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*** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Old 01-31-2007, 08:06 PM
  #301  
proptop
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

I got my assembly lube with the Crane cam I put in my 351 Cleveland about 10-12 years ago...

Actually, the Moly (Molybdinum Disulphide I think? ) is probably overkill...and if you use too much, it will clog small oil passages.
I think the red (Zinc somethingorother ) stuff makes a more user friendly hi pressure lube.

Performance Specialties (www.pspec.com ) "Ultra Oil" is really nice too, and it's compatable with YS diaphrams.
Old 01-31-2007, 10:34 PM
  #302  
buzzingb
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Used Engines ON EBAY???
Many of you are probally like me you search Ebay for intertainment or just maybe you buy engines there. I have purchased a couple of engines on Ebay before myself but now I tend to buy only new engines. The prices have gone up up to the point that I have no desire to even seriously look there for engines. It seem that many people search for engines there and don't mind paying almost new prices to buy the engines. I personally believe they are paying too much and I will tell you why. Used engines come with no warranty and some have been run lean. Once I personally bought an engine that had been run lean but was still in operating condition. I was ok with this because I payed about 30% of new price and the engine did run ok. Just recently I have been monitoring the Super Tiger engines on the site in hopes of picking up one but it just isn't going to happen. I was thinking that maybe they would go for cheap prices and I might get lucky and buy one but after months of watching I have given up. They all seem to get very close to new prices if they look to be in pretty good condition and if they have seen losts of running they still get to half or more to the price of new. I could be wrong about this as you may have been one of the lucky ones and if so that is great but there aren't many lucky ones out there anymore. Another engine I have been monitoring is the OS 46 and what I mean is I have an old one that could be rebuilt if I could pick up some parts. I have now decided that isn't going to happen because they tend to go for about the price of a new Super Tiger engine for used and I just can't justify that. Well I will continue to look at these engines when I need something to pass the time but I certainly couldn't recomend buying one, not when Super Tigers are as cheap as they are.
Old 01-31-2007, 11:10 PM
  #303  
buzzingb
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Designing/Engines/
Just recently I was thinking of several engines and how each one had good and bad points. Now I am no engineer but if I was I would look at all the engines out there and some that were built in the past and see what is good about them. Once all aspects of good points were documented now I would begin to adapt those good qualities into my engine. Let me elaborate some if I may. K&B 61 Twister- the twist on cylinder and head in one piece is a good idea and very practical as it can be manufactured easily. The benifits are light weight, simple design, cheaper, easy to remove or install, has been proven and etc. Saito-aluminum chrome cylinder light weight one piece head and cylinder good power. Novel 40AX-- I was just talking to a man about his engine just a few days a go. It has some good technology (AAO revlite) but I don't know if it has proven itself yet. Ceramic coatings, acording to Norve it features an aluminum piston with an aluminum cylinder that has a oxide coating (ceramic plating) loned with Sliktek, Norvel's proprietary cylinder coatiing like Teflon. Sliktec protects the porus ceramic coating to reduce friction in improve fuel efficiecy. May improve fuel usage and power by up to 20-40%. Well that sounds like a winner if it holds up. Jett engines- the power that these engines produce is much better than other engines but could easily be copied by other engine manufacturers. Super Tiger even has a few things are good also like iron liners, cheap prices, power.\
Now I have only listed a few things here to get you to thinking as I don't intend in doing all the research. So lets hear some of the good qualities about some of your favorite engies.
Old 02-01-2007, 03:08 AM
  #304  
ianwynne
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Hello Buzz:

I agree with you about buying used engines in eBay. A couple of days ago an ST.9
0 sold for a third of the new price in Australia. The thing was
it had been sold baldly crashed the crankshaft was so badly beind it was visible
in the photo and it was advertised as being suitable for spare parts only. And
some still paid a third of the new price for it.

I sometimes wonder that perhaps some people have so little money they really sho
uldn't be in the hobby in the first place.

Bye, Ian
Old 02-01-2007, 08:19 AM
  #305  
buzzingb
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

With the cost of fuel it would be nice to have better fuel economy and I think that was what Norvel was after. I am leary of any coating on a cylinde of piston though and would not buy one of these engines until I knew it had been proven. As we know coatings tend to peel. I remember reading in an auto magazine about 20 years ago about some kind of coating that was applied to the top of pistons that prevented heat form traveling through piston. I wonder if that is still being used today? Some piston manufacutrers also at one time applied some kind of teflon to the piston skirts to help with friction.
Old 02-01-2007, 04:29 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

