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Guillows Trixter Beam

Old 02-03-2015, 12:59 AM
  #26  
CLBetten
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Well my Trixter Beam is ready to fly. I did everything I could practically do to reduce tail weight. I still had to add a 2.5 ounce spinner nut and 1.5 ounces of lead to the nose. I have the CG centered laterally and at 25% of the chord. I removed over 6 ounces of lead when I started the project. I used a .25 engine, 6 oz tank, steerable nose gear (4th servo) and ended with a total weight of 58 ounces. I wanted to do better. Bob Aberle weighed his at 52 ounces. I feel more comfortable being conservative about the CG. I'm quite sure the CG will easily go aft once I test fly and get familiar. The first thing to go will be the 2.5 ounce spinner nut. If that goes I'll be at 55 1/2. Since I added obvious weight I won't feel too bad about it.
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Old 02-03-2015, 09:25 AM
  #27  
r_jsmith
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From the numbers you give it looks like you are at 22oz/sq_ft. The box label recommends 14->16 oz/sq-ft. Since you are powering with a .25 engine your power loading will be ok but I dont think you will be pleased with the performance. One thing to remember about these models is that they were deliberately designed to have high drag in order to keep the glide and power velocities pretty much the same. This means that although your .25 will pull it around the model it will most likely fly at a high angle of attack and "mush a bit" and possibly be prone to tip stalls when landing.
Having had hundreds of flights with 3 self built examples of this remarkable model using the materials and RC equipment of the time I personally would try to get the wing loading down to around 12 oz and electrify it.
The best way I can sum this up is that you have built a free flight sports model with primitive radio guidance nothing more. I am not damming it with faint praise here.
Old 02-03-2015, 06:26 PM
  #28  
CLBetten
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I didn't build this plane. It was given to me crashed. I rebuilt it. The plans and instructions that came with it predict a wing loading of 20 ounces. I'm with you in the understanding that a lower wing loading would change/ improve the character of the plane. I will fly it (or try). With luck I can move the CG and reduce some weight. Ultimately I'll just test and see. Even in the worst case scenario I've learned a lot of history and enjoyed interaction from other people here. If I am inclined to built one from scratch I will be entering into the task with a lot of knowledge and insight. The wing loading in the 14 range or even a little lower is certainly within reach. For starters it would be stick framed. Win, win situation for me. I'll know tomorrow if the rain stops.
Old 02-03-2015, 06:43 PM
  #29  
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I think I mentioned earlier that your model and others like it pretty much mark the end of model airplanes as a very instructive hobby in favor of it becoming a sport.
You are quite right in wanting to fly your model as is and hopefully become aware of the challenges and thrill of seeing something you constructed, or in your case preserved, flying under your control.
I have been involved with model aeronautics from the late 40's until today and I remain convinced that it's by far the most instructive and rewarding hobby for any one with reasonable mechanical skills.
Old 02-03-2015, 07:12 PM
  #30  
CLBetten
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I absolutely agree. I have 11 planes ready to fly. I've had dozens. I'm proud to say every one I've owned over the last 16 years has been built from plans (several from free flight), a kit or a repair. I've never had an ARF. What I've taken from each one has included a lot more than just the pleasure of flying. Those of us on this forum are becoming extinct. The aspect of the hobby you are talking about is fading fast. It shows here in my area in many ways, not the least of which is the poor availability of materials to build or repair an airplane with at my local R/C retailers. I'll love it if this Trixter is or becomes a joy to fly. In the end if it isn't I'll just build one that is from what I've learned. If I show up to fly and I have the exact same airplane as someone else there that came from a box or I send my picture to "Model Aviation" holding the same ARF that was in a sale ad the month before, then I'll admit failure.
Old 02-03-2015, 07:27 PM
  #31  
CLBetten
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Just stepped back and fell off my soap box. Hehehe
Old 02-04-2015, 08:03 AM
  #32  
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I don't mean to patronize but do you anything of Frank Zaic? Briefly put in the 30's and 40's Frank made what was basically a one man effort to formalize model aeronautics into a science.
Frank memorialized his efforts into a series of year books and an occasional publication focusing on some aspect of this budding science/hobby.
Most of Franks books remain available today.. If you are interested try to obtain copies of those written in the 30's. They present a fascinating portrait of the times (late depression) and the dreams of youth.
I knew Frank personally and in the last 10 years or so I have published a good deal about him and his company JASCO on the various model aircraft forums. Run a GOOGLE you might find some of it of interest
Old 02-04-2015, 07:22 PM
  #33  
CLBetten
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I flew the heck out of my Trixter today. Probably a total of 4+ hours in the air. I ended up removing all of the ballast and wishing there was more to lighten the nose. The .25 is way too much power. I switched from a 9X6 prop to 10X4 and it's still plenty fast just off idle. It handles great! I ended up with 55% of the rudder throw I started with and a lot of down trim. It will not stall. It will just mush straight forward while loosing altitude. Totally uneventful. I am enjoying it. Lower wing loading would make it even more sweet. I was doing touch and goes by holding the elevator full up and cutting the throttle. It will just land itself. It's everything I hoped for. If I built another it would conform to the suggestions I've been given here. A lighter tail would be priority one. The last picture is of an oil mess to advocate electric power. Hahaha
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Old 02-05-2015, 12:11 PM
  #34  
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Glad you like your Beam. Here's a little secret that we used during the our early test flights... put the prop on backwards, greatly reduces the efficiency I don't know if they are still around but nylon props were flexible and because of that inefficient. Also tough to break..
Old 02-05-2015, 10:32 PM
  #35  
CLBetten
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I've actually used that trick on my 1/2 A control line planes also.
Old 02-15-2015, 08:30 AM
  #36  
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The OS 25 FX probably makes at least 5 times the power of any engine used at the time. An old Enya 19 would be nice, or an old OS 25 with the strap on muffler. Both are a little over 7 oz with muffler, so you would save 3 oz in the nose. An OS 15 FP or LA would be nice power too, and weigh even less. All of these would still give you more power than the plane was originally designed for.

