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Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Old 11-24-2007, 10:47 PM
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Stickbuilder
 
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Heck, the best glue is still an old toothbrush handle dissolved in acetone.

No joke I needed to slice into a frame that was built with CA several years ago. While I was using a cutoff wheel on the Dremel, I hit a glue joint. The fumes were just as bad as fresh kicked CA. The dust from that stuff has to be lethal.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Old 11-24-2007, 11:53 PM
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fozjared
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

dang huffers, i remember in elementary there was a girl i sat beside who ate elmers school glue (white glue) man she grossed me out even in a time when all girls were gross she was exceptionally so!
Old 11-26-2007, 02:35 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?


ORIGINAL: Michaelj2k

Any of you guys who have around long enough remember the model airplane glue sniffing problems of the sixties?
Yep, but now, it's "huffing" paint fumes. Now, THERE'S something to cause brain damage!

Old 11-30-2007, 07:23 PM
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barryadam
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Geez...

Falcon 56, Ambroid, Titebond, Testors plastic model car cement, Acetone, dope, silk, the days of the "introduction" of Epoxy...

all stuff from my past, too! Back in the early 70's I tested all kinds of adhesives on that CG Falcon as it was not as good of a first airplane for my training as was the Buzzard Bombshell that I switched to (no instructor or buddy box, either).

I last flew in about 1977, and now that I am trying to get back into flying, I had the same questions about the old adhesives. After reviewing this thread, I'm glad to know that I can still use Titebond as it takes a while to get used to the "feel" of how well and strong an adhesive is. It will take a long time and lots of building for me to get used to what a CA joint is capable of.

Looking around at the RC shows and magazines, it looks like most folks don't build much anymore, anyways. Everything seems to be moving toward these 3-D electric profile foam thingies and molded foam ARF electrics. Even old RCM is gone, now.

I'm getting some Titebond and epoxy for the WOOD Beaver kit I got. YEAH!! Thanks guys.

Barry

(a CDN in Calif)
Old 11-30-2007, 07:57 PM
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Don41
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

After my very bad experience with CA I went back to wood glues exclusively.

In our litigious society, where people have been known to sue hamburger joints for making them fat, it kind of amazes me that someone hasn't filed suit against the CA manufacturers.
Old 12-01-2007, 07:00 AM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Barry,

Welcome back to the hobby - and the NEW R/C. Your story is familiar to all of us 50-somethings: Homebuilt R/Cs in high school, then military/college/family/career/second wife/kids moving out...then back in/third wife/etc. And now, back into the hobby. Screeeeeeeeeech (sound of car tires!) What happened to R/C? Everything's.........different!

Yep, unfortunately, RCM, the magazine we used to hide inside our high school government book is gone - replaced by about 15 new R/C magazines of which none really measure up to "our" old RCM. Today's kids (always the backbone of the hobby) aren't as interested in building as they are flying so more manufacturers offer RTFs and ARFs than boxes of wood sticks and dreams. And the "flying" that they do...well, that's just odd too. REAL planes just don't fly by hanging from their props and I don't care what anybody else says - there's just something unnatural about watching a model B-29 doing acro. Nobody learns to fly now by crow hopping their trainer in the high school parking lot until they get up the nerve to do their first go around. Everybody hooks up to the Official Club Trainer Guy via an umbilical cord (for a small hourly fee) and learns how to fly without ever breaking a prop. And nobody mows lawns anymore to earn enough money to buy their dream Cox .049. Jeez, even all of the drive-in theatres are gone now so today's high schoolers have to learn about sex from the internet! No, wait! That's a different subject.
Old 12-01-2007, 09:15 AM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

That's pretty funny, and a little bit too close to the truth.

Do you think that most modelers (or builders) started with other forms of modeling first? How many of today's RCer's have ever build a rubber powered FF, or flown control line (not counting some Cox or Wen Mac crap)?
Old 12-01-2007, 03:17 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?


ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder

Heck, the best glue is still an old toothbrush handle dissolved in acetone.

No joke I needed to slice into a frame that was built with CA several years ago. While I was using a cutoff wheel on the Dremel, I hit a glue joint. The fumes were just as bad as fresh kicked CA. The dust from that stuff has to be lethal.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

Soaking the joint with acetone should loosen it. Do it in a well ventilated area!!!
Old 12-01-2007, 08:01 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?


