Notices
Glow Engines Discuss RC glow engines

Welcome to Club SAITO !

Old 03-30-2013, 05:12 PM
  #24576  
Hobbsy
My Feedback: (102)
 
Hobbsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Colonial Beach, VA
Posts: 20,370
Likes: 0
Received 24 Likes on 24 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

The quickest way to find your way is just wade in and then ask as you go. Different guys here have experience with differing aspects.
Old 03-30-2013, 05:42 PM
  #24577  
SrTelemaster150
Senior Member
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

ORIGINAL: Old Fart

Thanks good advice is much appreciated.I've always run about 400 to 500 rich because i had more power than i needed anyway.Will mount the tank back on the cg now but won't be using the one supplied.Anybody have some experience with rotoflow tanks?

A few years back Dave mentioned that he'd run the fa220 with a saito pump made for the japanese market only and did'nt like it from memory.I see some guys here using perry pumps with mixed success,they never seem to find the sweet spot on a regular basis.
The "PUMP" that comes W/the FA220 BBC (12mm) carb is just a set of checkvalves, 1 in , 1 out that uses the crankcase as an aircompressor.

While it does improve fuel delivery, the metering, or regulation of the system is a bit crude compared to the Cline regulator.

While the 12mm carb boosted power significantly on the 13:1 CR FA180 boosting RPM to 8450 w/an 18X8 prop breathing through a ported intake manifold, I would not expect it to increaese power output on an otherwise stock engine.

A crankcase "pump" can be fabricated W/simple inline checkvalves, 1 -ay in, 1-way out. A spray bar can be used to make a bleed off valve.

It does work. My 300TTDP dual carb 300 twin idles depenadabally @ 800 RPM W/great trasnsition.
Old 03-30-2013, 05:52 PM
  #24578  
RH
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 119
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Good advice! I have no trouble wading in. In fact sometimes I manage to wade in when the water is REALLY deep.

Rick...
Old 03-30-2013, 05:54 PM
  #24579  
Hobbsy
My Feedback: (102)
 
Hobbsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Colonial Beach, VA
Posts: 20,370
Likes: 0
Received 24 Likes on 24 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

I always figured that it was a waste of $114.00. Your C&H ignition friend now owns my 2.20.
Old 03-30-2013, 06:41 PM
  #24580  
SrTelemaster150
Senior Member
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

ORIGINAL: Hobbsy

I always figured that it was a waste of $114.00. Your C&H ignition friend now owns my 2.20.
The "waste" is putting the 12mm carburetor on the stock 11mm manifold. Why Saito ever put out such a product is beyond me. The 220 & 180 share the same stock intake manifold.

I intend to buy up a few more BB220 carbs/pumps for further HP modifications. I want to convert my standard FA180 to HC by milling .035" off the case deck as well as utilize the 11mm FA180 carb on my FA150 that will soon have an FA180 conrod on the crank to increase CR.

When I opened up the FA150 manifold to 12mm on the updraft section & opened up the horizontal section to the FA180 intake port size (& eliminated the aluminum washer that was causing restriction) power output of the 13:1 CR FA180HC CDI engine W/the Cool Power 15% nitro blend jumped to 3.45HP.

30% nitro O'Donnell Speed Blend fuel upped power output to 4HP.

Fuel economy W/the 30% nitro was still slightly better than the stock Glow Ignition 9.56:1 CR FA180 running on GI W/15% Cool Power fuel while making 40% more HP.. (3.94HP compared to 2.81HP)
Old 03-31-2013, 05:58 AM
  #24581  
Rudolph Hart
 
Rudolph Hart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Perth, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,383
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Sr with all due respect we are not just bench running engines here.We fly them as well and real world comparisons are good to talk about too
Old 03-31-2013, 11:04 AM
  #24582  
SrTelemaster150
Senior Member
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !


ORIGINAL: Old Fart

Sr with all due respect we are not just bench running engines here.We fly them as well and real world comparisons are good to talk about too
In theory, the Cline regulator will be the most consistant "in the air"

Of the Perry ocsilator, Perry crankcase pressure, Saito checkvalve crankcase pump & the Cline, the Cline, as I understand it, is the only example of an on demand diaphram regulator that is used in addition to check valves .

The check valves do the pumping in all of the pumps cited. The Saito uses a metering bleed off valve wile the Perry pumps rely on the stroke of the checkvalves to control volume.
Old 03-31-2013, 11:07 AM
  #24583  
SrTelemaster150
Senior Member
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !


