Notices
Golden Age, Vintage & Antique RC Want to discuss some of those from the golden age, vintage rc planes or even an old classic antique vintage rc planes, radios, engines, etc? This is the place for you. Enjoy!

Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Old 07-19-2007, 05:30 PM
  #1  
H5487
Thread Starter
 
H5487's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 1,088
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I'm re-entering the hobby after a nearly 30 year absence and quite a few things have changed, especially when it comes to adhesives. The new CA super glues seem to have taken over the hobby and I'm wondering if good 'ol "wood glue" is used at all any more? Maybe I'm still stuck in the 1970s 'cause I'm hesitant to switch from my Titebond to CA. Sure, CA sets up instantly whereas Titebond takes its time but does CA have the longevity of Titebond? I mean, I've still got my Falcon 56 from 1971 and it's still pretty sound.

Have all the other old modelers switched to CA? Should I stop wearing my bell bottom pants too?

Note to moderator: I put this question in the Vintage RC section because I'm looking for replies from other stubborn old timers like myself.
Old 07-19-2007, 05:40 PM
  #2  
littlebobh
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Springfield, VA
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

well im not a stubborn old timer... actually im a young whippersnapper but i use wood glue all the time! ESPECIALLY when im glueing my wood stuff together. I dont think CA holds wood together as well as wood glue does. i think they are both a necessity for building. in my opinion i think a good amount of people still use the ole Titebond
Old 07-19-2007, 05:41 PM
  #3  
Live Wire
Senior Member
 
Live Wire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sterling , CO
Posts: 6,059
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

5487
No but they say C.A will make you that way[]

OOOH I for got to say I buy the stuff by the Quart
Next Year
Old 07-19-2007, 05:52 PM
  #4  
Herb Brown
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 103
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Wood Glue is not only alive. It is better than ever. If you don't think so, try gluing some wood scraps together with Titebond III and check out the resulting joints. Dries a little faster than the original Titebond and produces some really strong joints. Sands much easier than CA, also.
Herb
Old 07-19-2007, 06:38 PM
  #5  
HighPlains
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Over da rainbow, KS
Posts: 5,085
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Dead horses? I think so! Has anybody seen Mr Ed lately?
Old 07-19-2007, 07:39 PM
  #6  
mocgp
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I was looking at a wood-working magazine recently in which one of the lead articles was a test of various glues. I think the list was Titebond, Titebond III, epoxy, horsehide, CA, and polyurethane (a.k.a. "Gorilla Glue"). The main part of the test was holding power but it also rated flexibility and sandability. The hands-down winner was the aliphatic. Titebond III came in first but the article noted that there was little, if any, difference between it and the plain vanilla Titebond. Gorilla Glue was way down the list, especially in holding power. CA's were rated OK but you don't really see a lot of that used in regular woodworking, at least not to the extent that we do with balsa.

My usual technique is to use CA on non-critical joints and fillet the joint with Titebond. If I need a stronger joint, it starts and ends with Titebond, and clamped if possible. I have tried Gorilla Glue but not enough to rate it. Seems strong enough but it can be difficult to get right due to the fact that one piece has to be moistened in order for it to work properly. How much water to use is a real hit-or-miss proposition.
Old 07-19-2007, 07:43 PM
  #7  
heli_Rod
Senior Member
 
heli_Rod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fairmount, IN
Posts: 621
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Wood glue is alive and well. I use mostly Titebond II, but do use CA now and then. Ca is hard on my lungs. It gives me chronic bronchitis if I breath the fumes....and I just like Titebond better.....old school for an old fart.

Rod
Old 07-19-2007, 08:14 PM
  #8  
FOD MAN
Senior Member
 
FOD MAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: gurdon, AR
Posts: 345
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

the quality of my building went back up when i started to use titebond again. more time to get the parts in the correct poisition and i dont glue my fingers to the airframe anymore. i keep CA on hand but it is the last one i reach for while building.
Old 07-19-2007, 09:26 PM
  #9  
Don41
Senior Member
 
Don41's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: El Dorado, CA
Posts: 581
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I too return to the hobby once I retired and I tried the new wonder glue, complete with finding out about the wicking properties of thin CA the hard way (:-). I think this would be an appropriate time to warn my fellow kit builders about CA glues. I am one of those lucky individuals who never seemed allergic to anything (even poison oak) HOWEVER when I started using CA glues I allowed myself to get a few doses of the fumes in my eyes and nose. I can no longer get near the CA without a pretty good allergic reaction that mimics asthma. It got severe enough that I had to visit a doctor (something I rarely do).