CONTOURED-LIP on CARB INTAKE

Well it finally happened I read some useful informatin in the Model Avaiation Magazine. The article by Joe Wagner was very informative and enjoyable. He was talking about something that I was going to try but haven't gotten around to it yet and that is contouring the lip on the carb intake. In my mind I had thought of this before but in a slightly different way. I think it would be good to retain the original carb intake as is, if possible and find some tubeing tha will fit snuggly over the carb barrel and give it a slight bell shape with the contoured slot to face tword the air stream and use a little JB to hold it tight. Remembe as Joe said the airstream doesn't go directly straight back but is slighly to one side. The interesting point is Joe said that there is power and rpms to be had by doing this. In fact he said that it could yeld a minimum increase of 4% increase and has given as much as 15%. Now that is real power for just a few minutes time in my book and doesn't cost anything. One thing to watch is, make sure you radious the lip as to prevent intake stall.Well with the tubeing I would think this would take care of that. If you haven't read it please do so, it is on page 75 of issue Febuary 2007 in The Engine Shop. Please let us know if you have tried this or if you do try this. I am thinking about giving it a go this spring when the weather warms.
Old 02-01-2007, 08:22 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

If you look at this idea in simple terms we have our own super charger right on the front of the engine so why not use it. I believe I will richen the motor up a little when I give it a go as the extra air will need just a tab bit more fuel.
Old 02-01-2007, 08:51 PM
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buzzingb
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Ther are many things going on with engine technology now that most people aren't aware of especially in the automotive area. Many manufacturers are looking to get better performance out of their engines both in power and fuel economy. This is driving technolog and changes are being made. One such change that occured a few years ago was to loosen up the tollerances on the rotating surfaces (increase bearing clearance on crank). One such manufacturer did just that and it helped fuel economy but sometimes there is a hint of a nock when you fire up the engine in the morning. Most people don't even notice it so who cares. It may be that glow engines could utalize some of this new and emerging technology. I have heard that motorcycles will all be fuel injected in a few years, the larger ones are now. I not think we will see fuel injected engines in glow but there is one now, OS. I believe the carg is one area that all manufacturers sould improve as they are very crude. One manufacturer has experimented with starterless engines and how this works is that with computer controlled fuel injection there is always one cylinder on v8 engine that could be injected and fired and that would cause another to be in position to be injected and fired and so on.
Old 02-01-2007, 08:53 PM
  #309  
buzzingb
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

If fuel injection improved glow engines like it did auto engines we could double the power of these glow engines. In 1980 I bought a Chevy pickup with a 350 that has 175 or so hp today the same engine with new technology can easily be twice that.
Old 02-01-2007, 09:22 PM
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buzzingb
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Speaking of twice what is the effect of a head with two glow plugs? I have seen several in the past but didn't give much tought to them at the time. I wonder if the shape of the glow plug would render more HP?
Old 02-01-2007, 09:49 PM
  #311  
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***


ORIGINAL: buzzingb

Ther are many things going on with engine technology now that most people aren't aware of especially in the automotive area. Many manufacturers are looking to get better performance out of their engines both in power and fuel economy. This is driving technolog and changes are being made. One such change that occured a few years ago was to loosen up the tollerances on the rotating surfaces (increase bearing clearance on crank). One such manufacturer did just that and it helped fuel economy but sometimes there is a hint of a nock when you fire up the engine in the morning. Most people don't even notice it so who cares. It may be that glow engines could utalize some of this new and emerging technology. I have heard that motorcycles will all be fuel injected in a few years, the larger ones are now. I not think we will see fuel injected engines in glow but there is one now, OS. I believe the carg is one area that all manufacturers sould improve as they are very crude. One manufacturer has experimented with starterless engines and how this works is that with computer controlled fuel injection there is always one cylinder on v8 engine that could be injected and fired and that would cause another to be in position to be injected and fired and so on.

------------


The fly in the ointment is that no car in common production actually uses fuel injection. For the starterless car to work, you would need a true fuel injection unit that has the nozzle in the cylinder, as with a Diesel engine.

What folks call fuel injection these days is just a fancy electronic carburetor. Technically, the carburetor uses vacuum to change the fuel into a mist. The new version of "fuel injectors" use rails to squirt the fuel in mechanically - but this does not make them true fuel injection units from my perspective. No in-the-cylinder-nozzle - NOT fuel injection.

With the low profits to be made in model engine sales, I wouldn't hold my breath while waiting for affordable TRUE fuel injection. OS' prices on their FI engines (actually the distributor's prices) are ridiculously high. Besides, I'm happy with what we have. At least I can fix it most of the time. When's the last time a backyard mechanic actually repaired an automotive fuel injection unit, other than perhaps replacing rails or reprogramming it?


Ed Cregger
Old 02-01-2007, 09:51 PM
  #312  
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

"Ported" fuel injection

"Direct" fuel injection
Old 02-01-2007, 10:09 PM
  #313  
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Not a good example.

I believe it was 1967, Chevy made 350hp 327.