ORIGINAL: Old Fart

Sr with all due respect we are not just bench running engines here.We fly them as well and real world comparisons are good to talk about too
HP in the air is even more fun that HP on the bench.

As long as it is dependable & does not severely detract from fuel economy, what's not to like?
Old 03-31-2013, 12:56 PM
  #24584  
SrTelemaster150
Senior Member
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Now that I think about it, the Cline & the Perry Ocsilating pumb the only option on an unven firing twin. (or radial)

No positive crankcase pressure to work the checkvalves.
Old 03-31-2013, 04:23 PM
  #24585  
Hobbsy
My Feedback: (102)
 
Hobbsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Colonial Beach, VA
Posts: 20,370
Likes: 0
Received 24 Likes on 24 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Dan are you going to use the 1.80 gas engine as the base for your mod? It has the three bolts holding the intake pipe onto the engine like the 2.20 has. Thanks, Dave
Old 03-31-2013, 06:10 PM
  #24586  
SrTelemaster150
Senior Member
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

ORIGINAL: Hobbsy

Dan are you going to use the 1.80 gas engine as the base for your mod? It has the three bolts holding the intake pipe onto the engine like the 2.20 has. Thanks, Dave
No Dave, I work W/the FA versions.

Not real fond on Saito FG (gas) engines.

The FA150/FA180/FA220 use a common intake manifold casting.. Not having ever owned an FA120, I can't speak from experience.

The FA180/FA220 standard itake maniflold is the same paert #. The 10mm FA150 manifold can be ported to match the 11mm FA180/FA220 carb or the 12mm BB 220 carb.

The idle/transition W/the 12mm carb was not detrimentally affected. Probably because of the volumetruic effeciemcy of thesmaller HC 13:1 CR chamber.

Not much difference in (CDI) fuel consumpsion @ part throttle than the 11mm carb, but 300 MORE RPM @ WOT on the same 15% Cool Power.

BTW: I haven't utilized the "pump" yet on the 12mm BBC engine. There is some surging until the fuel level in the tank drops so I think that I will set up the pump eventually

EDIT: The FA220 & FA180 share then same 11mm Standard carb, but not the same manifold.

It was the common carb body Part # that allowed me to utilize the 12mm Carb on the FA180 intake manifold.
Old 03-31-2013, 07:43 PM
  #24587  
Rudolph Hart
 
Rudolph Hart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Perth, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,383
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Thanks for that mate.I've just hamfisted a rear main bearing and damaged the shield so after i cool down it's back out to the shed and fit another with a bit more patience this time.
Old 04-01-2013, 02:43 AM
  #24588  
Rudolph Hart
 
Rudolph Hart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Perth, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,383
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

A quick update.Got a bit timid heating the case properly at first,the front bearing is easy but i did'nt properly thru heat the large rear case section so when i dropped the room temp rear main into the hole it was slightly crooked,did a fnq and got a bigger hammer out,how are you mate?

Gave the case a good two minute heat up with a paint stripper gun(old oil residue starts smoking)and this time slid the rear main onto the crankshaft first.Dopped the whole assy and gravity smacked the bearing home,perfect fit and crank alignment,once cool i tapped the crank back a little.All you could feel was a slight drag from the fully sealed front main bearing,boy am i a happy camper new gaskets and o rings in the engine,hooked up to a cline regulater this thing should go li9ke the clappers
Old 04-01-2013, 04:29 AM
  #24589  
Hobbsy
My Feedback: (102)
 
Hobbsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Colonial Beach, VA
Posts: 20,370
Likes: 0
Received 24 Likes on 24 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Thanks man, that's what I was gittin at.
Old 04-01-2013, 05:13 AM
  #24590  
SrTelemaster150
Senior Member
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !


ORIGINAL: Old Fart

A quick update.Got a bit timid heating the case properly at first,the front bearing is easy but i did'nt properly thru heat the large rear case section so when i dropped the room temp rear main into the hole it was slightly crooked,did a fnq and got a bigger hammer out,how are you mate?

Gave the case a good two minute heat up with a paint stripper gun(old oil residue starts smoking)and this time slid the rear main onto the crankshaft first.Dopped the whole assy and gravity smacked the bearing home,perfect fit and crank alignment,once cool i tapped the crank back a little.All you could feel was a slight drag from the fully sealed front main bearing,boy am i a happy camper new gaskets and o rings in the engine,hooked up to a cline regulater this thing should go li9ke the clappers

I use heat as well as the freezer make things slide together more easily.
Old 04-02-2013, 11:03 AM
  #24591  
AeroFinn
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Turku, FINLAND
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Ok guys

I got the bearings I ordered from Rc-bearings.com installed on my FA-125 with aid of freezer (bearings) and a heat gun (crancase) I guess I could'nt have done it without the help of this forum! Grreat!