[/quote]


Soaking the joint with acetone should loosen it. Do it in a well ventilated area!!!
[/quote]

Nah, asitoan fyooms r gud 4 u! I bin yoosing it 4 years an i'm fine!
Old 12-01-2007, 09:30 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I can't believe all of you Old Timers failed to mention good old AMBROID. It took forever to dry but the joints were solid as a rock. Some of my buddies used Testors Kwik Dry. I think it was in a green tube. I always thought the quick dry joints were too brittle. I didn't do any testing to confirm those thoughts. I probably had an Old Timer tell me back in 1968 to not to use the quick dry stuff.
Old 12-01-2007, 10:07 PM
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H5487
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Actually, Ambroid HAS been mentioned a few times in this thread; almost always with fondness but it has been mentioned that while it is still available, the new (non-intoxicating) formula doesn't seem to hold near as well as us Old Timers remember.

And who are ya calling "old" Bub?
Old 12-01-2007, 10:31 PM
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Don41
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I used a lot of Ambroid in the "old" days but I think you'll find Titebond III is a better glue. Holds great and it will sand without leaving ridges.

These days I use Epoxy and Titebond exclusively. For my two cents I'd steer completely clear of CA unless you're willing to risk damaging the tissue in your lungs. It makes a lot of gluing chores a breeze but it is very toxic. Some folks say it is needed on some of the new hinging materials but I have found that a thin layer of Titebond added to the CA type hinges at final insertion will work just as well (and it isn't toxic glue).
Old 12-02-2007, 11:33 AM
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dicknadine
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

for whats its worth, no matter what adhesive you use, its better than Band Aids and masking tape. we all have tried every one of the above and what works for me is what counts. dick
Old 12-07-2007, 06:45 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?


ORIGINAL: HighPlains

That's pretty funny, and a little bit too close to the truth.

Do you think that most modelers (or builders) started with other forms of modeling first? How many of today's RCer's have ever build a rubber powered FF, or flown control line (not counting some Cox or Wen Mac crap)?
That's exactly how I started in the early 70's. A great builder/modeler and his friend held a class through the City Recreation department for model building that would help widen the hobby in our small town. They had us build a HLG, then a rubber FF, then a 0.049 Cox powered control line model with a tissue covered wing. I still have some of the bits. Good times!
Fast forward to a few years ago, I had a brilliant idea to introduce MY kids to working with balsa and copied all three set of plans, made 3 building boards, 3 set of X-acto tools, 3 sets of sanding blocks, etc. After about the first hour of busting balsa, they all got bored and went back to playing video games, TV, their friends, and other non-Dad activities. (sigh)

Barry
Old 12-07-2007, 07:54 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Barry,

I can relate (as probably many 40 and 50-somethings on this site.) I've got four adult kids and eight grandkids. Not a single one is interested in building model planes!

Who cares about global warming! The future generation doesn't deserve to live! [sm=drowning.gif]

Harvey



(Just kidding everybody - don't get all freaked out and turn this thread into a lecture about how we need to take the global warming warnings seriously!)
Old 12-08-2007, 03:14 AM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?



For my two cents I'd steer completely clear of CA unless you're willing to risk damaging the tissue in your lungs. It makes a lot of gluing chores a breeze but it is very toxic.
[/quote]


You are right about the fumes, but what I do, is open the window behind my work bench, set a 14" fan in the window to exhaust the fumes, keep the door to my "Hobby Room" open No Problem with fumes. I really like the new "Mercury" brand of CA, it even has a 2 year guarantee.
Old 12-08-2007, 09:22 AM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?


ORIGINAL: Ralph78



For my two cents I'd steer completely clear of CA unless you're willing to risk damaging the tissue in your lungs. It makes a lot of gluing chores a breeze but it is very toxic.

You are right about the fumes, but what I do, is open the window behind my work bench, set a 14" fan in the window to exhaust the fumes, keep the door to my "Hobby Room" open No Problem with fumes. I really like the new "Mercury" brand of CA, it even has a 2 year guarantee.
[/quote]
A little off subject but, a few days ago I heard an emergency call on my scanner, a one year old ingested CA. I can't imagine what that poor baby went through.
Old 12-08-2007, 10:31 AM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?


ORIGINAL: Skinny Bob

A little off subject but, a few days ago I heard an emergency call on my scanner, a one year old ingested CA. I can't imagine what that poor baby went through.
Or what went through that poor baby!

(Sorry if my humor offends anyone.)
Old 01-24-2008, 02:44 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Ahhh, from one "old-timer" to another - the only difference between us is that I've stayed fairly active since the beginning (1955), building planes.

