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Welcome to Club SAITO !

Old 10-10-2009, 10:08 AM
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The Saito FA-125 is the recommended engine per Hangar 9 although I would have probably put in a FA-100. All depenmds on the way you fly and the wind conditions. The extra power is always nice to have in reserve.
Old 10-10-2009, 10:28 AM
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Well I borrowed a propeller balancer last night and balanced the prop and what a difference it made. It was not that it was badly out of balance but correcting it sure made a difference. I will have to get my own propeller balancer next week. And she performed beautifully. The engine purred. The plane had a few major trim adjustments but flew like a good old bird. Tomorrow I hill have at least four flights . Twenty year old plane and still flying great. Thanks everyone for all your help with the engine, tank etc.

Best regards

Kevin<br type="_moz" />
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Old 10-10-2009, 04:11 PM
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Hi alpa
Find attached 5 pages from Graham Rice book " A Guide to Saito Model 4/strokes" . I will have to do it in two posts as the file is too large. I hope this helps you with your problem. If you are having problems reading it I can e mail it directly to you.
Kevin
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Old 10-10-2009, 04:14 PM
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

The second set of pages
Kevin
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Old 10-10-2009, 06:14 PM
  #16180  
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Poor Graham Rice, he can never get it right! He has you put the left cam in the right position and the right hand cam in the left position. This is because he has you stand in front of the engine instead of behind it like in the Saito book. Anything to cause confusion? Then he says do not rotate the crank before installing the other cam? This may cause trouble?

He goes on in the next pictures to have you check your work by confirming that the overlap period is centered at Top Dead Center but not on the compression stroke of each cylinder which is good.

Would the world have been better off without him? I don't know about that but it would be better if he was still around to write some newer more up to date books.

The Saito manual is below


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Old 10-10-2009, 06:36 PM
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O dear. And here I was thinking I was being so helpful. Who was MR Rice and are there any other
in this book?
Kevin
Old 10-10-2009, 06:52 PM
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Graham Rice wrote two books back in the mid 80's. One on the Saito engines and one on the rear cam OS four strokes.

Along about 1993 he offered an update on the OS book to include the front cam OS engines whereby he stated to install the cam index notch at 6 O-Clock which places the valve overlap period completed before TDC thereby eliminating some of the efficiency of the overlap period. It has caused countless discussions on RCU and RCOnline before that over the years.
Old 10-10-2009, 08:13 PM
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speedreader72,

Congratulations on your purchase of the h-9 bluenose p-51. The saito 125 I think is just the right motor for your plane. Although a saito 100 would power it well.... it's a difference between using a 14-8 apc and a 15-8 apc. I have one installed (saito 125) in my h-9 p-51 'marie' and I fly 70% throttle most of the time instead of stressing out a smaller engine by flying it almost 100% just to get it flying the way this bird was meant to fly.

tony
Old 10-10-2009, 09:57 PM
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What RPM should I be getting out of an FA100 with a 14x8 prop? Does 9100-9200 sound about right or is that just a bit low? If that sounds a bit low I'm thinking a new set of bearings ought to get another couple 100 RPM. I haven't had the back off yet and did't feel like dismounting it and all the functional exhaust components if it was'nt neccessary. Running it in a Royal P-51. I'm Running 15% omega fuel
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Old 10-10-2009, 10:03 PM
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Frets your plane looks nice