Nice plane, glad you are enjoying it!

Jim
Old 02-28-2015, 08:22 PM
  #37  
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Nice to see your TLC reclaimed a great flyer. Bravo ----
Old 03-03-2015, 09:53 PM
  #38  
CLBetten
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If I used a lighter engine I would need to add ballast. Electric with a battery large enough to fly for an hour or so is an option.
Old 03-04-2015, 05:14 AM
  #39  
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Oh, I made the comment because of your post 33, "I ended up removing all of the ballast and wishing there was more to lighten the nose." A lighter engine would get you that.

Regardless, you've got a nice plane that's pretty unique at any club field these days.

Jim
Old 03-04-2015, 07:32 AM
  #40  
CLBetten
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Actually Jim you're absolutely right. I forgot I said that. On more recent flights that I've emptied the fuel tank in flight the CG is about as far rearward as I'd push it. I apologize. I wasn't being critical of your comment. I absolute enjoy your input, interaction and expertise. Take care, Cliff.
Old 03-04-2015, 01:19 PM
  #41  
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No problem Cliff; I may have sounded critical and if so I apologize too. Sounds like you've got yourself a really nice plane.

You take care too. Jim
Old 05-23-2015, 02:20 PM
  #42  
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Built one of these about 9 years ago.
It flew with conventional servos (3) & a ruddevator system from 1949.
It was pretty heavy (54 oz) with 2 receivers & 2 sets of nicads.
I made a double transmitter tray to hold both transmitters.
It flew just fine at VRCS events. with an OS 15.
Was featured in FM mag if you can find an old copy.

Bob
Old 06-19-2015, 07:45 PM
  #43  
Chromedome58
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I got to fly with Bob's Trixter Beam the other day with a PCS transmitter and it was a blast. With an OS Max 15 it has a long take-off roll, but is quite nice handling in the air. It's a fun plane to fly. I will eventually install an OS Max 25 to get a little better take-off performance.
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Old 06-19-2015, 08:37 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Chromedome58 View Post
I got to fly with Bob's Trixter Beam the other day with a PCS transmitter and it was a blast. With an OS Max 15 it has a long take-off roll, but is quite nice handling in the air. It's a fun plane to fly. I will eventually install an OS Max 25 to get a little better take-off performance.
Chromedome - nice looking craft, great color scheme - it works. What is that aft of the rudder - can't make it out.
Old 06-20-2015, 02:32 PM
  #45  
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I am sure the Rudevator slows it down some & adds drag.

Bob

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