Don't worry about the new CA's - they're easy as pie. Yes, they hold up just as well - probably better. You can get CA's with "instant" set-times and CA's with several seconds (30+) set-times. I use most all of them, PLUS I use the old Dubro glue of decades ago (they still make it just like it was in the 1970's, green tube though instead of the yellow/red that it once came in) and I occasionally use Titebond for laminating sides, etc.

Your Falcon-56 from 1971 and my Sr. Falcon from 1974 would look good together at a field. My bird's been flying constantly since the day I finished it, although it's on engine & radio #2 and covering #3. I modified my old bird a few years ago, nearly doubled the aileron area and the elevator area, then mounted an old (NIB) Fox .45RC - she flies like a home-sick angel now, will climb vertically as soon as she leaves the ground, and aerobatics are something to behold.

Hey, welcome back to the fold. Hope you enjoy it again as much as I always have.

Dave W.
Old 01-24-2008, 08:36 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Thanks, Dave. It's good to be back!

Harvey
(a.k.a. "5487")
Old 01-24-2008, 10:03 PM
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john schicker
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Hi Chaps i would like to have a say on gluing .I have finished building a playboy and used the west system and i would recommend using it .Not only dose it glue well you can fill buy applying with Micro sufreers as this is easy to sand and very light .Regards john
Old 01-25-2008, 02:13 PM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Hey Harvey, it's a crying shame we're so far apart but that's the one single drawback of the web I guess. It's also sometimes probably my only saving grace - distance. The web's GREAT for bringing people together for almost any purpose.

I went back last night and re-read some of the earlier posts of this thread, having noticed that there are those who have problems with CA fumes. That IS one point that I didn't think of before. When I'm doing a lot of gluing I've also noticed the "burning" in my nose, just never paid much attention to it (get too wrapped up in my building, I guess).

Don't be afraid of these CA glues, they're great. A small fan would probably help a bit though, as would an open window.

Dave W.
Old 01-25-2008, 04:04 PM
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Thomas B
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

There is no one best glue...pick the right "tool" for you and the job. I use it all, nearly...mostly CA, but also titebond wood glue, every kind of epoxy and even a little gorrilla glue here and there.

The old cellulose glues like Ambrod and testors are the ones I never use any more. I have a couple of old Ambroid built models that are slowly falling apart that I built as a child...the cellulose cements are not good at all for longevity and the joints embrittle. Some folks still swear by using the old fashioned model glues to edge glue balsa sheets for wing skins, though and it does make some sense for that.

If you use the least bit of common sense with CA, you can avoid becoming sensitized to it, as I have not ever become sensitized. I have used it extensively nearly daily for over 20 years at work (professional model builder) and at home as an R/C model builder since the mid 1970s ....any one remember the original Hot Stuff CA by Satellite City?...

I make sure my workplace is well ventilated and that I can almost never smell the fumes...it is just that simple.

I make sure I can almost never smell the fumes, by keeping the workspace well ventilated.

I have models that I built with CA from the late 1970s and early 1980s that are still flyable...all built with CA except for the ply wirefall joint.

Ca can get a little heavy, but most people use far too much. Use a thin tube applicatior and be careful..why waste it?
Old 01-26-2008, 02:59 AM
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Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I am happy to say "Wood glue is not dead"....but the old glues pretty much have bit the dust! CA is good!...unless you are alergic to it ...or do not like the fumes..!

But to be honest...you really have to use the best glues for the job....or what you know. I am really impartial I am actually quite the young guy here (I am guessing since I know way less than most people on this forum)...but back in the 70's we would "tack" everything together with "hotstuff" and ambroid everything (thin it out with alcohol). This was done to save $ since the hotstuff was pretty expensive.....it this is your thing use it.

Now adays..I personally use "CA"...and it is good...(if you can stand the fumes)....it is quick...It is strong enough to build any kind of airplanes..(even giant scale air racers)...with a liberal use of really slow set epoxy (24 hr) ...on the really important parts. The "big ape glue" works great on foam wing cores...it seems to delaminate less than epoxy...and it is way better than contact cement.

yep it is dead.

Steve
Old 07-25-2009, 08:39 AM
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chuck l
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Default RE: Is

I've read through this thread and noticed that some of you tack parts together with CA and followup with Titebond or similiar putting a fillet around the joint. Does the fillet of Titebond really add much strength? Doesn't the glue have to be in the wood joint itself to be most effective?

Chuck

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