In 1983 I bought a Datson 510 that got an honest 40mpg at 70 mph.
I had a stock 55 Chevy station wagon with 3 speed and over drive that got 25mpg at 55mph

I'm not sure what system they operate under but it isn't bring us the latest and greatest.
Old 02-01-2007, 11:31 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Much of the power that Chevy makes is throught their vortex head design along with the injection. That is the reason a Large 4 door car will easily get 30 miles per gallon. This was just a suttle change to old technology and that could easily be done with glow engines. The small block chevy engine is capable of over 500HP in the Corvett packages and still gets good fuel economy, just change the plugs and antifreeze around 100 thousand and you are ready for another. Most of the older cars required plug and points changes every year. You were lucky to get 100 thousand and today it is easy to 200 thousand. I have just talked to a man tonight that claimed he has 375 thousand.
Old 02-01-2007, 11:34 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Ok, that's fine and dandy on the car engines, let's get back to tying this in with Super Tigers?
Old 02-01-2007, 11:34 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

With the price of Super Tigers 51 at $79 who cares if they run 100 gallons throught them before they wear out as I bought my last two in pairs just to have a spare.
Old 02-01-2007, 11:49 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Earlier I mentioned the article in MA and another interesting point made there was that the OS La 25 was better now than in the past Joe Wagner said they are better. Maybe our glow engines are making progress as I often see older engines running at the some field I visit in the summer and it always seems that the newer engines can out rev the older ones. Personally when I look to buy a used engine I always look for newer ones. Now I realize there are some very good older engines, like some of the OS engines but for the most part the newer engines perform very well. This may raise the brow of some people out there and that is ok, just report what you think as we are open minded here. Can older glow engines out perform newer ones??? Go ahead lest hear it.
Old 02-02-2007, 01:53 AM
  #318  
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***


ORIGINAL: w8ye

"Ported" fuel injection

"Direct" fuel injection

----------------


I know what you are saying, Jim. And your definitions are what most people use, so I am in the minority. But I stick by my guns. If it isn't direct injection, it isn't fuel injection to me. Yeah, Hilborn and a few others are probably swearing at me right now. <G>


Ed Cregger
Old 02-02-2007, 02:30 AM
  #319  
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Just bought two myself. How good is the carburetor, as I plan on using them both in a twin engine plane?
Old 02-02-2007, 07:37 AM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

They are fine as long as you set them up correctly as this is one reason that most people post here, they don't know how to set them us and get them tuned. They run very well and if you are talking about the 51 they are powerhouses I haven't run the smaller ones but I hear they run even better. The only carb problem I have had is the 2300 as it would run but not consistently which caused me to purchase a Magnum carb. Now the 2300 is one sweet engine.
Old 02-02-2007, 07:42 AM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

All glow fuel systems are simple yet complex, in that I mean they operate on very simple principals but some don't understand a few of these simple operating principals. The fuel thank needs to be centered with carb or just a fraction lower, not higher. Many people are confused about how to tune the needles as it can be more difficult than one thinks. All of the simple principals must work together for it to work properly. Get one thing out of sink and then you have a mess.
Old 02-02-2007, 05:37 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

buzzingb,
One thing not to forget is that Supertigres are extremely cheap in the US. In europe they cost twice as much, I am not joking[&o] Thats why some people on the ebay are willing to pay almost new prices, still very cheap, for these engines. Some engines are the older Italian made and that alone have a value for some buyers.
Old 02-02-2007, 09:44 PM
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Good point Flyer95 and the Super Tiger can be rebuilt easier that some of the other brands because of the iron liner and ring. Just slap a ring on and a couple of bearings and you have almost a new engine.
Old 02-03-2007, 01:17 AM
  #324  
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***

Another club member lost another plane to an ST90's lousy mid-range today. His Extra 300 didn't quite make it back to the strip after the engine died in transition.

He had tried all the so-called "fixes" such as rotating the spraybar, different props, different fuels, idle-bar plugs -- and although each helped a little, the cumulative effect still wasn't sufficient for it to provide a 100% reliable transition/mid-range.

One of the other ST90s belonging to another member is suffering the same fate -- often dying when the throttle is opened after taxiing out to the runway and waiting for take-off.

That so many different people have had exactly the same experiences despite so many different models, fuels, plugs, props, etc kind of confirms the problem with the ST carbies, don't you think?
Old 02-03-2007, 02:26 AM
  #325  
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Default RE: *** CLUB SUPER TIGRE ***


ORIGINAL: XJet

Another club member lost another plane to an ST90's lousy mid-range today. His Extra 300 didn't quite make it back to the strip after the engine died in transition.

He had tried all the so-called "fixes" such as rotating the spraybar, different props, different fuels, idle-bar plugs -- and although each helped a little, the cumulative effect still wasn't sufficient for it to provide a 100% reliable transition/mid-range.

One of the other ST90s belonging to another member is suffering the same fate -- often dying when the throttle is opened after taxiing out to the runway and waiting for take-off.

That so many different people have had exactly the same experiences despite so many different models, fuels, plugs, props, etc kind of confirms the problem with the ST carbies, don't you think?

----------------


Pilots lose planes - not engines.


Ed Cregger

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