I loved using thin CA for its ability to "spot weld" parts then return with glue later on however those days have come to an end. So if you use the stuff keep my experiences in mind and try to avoid contact with the stuff. Fumes or direct.

I'd re-introduce yourself to Titebond and Ambroid.
Old 07-20-2007, 12:28 AM
  #10  
TexasAirBoss
My Feedback: (22)
 
TexasAirBoss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,972
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

CA doesn't sand. So scale builders, or just guys that like a nice looking model will generally use a white or yellow wood glue on the parts that will be sanded on the skin of the plane. I still use CA on ineards.
Old 07-20-2007, 01:17 AM
  #11  
ifr2lax
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: CA
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Another retread here as of 2001.

Most glues seem to have their place. In my uncontrolled experiments...

CA I tried but it is quick! Sometimes it sets quick, sometimes you have to hit it with accelerator...but to me seems too brittle for a lot of small stickwood joints and hard to sand without destroying everything around it. I use it mainly for "in the field repairs" and "tac" joints to hold things in place while you build.

CA does NOT evaporate so it is a heavier joint than water or acetone based glues. Store CA in the refrigerator and it will last for years. I have a bottle of thick dated 2003, just used it last week seemed fine. I think it is pretty toxic stuff...(wonder if the CA "accelerator" is the culprit as it gets atomised when you squirt it on the joints...have heard that your body builds up a sensitivity to it...I use it sparingly

#2 FAVORITE - Aliphatic, Elmers Carpenter or Titebond? I use for more critical joints that may not have to be sanded. Especially when using hard wood like spruce, bass or plywood. I thin the glue a little with water...a bottle cap...(Heineken) is the right size and paint it on the joint. Let it soak in for awhile and then use the glue full strength...try to wait 12/24 hours for larger joints where air is pretty much shut out of a lot of the area.

Gorilla glue I found to be a mess...if you use to much it bubbles out of the joint in a froth...hard to sand, gooey and tough. Strong though! Think it mainly for plywood to hardwood.
I have not used it again. I would use epoxy in its place. Just as much of mess but doesn't froth out of the joint.

#3 FAVORITE - Epoxy again for joints with a hard wood, like spar joiners, firewalls, rock-maple engine mounts...30 minute type Epoxy is the minimum cure time I have heard for a strong joint, 24 hour epoxy is better.

#1 ALL TIME FAVORITE...! Ambroid, similar to SigBond? is my general use glue for balsa/balsa joints. I thin it with acetone 50/50 and use a paint brush to pre-cement a lot of joints, then go back and use full strength with a "baby bird feeder" syringe that has a curved tip...lets you put glue where you want it...also works for aliphatic glue.

Ahhh! good ol' AMBROID and ACETONE...just a little wiff takes me back to building models as a kid...but after ONE wiff...I turn a fan on.

If you use dope to cover, try a GAS MASK! It WORKS! When I am covering with dope...if it more than a repair I use a gas mask with charcoal filters (~$15). The charcoal removes enough solvent gas that after a coat of dope...walk in the house..close the door...
Old 07-20-2007, 08:16 AM
  #12  
HighPlains
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Over da rainbow, KS
Posts: 5,085
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

While on the subject of glues, has anybody found a epoxy as good as Hobbypoxy II to replace it?
Old 07-20-2007, 08:20 AM
  #13  
Prairie Mike
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Ovilla, TX
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I remember reading somewhere (RCM?) that one reason Titlbond dries slower than CA is because we use too much glue. (Yeah, CA "cures" and Ttitlbond dries)
If I remember correctly, you should just use a real thin layer of yellow glue and it will set up really fast. Almost to the point of not needing clamps
Does anyone remember that article? Or am I smoking something I shouldn't be smoking
Old 07-20-2007, 09:58 AM
  #14  
CrateCruncher
My Feedback: (1)
 
