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Old 06-04-2021, 10:46 AM
  #50476  
the Wasp
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Originally Posted by 1200SportsterRider
The 120 R-3 pictured turned a Graupner 14 x 7 at 7,760 rpm and idled at 1,830 rpm with a very clean crisp midrange. The Keleo ring made zero tank pressure, it had no pressure tap when it arrived, I drilled and tapped it for a pressure tap, I attached a balloon and the balloon hung there mostly limp. The 170 might make some pressure.
funny to me that you are talking about "tank exhaust pressure". just yesterday I had a friend weld me up a muffler for my OS 70sz Heli engine that I am putting in my ShoeString racer (a bolt in fit). and I said something about the tanks hose barb. he asked> "you pressurize the tank with alcohol in it with exhaust pressure....................... yee-up.

Jim
Old 06-04-2021, 11:01 AM
  #50477  
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Yep, that's a Skycrane, surely not a Bell 429
Old 06-05-2021, 02:59 AM
  #50478  
1200SportsterRider
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Originally Posted by RoKit
That is exactly what I did and it runs fantastic at 1700 idle and 9200 wot with 16x8 MAS.
BUT
I also like to use the mid range,, my transition and mid range is very very much less than fantastic.

Ro, I know that those low 1,700 idle numbers give us braggin rights, but it's not safe to fly with the idle that low.. There is another trick that works really well and that is to raise the idle speed to 2,200 rpm, that moves the low speed needle outward and leaves room to lean the low speed needle. Neither the cats eye slot nor the tapered needle are as exactly proportional as we would like. Doing this will clean up the mid range some.

PS, this is your low speed needle/sleeve, so you carb works like this one.

Saito 170 R-3 low speed needle/sleeve

Your carb works like this 2.20 carb

Last edited by 1200SportsterRider; 06-05-2021 at 03:07 AM.
Old 06-05-2021, 04:30 PM
  #50479  
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The arrow points to where I found felt filter clunk fuss on a "new to me" used FG21 I bought. About 1/16" of the fuss was packed into the back of the lsn. Really affected the midrange about 4-6k rpm. Probably why the guy sold it so cheap. I removed the fuss and the engine has run flawless ever since.

I have no explanation why that would affect how the engine ran, the spraybar never contacted the fuss, not even at idle.







Old 06-06-2021, 02:09 AM
  #50480  
1200SportsterRider
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Well, for lack of a better idea I would say the fuzz changed the shape of the airflow. Also, there may have been fuzz in the cats eye.
Old 06-06-2021, 02:40 AM
  #50481  
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Originally Posted by 1200SportsterRider
Ro, I know that those low 1,700 idle numbers give us braggin rights, but it's not safe to fly with the idle that low.. There is another trick that works really well and that is to raise the idle speed to 2,200 rpm, that moves the low speed needle outward and leaves room to lean the low speed needle. Neither the cats eye slot nor the tapered needle are as exactly proportional as we would like. Doing this will clean up the mid range some.

PS, this is your low speed needle/sleeve, so you carb works like this one.

Saito 170 R-3 low speed needle/sleeve

Your carb works like this 2.20 carb

Thanks for reminding me.
Have been thinking in that direction aswell and experimented, It might be worth to try again and again :-)
Old 06-06-2021, 02:43 AM
  #50482  
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Originally Posted by Glowgeek
The arrow points to where I found felt filter clunk fuss on a "new to me" used FG21 I bought. About 1/16" of the fuss was packed into the back of the lsn. Really affected the midrange about 4-6k rpm. Probably why the guy sold it so cheap. I removed the fuss and the engine has run flawless ever since.

