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Old 06-25-2010, 12:08 PM
  #17751  
spaceworm
 
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The only marks I get on my plastic spinners are scuff marks that rub off easilly. I prime my engines, and turn them over by hand until I get the bump. Then I either hand start them, or, in stubborn cases apply the starter to the cone and THEN switch the starter on. The engine starts right up and the starter cone does not slip and burn the cone. What am I doing wrong?

Old 06-26-2010, 08:03 AM
  #17752  
winglift
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This is a followup on my Saito 100. I thought that the problem was the fuel, based on a short run with different fuel, however that was the wrong conclusion. As it turns out both bearings were bad. After thinking that the problem was solved I charged up the batteries and headed out to the RC field (Camp Atterbury) and had the same problems as before. I decided to send it in for repair at Horizon. The tech said that the bearings were worn and after replacing them, the engine starts okay, idles okay, run great at both high speed and mid range.
Old 06-26-2010, 09:37 AM
  #17753  
NM2K
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

ORIGINAL: spaceworm

The only marks I get on my plastic spinners are scuff marks that rub off easilly. I prime my engines, and turn them over by hand until I get the bump. Then I either hand start them, or, in stubborn cases apply the starter to the cone and THEN switch the starter on. The engine starts right up and the starter cone does not slip and burn the cone. What am I doing wrong?



I don't know how old you are, but I'm a week or two away from being 64, plus I have a bad case of atherosclerosis (affects memory/time perception). When I talk about plastic spinners I'm talking about my experiences with them from the 1960's forward. Lots has changed over the years, but I'm sure that there are still some spinner cones made of the kind of material that scores and burns easily. However, you may not have ran across them. Then consider that I have been a flight instructor since the 1970's and have started, worked on and tuned many a trainer with a plastic spinner on the nose over those years. If you haven't come across a spinner with burn marks on it, you haven't been in the hobby very long. But not to worry as time will take care of that.

Up until just a few years ago, I started all of my engines via hand flipping or spinner back flipping. My student pilots were the ones using the electric starter most of the time and it was they who had the burned spinners.


Ed Cregger
Old 06-26-2010, 10:33 AM
  #17754  
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Sharpeye22,

I couldn't find an older number for your name, so you are #692
Old 06-26-2010, 12:38 PM
  #17755  
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Thanks BLW
Old 06-26-2010, 03:40 PM
  #17756  
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Thanks for the membership BLW... appreciate it !
Old 06-26-2010, 04:33 PM
  #17757  
Tarasdad
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

I used a CG spinner on my Eagle 63 when it was completed in 1988. After a few dozen starts there was a well developed groove right where the cone of my Sullivan starter made contact. The sight was pretty common at our field with any plastic or nylon spinner used with an electric starter. Aluminum spinners and spinner nuts were immune, of course. Maybe a more polished ring, but that's all.
Old 06-26-2010, 04:53 PM
  #17758  
NM2K
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For sport flying, I switched over to using AMA safety nuts/spinner nuts. No rpm loss and no danger of an explosion.


Ed Cregger
Old 06-26-2010, 09:08 PM
  #17759  
spaceworm
 
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I am over 70 years old, also have joint and nerve issues and have certainly come across a lot of burned plastic spinners, since 1983 when I started RC I started control line in 1953, but we either did not have spinners, or had Froom aluminum spinners, and hand started everthiing, mostly fox and K&B 29 and 35, but occasionlly a Super Champion or McCoy 60, only once a Forster 99.

I have not myself burned a plastic spinner, of course, like you, time has taken its toll and I may not remember every occasion of plastic spinner use I have ever had. These days, I mostly use the Higley et al aluminum or brass safety nuts, and usually hand start my engines, up to 35 cc 2 stroke cycle gas and 1.80 Saito 4 stroke cycle. I see many cases of flyers switching their electric starters on, and then jamming them on either an unprimed or severly flooded engine. Either case will usually burn the spinner or slip off and break the spinner or prop. I just don't think it is a given that plastic spinners should burn and have ridge marks if properly used.

Sincerely,

Richard
Old 06-26-2010, 09:15 PM
  #17760  
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Richard, this spinner is pretty popular with me, it is a Kavan backplateless spinner, the nut or nuts in the case of a fourstroke are behind the rubber nose cone. I haven't marked one up yet. Hobby-Lobby has em.
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Old 06-26-2010, 09:26 PM
  #17761  
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Dave, thanks. I have seen them, but don't yet have any. They are really good looking and would look great on my Mighty Mambo powered by an old Merco 61.