Anyways, I'm installing the new piston & connecting rod but what's the dot mark on the connecting rod for? is it to be facing towrads the backplate or what?? i didn't pay attention to this when i dismantled the engine.. (see the picture) Can you please help as the manula doesn't show how to install it
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Xv63773.jpg
Views:	35
Size:	55.0 KB
ID:	1869448  
Old 04-02-2013, 11:21 AM
  #24592  
AeroFinn
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Turku, FINLAND
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !


ORIGINAL: AeroFinn

Ok guys

I got the bearings I ordered from Rc-bearings.com installed on my FA-125 with aid of freezer (bearings) and a heat gun (crancase) I guess I could'nt have done it without the help of this forum! Grreat!

Anyways, I'm installing the new piston & connecting rod but what's the dot mark on the connecting rod for? is it to be facing towrads the backplate or what?? i didn't pay attention to this when i dismantled the engine.. (see the picture) Can you please help as the manula doesn't show how to install it

edit: it seems to fit better if the "dot" is facing towards cam gear. Please correct me if I'm wrong but this might be the way to install it.
Old 04-02-2013, 02:12 PM
  #24593  
AeroFinn
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Turku, FINLAND
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

..And what should we think about this genuine Saito engine gasket? I guess I'd better get some gasket paper of the correct thickness and make one that fits properly. Why on earth can't they make make it right and charge a bit more for a good gasket set so there wouldn't be any fuss..
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Fc90492.jpg
Views:	33
Size:	78.2 KB
ID:	1869515  
Old 04-02-2013, 02:19 PM
  #24594  
hsukaria
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Dearborn, MI
Posts: 3,216
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !


ORIGINAL: AeroFinn

..And what should we think about this genuine Saito engine gasket? I guess I'd better get some gasket paper of the correct thickness and make one that fits properly. Why on earth can't they make make it right and charge a bit more for a good gasket set so there wouldn't be any fuss..
Did you try rotating it 90 degrees more? It may not be equal bolt spacing all around?
Old 04-02-2013, 02:26 PM
  #24595  
Rudolph Hart
 
Rudolph Hart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Perth, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,383
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Hi mate yes the dot faces the camgear.I usually leave the piston ring and rod in the cylinder when doing bearings only.
Old 04-02-2013, 04:53 PM
  #24596  
blw
My Feedback: (3)
 
blw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Opelika, AL
Posts: 9,447
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Look for the chamfer first. This is a slight bevel. It faces the crankshaft.
Old 04-02-2013, 09:30 PM
  #24597  
AeroFinn
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Turku, FINLAND
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !


ORIGINAL: hsukaria


ORIGINAL: AeroFinn

..And what should we think about this genuine Saito engine gasket? I guess I'd better get some gasket paper of the correct thickness and make one that fits properly. Why on earth can't they make make it right and charge a bit more for a good gasket set so there wouldn't be any fuss..
Did you try rotating it 90 degrees more? It may not be equal bolt spacing all around?

Yes I did but but without any help? Do you happen to know the thickness of this gasket so I could by some gasket paper of the same thickness? Unfortunately I don't have a tool to measure it by myself. And the thicknesss of the gasket has to be correct so the compression ratio won't be changed.
Old 04-03-2013, 03:46 AM
  #24598  
Cherokee Flyer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Rose Hill, KS
Posts: 372
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

The gasket goes between the crankcase and the cover, the cylinder is a metal to metal fit.

L.
Old 04-03-2013, 03:49 AM
  #24599  
AeroFinn
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Turku, FINLAND
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !


ORIGINAL: Cherokee Flyer

The gasket goes between the crankcase and the cover, the cylinder is a metal to metal fit.

L.
Oh boy..thanks mate!

I definitely don't feel like being very clever right now..
Old 04-03-2013, 03:58 AM
  #24600  
Rudolph Hart
 
Rudolph Hart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Perth, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,383
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !

Woops blw is right and me wrong.I've got two 82's and in one of them i pulled the piston out while doing a bearing change,just so i could see what they looked like.All i know is the one with the rod dot facing the cam gear runs hard.The machined surfaces on the barrel to cranckcase are very nice,no gasket and not much pressure to contain anyway.No 'oil leaks' that gasket looks like it is made for the rear plastic cover,i don't use them either.I've never had any machine screws ever come undone on a saito with very moderate tensioning,don't be tempted to go near it with loctite.

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.