I have no explanation why that would affect how the engine ran, the spraybar never contacted the fuss, not even at idle.
Originally Posted by 1200SportsterRider
Well, for lack of a better idea I would say the fuzz changed the shape of the airflow. Also, there may have been fuzz in the cats eye.
When I take the engine apart next time I will also give the carburetor another inspection, "factory" reset and start all over again.
.
Old 06-06-2021, 02:54 AM
  #50483  
1200SportsterRider
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Ro, this is my opinion but I don't make the LS needle richer than what achieves the best transition. My thinking is that during part throttle operation the internal temperatures and pressure are much lower than at full throttle so extra richness is not needed plus there is plenty of residual oil to be safe. I am willing to sacrifice a couple of hundred rpm in favor of the best transition. That's my 79 year old thinking and it's free.
Old 06-06-2021, 12:03 PM
  #50484  
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I got my 100 GK dirt cheap because the guy and HH could not make it run without a glow connected to it. Took me longer to remove the cowl than the get it running right. The LSN needed to be leaned a touch. I got it started and couldn't shut it off after that. It idled so slow, pop pop pop pop, just on and on for minutes like that. Great little engine.
Old 06-07-2021, 01:07 AM
  #50485  
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Originally Posted by 1200SportsterRider
Ro, this is my opinion but I don't make the LS needle richer than what achieves the best transition. My thinking is that during part throttle operation the internal temperatures and pressure are much lower than at full throttle so extra richness is not needed plus there is plenty of residual oil to be safe. I am willing to sacrifice a couple of hundred rpm in favor of the best transition. That's my 79 year old thinking and it's free.
I fully agree,,, transition and a powerful mid range is very important to me.
I appreciate the free thinking coming from experience :-)

Yesterday I was playing with a petrol carburetor on the engine and had a great transition and a very stabile mid range.
but lost about 700 rpm on the top. However I am not convinced I will continue running it on gasoline.
For now I have plenty of 5% glow fuel but that supply will probably end soon, so I also need to explore alternatives.

Not able to link to the video..
Search for this on YouTube

" FA170R3 + NGH carb + Aspen gasoline and 10% oil "



Last edited by RoKit; 06-07-2021 at 01:17 AM.
Old 06-07-2021, 09:17 AM
  #50486  
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Default Saito 90cc

So Im new to these momos. Looking for some advice before I purchase.

going to install in a 90 warbird. Blonde Stang or a Rare Bear. Eventually will make exhaust thru the birds exhaust ports will also add smoke. I love smoke!

big questions are

Gas or Nitro
want a scale prop... suggestions
which muffler?
Oils?

any mods or adds I should consider up front?

Thanks the the insight.

Old 06-07-2021, 01:46 PM
  #50487  
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The engine showed up, see picture! First of all that sticker saying FA-65 is black print on clear siting on a paper backing and is trying hard to slide off (it blank underneath it too). The prop nut for a FA-80 was too small! Next the end cap of the muffler. So what do you guys think?

.
Old 06-07-2021, 01:55 PM
  #50488  
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Like i said, had to be a 115. Big power in a small lightweight package, one of Saito's finest! Doesn't appear to be a high time engine. If the cam a tappets are good a $15 set of bearings and a thorough cleaning and you're golden.

Last edited by Glowgeek; 06-07-2021 at 02:08 PM.
Old 06-07-2021, 02:25 PM
  #50489  
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Originally Posted by Glowgeek
Like i said, had to be a 115. Big power in a small lightweight package, one of Saito's finest! Doesn't appear to be a high time engine. If the cam a tappets are good a $15 set of bearings and a thorough cleaning and you're golden.
I think that would be more of a job I want to take on, I would have to farm it out. First impression is her compression seems good. The muffler needs a good cleaning but the engine itself looks good. I need to look to see how it would match up to one of my current projects. I don't think I got hurt for what I paid for it.
Old 06-07-2021, 03:31 PM
  #50490  
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wow, that would be perfect for my P-51, maybe I should have taken the chance on it. Good find, you will have no problem finding a plane for it.
Old 06-07-2021, 04:47 PM
  #50491  
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What kind of P-51 have you got?
Old 06-07-2021, 06:48 PM
  #50492  
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Mike,,,, you lucky dog

Jim
Old 06-07-2021, 07:11 PM
  #50493  
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check out my OS muffler. I had my friend weld it up, the end is from an old SlimLine pits muffler. and a tuned pipe header. the tab you see on it will be milled down and drilled and tapped for the tank pressure.
it is for my ShoeString 60, the thing is the stock 60 cowl is all messed up, but I found a new 40 size cowl that I am making fit, so a 60 size muffler will NOT fit the 40 cowl without a tremendous amount of cutting. so I made this one up, it came out great, I just need to polish it, today I worked a while on fitting the cowl and marking it to cut

Jim
ps, sorry it's not a 4st LOL


,
Old 06-07-2021, 07:23 PM
  #50494  
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Originally Posted by the Wasp
Mike,,,, you lucky dog

Jim
AS my father in-law use to say "Better lucky than smart!" I know the 1.15 has got a little power how heavy an airplane do you guys think it could handle?