9300 peak seems to be the std for a 100 on 15% with a 14 x 8

Old 10-10-2009, 11:26 PM
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Thanks W8ye, Now I can put that concern behind me, and move forward on it again.
That's about what I got-just over 9300 (9320-9340 fluctuating between) peak and richened it up for 9100-9150. Idles forever at 1600, ticka-ticka-putt, ticka-ticka-putt...... Was kicking myself for not running it up on the stand prior to fussing with all the mounting/installation. still got the elev/rud/tail retract servos to install and some other kinks to be worked out along with some final detailing. hope to maiden around Thanksgiving. Anxious to see how the 100 pulls it around cuz it sure sounded sweet in the back yard today. 65" WS and all up should be @ 12-1/2 lbs wet.
Old 10-11-2009, 12:08 AM
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Sounds good
Old 10-11-2009, 01:02 AM
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Hi Guys (Kevin & W8ye) Thanks for all the help.
I think I have it right now, It seems the same as my other engine and the way W8YE describes it.
I am still getting he rest assembled and now waiting for a battery for the glow driver before I run it. The reason I don't have a battery (or anything much) was I had a garage fire which destroyed everything, so I am just getting started again with the insurance money!
I will be asking about tuning next, because this 300 twin is a dual carb model and my focker wulf has a single carb (my FW190 fuselage was saved by being in my building room, wings burnt) Any one want to guess why the fire started?
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Old 10-11-2009, 01:04 AM
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I had a wreck with my saito 100 and bent the valve stems and valve stem covers. I replaced them with the help of my neighbor.
I put the Engine on a plane today ant it has 0 compression. I took the head off and every thing looks fine. I suspect I did something during the repair. Any Ideas.
Old 10-11-2009, 01:11 AM
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Highly likely that the valve guides in the head were bent and keeps the valves from seating properly

Blow in the exhaust or the carb and find out which one it is?

Old 10-11-2009, 01:16 AM
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Glad to hear your 300 seems to be timed correctly

When it comes time to tune your dual carbs, just tune each one for maximum performance.

Just go back and forth until you think you have it right

Sorry about your garage fire and the loss

Old 10-11-2009, 06:02 AM
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Hi W8YE, While I wait till Monday to buy a glow battery for the glow system, I bought another 300t !!! I have four now! I love them. I have a brand new one in the Box that I bought in desperation as my single carb twin in my 1:5 Fw 190 was giving me greif . It had the older single carb setup, with the intake pipes going through the Engine mount. I got the new one so I could get the whole carb arrangement, Intakes and all off the new one and buy a spare carb intake system for the new one which would take a couple of months to come from USA. That worked fine till the wings of the FW went up in smoke. Now I have almost stripped the fourth 300t I got from a friend who is no longer in the hobby (got my last three 300's from him.
This one seems to have new pistons and an invoice from USA Horizon for repair, So I expect it will just need bearings.
Everything is all gummed up, I have taken heads and valve gear off, now waiting for petrol to soften the wrist pins (Gugeon) so I can get pistons off then con rods then take out crank.
I had a lot of bother taking out the bearing from the backplate on the last one I stripped.
This stripping is going so much faster as I now know what I am doing!!! (well sort of)
Any tips to take out the backplate bearing?
Alex
Old 10-11-2009, 06:37 AM
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Ran a 100 on a WM mustang 60, and never had to fly 100% unless i wanted to. I would notice my throttle at just over half way on take off when it cleared the ground. I would have to remeber to give it full throttle. Plane was 10lbs dry. 14x8 MA 9300-9500 rpms
with 15% Cool Power MV.
Its a very solid engine.
I'm putting it in the new H-9 Mustang.
I have a 82a on a twist 40....and a fa80 on an old Bi-plane i bought as a package deal. and all three are crazy fun to fly.

I have no doubt the 125 will drag the mustang through the air like eggs through a chicken
My 100 flew my old mustang better than scale.
Old 10-11-2009, 06:53 AM
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ORIGINAL: w8ye

Poor Graham Rice, he can never get it right! He has you put the left cam in the right position and the right hand cam in the left position. This is because he has you stand in front of the engine instead of behind it like in the Saito book. Anything to cause confusion? Then he says do not rotate the crank before installing the other cam? This may cause trouble?

He goes on in the next pictures to have you check your work by confirming that the overlap period is centered at Top Dead Center but not on the compression stroke of each cylinder which is good.

Would the world have been better off without him? I don't know about that but it would be better if he was still around to write some newer more up to date books.

