jake_027

My Feedback: (1)

Hi guys,

Just wondering if there are any Saito experts that can give me some advice. I have a Saito 1.80 (almost 4 gallons through it). I was flying Saturday and had approx. 12 flights during the day. The first ten flights...no problem as before. The last two flights I had a deadstick both times. The first deadstick I just thought that it must have been a fluke since the engine performed so well prior to that and I didn't touch the settings. The second deadstick convinced me that there was a problem. In both cases, it didn't die on full throttle but rather when I went to idle. I keep my idle high in the air (approx. 2,900 RPM) and then lower the idle for landings. It was slightly cooler in the evening than it was during the day but not by much. I did notice however quite a bit of dampness in the air during the evening and condensation was forming on the planes. Also, both deadsticks occurred approx. 2 minutes into the flight. Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Dave

jake_027

My Feedback: (1)

Also...I had a deadstick with this engine on idle a while ago. One of the club members told me it was because my idle was too low (approx. 1,900 RPM) and that I should increase it for flying and then cut it down when I want to land. I have been doing this (and it worked for a couple of gallons) but now in light of recent deadsticks, I'm beginning to think that I have a low end adjustment issue and increasing the idle for flight was just a band-aid solution.

Flyer95

My Feedback: (1)

Your idle needle was probably to lean. If you set the idle needle slightly rich the engine will run very reliable at the lower rpms and the throttle response from idle also gets more instant and explosive. Try open the idle needle 1/8-1/4 of a turn and set the main needle about 300 below peak. 1800-2000 at idle is no problem at all if you use 10% or more nitro.

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Try a new plug and fresh fuel. Either is far more likely than the mixture changing itself.

Bill.

Flyer95

My Feedback: (1)

Bill,
I suggested the idle needle adjustments because the day/night temperature is shifting a lot these time of the year in colder countries like Sweden and in Canada also I think. We usually have +20 degrees celsius during the days when the sun is shinning and only +8 degress later on the evenings. I adjust the idle needles slightly rich at 3-4pm when I usually go out to the field and it gets perfect at 7 oclock pm for those last flights.

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Flyer:

You're right of course, but it just seems that since it went off all at once it's more likely his plug is used up, or the fuel got some water in it.

Bill.

jake_027

My Feedback: (1)

The glow fuel was a fresh bottle I opened that morning. I was using the lower 1/4 of the gallon when the deadsticks occurred. There wasn't a huge temperature difference between the day and evening - maybe 5 degrees Celcius if that. I did notice some condensation on the plane and wondered if the dampness in the air could have been the problem. In reference to the glow plug, this is the original glow plug I used on the engine since the break-in. I changed the plug right after break-in to a McCoy plug that my LHS recommended. Like I said, it ran fine till that point. I don't mind changing the plug but I guess I already convinced myself that it must be a problem with the carb adjustment. One thing that I did notice, if this means anything, I run a 17X8 APC prop and normally get 8,300 RPM at full throttle. This is set rich. After my first deadstick (I didn't touch the carb) and I tached the engine at only 8,000 RPM full throttle. Now could this be due to temperature change or a glow plug??

Thanks for your input so far guys!

Dave

DLK

Hi Dave. I have a 1.80. Great motor. Carb adjustment, most likely. No one mentioned valve adjustment. This is very important. It makes or brakes a 4 stroke engine on low and high end. Check it. Dave

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Sounds like you’ve eliminated the fuel, but the plug is still a good possibility. I’ve never had a McCoy plug work well in a Saito anyway, get an OS “F� plug or the one Horizon supplies with the engines. Hobbsy says the Fox “Miracle� plug gives him good service.

Dave K. is right in mentioning the valve adjustment, but again, that comes on gradually.

I still say try a new plug.

Bill.

jake_027

My Feedback: (1)

Hi Dave,

I adjusted the valves a couple of weeks ago. I guess it would be a good idea to check again. I will check the valves, replace the glow plug and see what happens. If that's not the fix, I will have to check the carb adjustments. As Flyer95 suggested, it may be that my low end is too lean. I really don't like messing with the carb![:'(]

Flyer95

My Feedback: (1)

It is worth trying a OS-F plug as so many people are using it with excellent results. When I changed the original plug for the OS-F it gave me better transition and more power. And the needles must be readjusted after that, slightly rich.

DarZeelon

Jake,


Setting the idle RPM at 1,900 must not be too low for this large engine.

Just buy yourself a spark ignition gas engine, like this displacement warrants and your cost for the fuel will be using fuel, will be 1/7, or even less of what you are now paying for your glow fuel.


Take notice!

You will be evicted from this forum and be delivered into the 'Gas Engines' forum instead...

But at the same time, you will 'enjoy' a much smaller number of 'dead sticks'...

jake_027

My Feedback: (1)

HAHAHA...already bought a DA 50 and a 27% Extra 260 which is in the process of being assembled. This engine is in a H9 1/4 scale cap 232. I did some research on choosing an engine for this plane and the majority of opinions were that the plane was too small for a gas engine (ie: high wing loading). Also, I wanted to have good power to weight ratio which the saito provides.

JettPilot

My Feedback: (6)

At that size, the gas engine is MUCH better than a Saito 180... A couple ounces weight difference wont matter, im sure you are not flying national level competition. With a gas engine, you will spend much more time flying, and much less time messing around with your engine.

This carp about the plane being to small for a gas engine is BS... If you can put a 180 on it, you can put a gas engine on it with better results.

JettPilot

Flyer95

My Feedback: (1)

There is never any "best solution" for anything in life. It is more like give and take.
Very soon the guys flying electric powered giant scale airplanes are gonna show up in these forums and tell us glow/gas flyers to get rid of our combustions engines and convert to electric because they think it is the "best solution".
From my view point the Saito 180 is superior to any gas engine in its size. It drinks more expensive fuel, but who cares? Are we gonna live forever?

jake_027

My Feedback: (1)

Well...I'm not a Chevy vs Ford kind of guy. I like gas engines and I like glow engines as well. I also think that there are pros and cons with each engine and I also believe that different airframes require different engines. For example, I have a .40 size H9 Twist. I need a glow engine on this plane. It's a fun plane to fly and I love to 3D with it. I know there are many guys out there that would never consider a twist only because they can't put a gas engine on it!! In the meantime, they are missing out on a fun plane that can do great 3D, is very affordabe and is easy to transport! This is a perfect plane to run to the field with after work. The big glow engines drink a lot of fuel and the fuel is expensive compared to pump gas but my reply to that is...who cares?? When we spend $500.00 on an ARF which is nothing more than Balsa sticks covered in Monokote, do we really have to pretend that we are cheap. This reminds me of the people that go out and buy a $65,000.00 SUV and then complain about the price of gas!

The bottom line is, when people spend so much $$ on a good gas engine or on a good glow engine they often feel the need to justify the expenditure by proclaiming that their engine is the best which is why they spent so much. Also, they try to justify the high price of a good gas engine with E.I. by stating how much $$ they are going to save on fuel. Why try to justify the $$ spent.....it's a hobby....have FUN and don't worry about the coin!!!

evanditto

My Feedback: (1)

Could it have carb ice? I was flying my Saito .82 in last spring with the temperature/dewpoint spread very close. The temperature outside was about 65. It has never died before and was very baffling. I would have never guessed but I noticed condensation on the intake manifold and then saw there was ice in the carb. Very familiar with carb icing in scale aircraft but never made the connection (very obvious) until this happened. Just a thought?