructions.
Old 10-03-2006, 04:16 PM
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ORIGINAL: loughbd

I have instruction sheets that came with Saito engines that say DO NOT USE castor oil.
I have in hand a Saito instruction manual, Version 2005 that reads: "a mix of synthetic-castor oil is acceoptabe...".

jess
Old 10-03-2006, 06:16 PM
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The instruction manual from Japan does say no castor oil. The instruction manual from Horizon says that a synthetic-castor mix is acceptable. Just depends which one you are referring to.
Old 10-03-2006, 06:29 PM
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I have both kinds of manuals also
Old 10-03-2006, 07:08 PM
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I guess the set screw is what came loose. The story is recounted to the best of my recollection. Perhaps I should have referred to an exploded view of the engine to get the correct terminolgy. Apologies.

On the use of castor, I too have seen both versions of the manuals - one for using castor/synth mix and one against. Nothing like covering all bases.

I can just see the repsonses from the manufacturer:

"You blew up your engine because you were running a castor/synth mix" or

"You blew up your engine because you were running synthetic only"


Take your pick - they got you!

TC

Moderator removed quote that no longer exists....
Old 10-03-2006, 07:17 PM
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Hey Jessiej,

How about that?? I was right. Will wonders never cease? Not only on Japanese instructions but in good old USA imports too. I can send you a copy is you'd like.

Do you really think I say things without being able to back them up? I also didn't say ALL Saito instructions say that. There was a time when Saito instructions said no castor oil. It was hashed over in Clarence Lee's engine column as well as other articles.
Old 10-03-2006, 08:10 PM
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Anyone, suggestions please. OK, I have a saito 220 running 30% cool power swinging a 20 X 6 pro zinger that has been well broken in and was running very well for at least the past 30-40 flights.....Just recently out of nowere it dosn't want to idle anymore. It will only run with the igniter. So I assume it must be to rich and proceed to lean the low end. There is definitly a reaction when I do that, however, the engine still cuts out when the igniter is taken off. At best it will idle for 20+/- seconds and then cut. From approximately 3500rpm it will run just fine without the igniter. At this point I'm not sure what to do.

EMVIN
clubSaito#237
Old 10-03-2006, 08:16 PM
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Emvin, when idling, pinch the fuel line just before the carb. See what the engine does. If it revs up and then dies, then the low-end is still too rich. Have you adjusted the valve lash?
Old 10-03-2006, 08:33 PM
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Valve lash? It still being to rich I believe it is, but, the low end has been adjusted in so far that it wont idle at all and when I start to richen the mix 20+/- seconds is as good as it gets.
Old 10-03-2006, 08:38 PM
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Can you say YS
Old 10-03-2006, 08:39 PM
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The valve gap should be adjusted to 0.0015 to 0.002 inch. Do you use a filter in your fuel line?
Old 10-03-2006, 08:57 PM
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Take your YS and put it somewere
Old 10-03-2006, 09:18 PM
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

What rajul said and you may want to try a new plug as well.

Good Luck!

jess
Old 10-03-2006, 09:49 PM
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I bet you need a new plug. Running that high notro is murder on glow plugs.

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