The Saito manual is below


Thanks w8 you are a great resource for learning,you may wish to feflect on what YOU knew back then as well,discussion is good if it benifits all.
Old 10-11-2009, 08:51 AM
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In 1993, I doubt I knew as much as Graham Rice about OS and Saito engines
Old 10-11-2009, 02:19 PM
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Alpal...re. backplate bearing.

Alex,
if its anything like the Saito 90 twin then you can fill the center shaft hole with grease or vaseline/petroleum jelly then drive a snug fitting piece of brass or steel rod into the shaft hole and the grease will force the bearing out hydraulicaly. sometimes you can use an old drill bit upside down as they have a better selection of diameters. Makes it a bit easier if you warm the back plate first, either in a low temp (150-180 F) oven or like I usually do-boil it in water...it's quicker. One sharp rap usually does it.

This only works on sealed type bearings or bushings, not open bearings. (unless you really just have to experience warm grease sprayed out into your eyes!) Good idea to wear goggles or glasses anyway, as some grease does tend to try to squirt out into your eye anyway. ask me how I know!
Old 10-11-2009, 05:08 PM
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ORIGINAL: alpal

Hi W8YE, While I wait till Monday to buy a glow battery for the glow system, I bought another 300t !!! I have four now! I love them. I have a brand new one in the Box that I bought in desperation as my single carb twin in my 1:5 Fw 190 was giving me greif . It had the older single carb setup, with the intake pipes going through the Engine mount. I got the new one so I could get the whole carb arrangement, Intakes and all off the new one and buy a spare carb intake system for the new one which would take a couple of months to come from USA. That worked fine till the wings of the FW went up in smoke. Now I have almost stripped the fourth 300t I got from a friend who is no longer in the hobby (got my last three 300's from him.
This one seems to have new pistons and an invoice from USA Horizon for repair, So I expect it will just need bearings.
Everything is all gummed up, I have taken heads and valve gear off, now waiting for petrol to soften the wrist pins (Gugeon) so I can get pistons off then con rods then take out crank.
I had a lot of bother taking out the bearing from the backplate on the last one I stripped.
This stripping is going so much faster as I now know what I am doing!!! (well sort of)
Any tips to take out the backplate bearing?
Alex
The grease would not work for me
I drilled a hole in a wooden block larger than the bearing and heated the back plate in the wife's oven then whapped the hot back plate against the wooden block and the bearing came out in the hole of the block.

Old 10-11-2009, 08:15 PM
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I have a recently new saito golden knight 125 that I got way to hot ,well it's running again but compression is down a little. would a simple ring change fix it. thanks.
Old 10-12-2009, 12:38 AM
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It would not hurt anything to try a new ring

Get your ring from this guy



Frank Bowman

1211 N Allen Ave. Farmington, N.M. 87401-3568

505-327-0696 Email: [email protected]
Old 10-12-2009, 04:05 PM
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Hi guys, I completed stripping the other 300twin I got yesterday, it was much more difficult (more gummed up) than the last one. The bearings were totally frozen, but the backplate came off well enough. Had to heat and bash the ront ring off. (prop backplate?)
The only real problem I had was the right con rod big end bearing. I ended up having to drill it out! I striped the head of the screws because they were so tight. The second one I got right because I heated it up with a minature blow torch. Luckily the second engine came with some spares, among which was a couple of con rods.
My question to you w8ye is, can I use this used con rod? There appears to be little wrong with it and the bearig surface looks fine, even under a magnifying glass.
The guy I got these engines from had three and sent them to Horizon to be "repared" I guess they put the old parts in a bag and he has kept them.
These engines look very robust and I would like to think I can use the con rod, how do I check??

What is the very thin shim sort of thing ?on the crank just ahead of the timing gear splines?
I didn't see it on the exploded view, so left it out of the previous engine rebuild... (not yet started trouble with glow driver charger.)

Having a great time learning about how to strip and assemble the big twin.
What is the best source of literature for this motor??
Various books/manuals have been refered to, the only one I have found is not a lot of use.. the official one?
All the best
ALex

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