By the way, I have not run a Diesel since my CL and FF days and a McCoy .09 Diesel, which I still have. I have a Davis Development Diesel head for an OS 40, but no OS 40. Would it possibly fit a 46 SF or 46 AXi? Do you mix your own fuel or where do you buy it?

Thanks, hope to see you at the WW field.

Sincerely,

Richard
Old 06-26-2010, 11:48 PM
  #17762  
mike early
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Broke another 90ΒΊ adapter on my 125. Going to try another route. I need the exhaust to exit directly in-line with the engine out the bottom of my warbird cowling. And this is causing me grief, so far.

Choices are between Cooling Header, Short (M13):AG,AH at 50 bucks

or

Muffler Rt Angle Manifold M13 125a FG-20 and a new stock muffler for about 50 bucks. (I lost my stock muffler years ago before I learned about Teflon tape on the threads.)



I searched this thread for the cooling header and it seems only 1 fellow tried one and it failed, somehow. But how, I wonder. It looks pretty nifty...
Old 06-27-2010, 02:42 AM
  #17763  
frets24
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

I was breaking 90* adapters too for a while. On the third one I finally wised-up and fashioned a secondary support for the muffler to help dampen the vibes and remove the stress from the threading on the adapter. Its got @ 50 flights on it now where the first two adapters were snapped off at about the fifth or sixth time out.

Brass flat stock works pretty well and is easy to form around the muffler. wrap one end around and pull tight with a nut and bolt, attach other end to the engine mount or firewall.

pardon the rough sketch..too late to be running out to the shop and uncowl for a pic.
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Old 06-27-2010, 03:06 AM
  #17764  
FNQFLYER
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Why don't you guys who are breaking exhaust bits use the flexible exhaust that Saito offers or get one from the after market here in OZ
Old 06-27-2010, 03:34 AM
  #17765  
mike early
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I've broken those, too. After a certain number of heat cycles, they crack and break.

Plus they kill about 3-400 RPM.

I wonder why the cooling headers never caught on.....
Old 06-27-2010, 04:00 AM
  #17766  
FNQFLYER
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Try Christain Traders in OZ their product apears to be good and lasts if the reports in th local mags (Airborne) are any guide
Old 06-27-2010, 06:31 AM
  #17767  
Rudolph Hart
 
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

He's right!
Old 06-27-2010, 12:57 PM
  #17768  
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Frets24,
You hit on the best solution. Engines vibrate no matter how well balanced they are. That vibration is what stresses and breaks things like exaust. Supporting the parts and locking them into the same vibration so they are not vibrating in oppisite directions is the way to solve the problem.
Old 06-27-2010, 08:26 PM
  #17769  
mike early
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Today I used my flex pipe going directing in the cylinder making the absolutest tightest turn possible and then tie-wired to the engine box and then bending again straight down to exit the cowling. Even though it comes in contact with the cowling at the initial turn, I'm not too concerned if it burns a hole in the fiberglass cowling. But after 3 flights, no observable effect at all, actually.

It didn't seem to lose any RPMS, but I didn't tach it. It did need about a half-turn of HS leaning over my last setting with an elbow, header, and Mac's Muffler. Actually, it doesn't sound much different than before...but the weather was a lot different today than it was yesterday. Weighs less and is totally inside the cowling. Maybe it'll break, and maybe it wont.

The new 90ΒΊ headers by saito seem to be machined steel and not cast and maybe they'll withstand the weight of the muffler and the vibration. Maybe I'll go that way next time....
Old 06-27-2010, 08:32 PM
  #17770  
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

The truth is in using it and find out how it holds up.
Old 06-27-2010, 09:10 PM
  #17771  
mike early
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I still like the looks of that cooling header (even though it would be completely hidden inside the cowling...).

I'd be interested in hearing some reports on them...
Old 06-28-2010, 01:14 AM
  #17772  
Ernie Misner
 
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Hobbsy, how does that Kevan backplateless spinner work or attatch? and what's the dark point????

Thanks loads,

Ernie
Old 06-28-2010, 07:21 AM
  #17773  
Hobbsy
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Here ya go Ernie, hopefully these pics are worth a thousand words.
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Old 06-28-2010, 08:41 AM
  #17774  
spaceworm
 
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So, the spinner acts like the front prop washer, and is held in place by the prop nut? The rubber tip then plugs the access hole to the prop nut?

Does the rubber tip take the electric starter cone or must you start against the spinner itself?

Thanks,

Richard
Old 06-28-2010, 10:15 AM
  #17775  
Jimmy Hoffa
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Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Will the new metal back plate fit on the previous version of a Saito .82? My plastic one is broken so I thought it might be a good time to upgrade if possible.
Thanks,
Phillip

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