Last edited by FlyerInOKC; 06-07-2021 at 07:52 PM.
Old 06-08-2021, 01:31 AM
  #50495  
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Originally Posted by 1200SportsterRider
Ro, I know that those low 1,700 idle numbers give us braggin rights, but it's not safe to fly with the idle that low.. There is another trick that works really well and that is to raise the idle speed to 2,200 rpm, that moves the low speed needle outward and leaves room to lean the low speed needle. Neither the cats eye slot nor the tapered needle are as exactly proportional as we would like. Doing this will clean up the mid range some.

PS, this is your low speed needle/sleeve, so you carb works like this one.

Saito 170 R-3 low speed needle/sleeve

Your carb works like this 2.20 carb
Good advice Dave you've been a steady influence for many years here well done mate. let us know when your 80th is cheers.

Rokit listen to Dave, a long time back I was bragging how well and slow my saito's idled, could do that for ages. It made peak rpm impossible to achieve and the mid range was patchy, very difficult to tune when lsn too lean.


Mike! good score on the fa115. Here's mine squeezed in to a cmpro 46" ws midget mustang. I know you can't see the engine much and you KNOW I'd never tell you a porky cheers bud.
Old 06-08-2021, 01:49 AM
  #50496  
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ps Mike, if you fit a prop (15x8 mas in my case) and rock it back and forth you should be able to tell if the bearings are ok, if so I'd give it a quick run on 10% and see what happens, it's a snappy engine and like a few revs. People sometimes comment on the fact that the fa115 engine has a rear vent and cam/tappet dryness but over the many times I've stripped the 115 those areas are always wet. I ended up doing about three bearing sets cause I just flew the hell out of it and parked it in the shed, low maintenance would be understating the abuse it cops airframe wise. Here's a used pic GOOD LUCK with yours.

My owner hates me??
Old 06-08-2021, 01:50 AM
  #50497  
1200SportsterRider
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Thanks Pete, I have about 11 mo's. and 3 weeks to go to enter the 80's. I have four 65's to check out for Cap, I don't have a lot of time with having radiation treatments 5 days a week for 22 more days, I'm half done. I am debating how to refinish the Golden Knight 65, some say I should bake the paint at 200 degrees F. for a few hours. Your expertise would be much appreciated. The GK has no initial on the right lug has a bump on the piston top. The high compression piston visible in the foreground.


PS, Ok. Mike, I would gladly replace your bearings for free and even give the engine back.


Last edited by 1200SportsterRider; 06-08-2021 at 02:12 AM. Reason: Add content.
Old 06-08-2021, 02:45 AM
  #50498  
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Originally Posted by FlyerInOKC
AS my father in-law use to say "Better lucky than smart!" I know the 1.15 has got a little power how heavy an airplane do you guys think it could handle?
It makes around 12-13 lbs of thrust with 15"-16" props so it will power just about any .60 size warbird or sport plane with authority. Would fly a 110 Rascal with no problem.
Old 06-08-2021, 04:18 AM
  #50499  
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Good to har from you Pete! Yes, I got really lucky with this engine. I'll have to dig through my prop drawer and see if I have a 15 X 7 and check the bearings.

Dave I may very well take you up on the offer regardless for piece of mind. I was checking my Saito files and discovered I had an instruction sheet on the FA-115. I have a habit of collecting them you never know when they will come in handy.

Mike
Old 06-08-2021, 07:40 AM
  #50500  
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Originally Posted by FlyerInOKC
What kind of P-51 have you got?

Top Flight .60. Flew it on the 100 GK originally before I found a .125 and swapped it out, the 100 went on my Cub. I have a kit P-51 that I have yet to finish, started it in 2011, and have a YS 110 for it.

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