CrateCruncher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 947
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I used to use CA exclusively because I liked the quick cure time and seemingly strong balsa/balsa bond but as my planes have gotten bigger (with more hardwood) I'm using good 'ol low tech TitebondII! I still use CA to tach major assemblies together over the plan but then follow up with appropriate amounts of the wood glue for strength. I guess I'm not in that big a hurry anymore and a jug of Titebond is the same price as a small bottle of CA. No allergies so far.
Old 07-20-2007, 02:09 PM
  #15  
aerowoof
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: pembroke, NH
Posts: 2,962
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

in regards to hobbypoxy ll,I posed this question a while ago and was told that west system epoxy is good and hobbypoxy may still be available as a marine epoxy at your local boat/marine store.
Old 07-20-2007, 02:18 PM
  #16  
aerowoof
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: pembroke, NH
Posts: 2,962
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

by the way I still use titebond or even elmers glue all.tried hot stuff when it first came out $16.00 for 2 little bottles,it was okay if you fit the joints properly but when it kicked made my eyes water,I still use it sparingly,keep it uin the freezer still good after 10 years.I built a falcon 56 in 1970 using elmers glue all,all the joints are still nice and tight,the silk covering as dry rotted and torn,but the air frame is still airworthy,will be stripping off the old silk and recover with a plastic film,back then that falcon weighed 5 plus pounds,lots of coats of dope to seal the weave made it heavy.
Old 07-20-2007, 03:35 PM
  #17  
scottrc
 
scottrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: A TREE, KS
Posts: 2,754
Received 4 Likes on 3 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I will not apply sheeting with CA anymore, woodglue is a lot more easier to work with.
Old 07-20-2007, 05:20 PM
  #18  
aerowoof
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: pembroke, NH
Posts: 2,962
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

you will notice that when you use wood glue for sheeting as it dries it pulls the sheeting tighter acainst the ribs and spars,unless of copurse there is a large gap to begin with
Old 07-20-2007, 07:08 PM
  #19  
w8ye
My Feedback: (16)
 
w8ye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Shelby, OH
Posts: 37,567
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I use Titebond because I am allergic to CA. I still use CA on CA hinges and canopy glue on the canopies.
Old 07-20-2007, 08:42 PM
  #20  
propbuster
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
propbuster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Black Mtn, NC
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Waterbased "wood" glues will actually cause the balsa to swell slightly and form a tighter joint. It's also lighter and easier to sand than epoxy for wood to foam joints. CA's good for quick joints and tacking. Polyurethane or "Gorilla" glue works great for skinning foam wing cores as long as you spread it thin on the balsa and then mist the foam before putting back in the shucks and weighting or, vac bagging. But, no, wood glue won't ever die in my shop!
Old 07-20-2007, 09:35 PM
  #21  
flipstart
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Andersonville, TN
Posts: 666
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

For the inquiry about epoxy brands-try the Devcon brand-its available at hardware store-I buy the 8oz size (8 oz of resin and 8 oz. of harderner). Its about $10 and works well. I only use the 30 minute type and this brand does not seem to be overly sensitive to mixing variations. We used a lot of Devcon products at work and they make good industrial strength adhesives.

And yes wood glue is alive and well-I buy Titebond II by the quart.
Old 07-20-2007, 10:38 PM
  #22  
Raymond LeFlyr
Senior Member
My Feedback: (2)
 
Raymond LeFlyr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Just a little south of Raleigh, NC
Posts: 2,147
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

I use CA glue very sparingly because of the irritation. I understand that your reaction to it is cummulative - like bee stings. And I've been told that if (when) you have breathing problems there is no antidote - you just have to wait it out.

I use good ole Titebond. Its cheaper than II and III.
Old 07-21-2007, 01:13 PM
  #23  
js3
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Arvada, CO
Posts: 1,260
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

Wood glue use will never die. It's great stuff.

I too suffer consequences when using CA. Must have a fan to blow the fumes away. Once, I tried applying center-section glass cloth with CA rather than epoxy or poly resin just to see how it would work. Man, did I suffer. I won't ever do that again.

As for Hobbypoxy, I loved formula II. What was it, 45 min working time and a 24 hour cure? I also liked Sig 5 min but I'm probably just sentimental because that's what I used on my first plane--a Sig Kadet. I used original Titebond for the bulk of the project.

Last year, I bought a Kadet kit on eBray for about twice what I paid back in 1977. Again, sentiment got the best of me. One day, I hope to build it for my son.
Old 07-21-2007, 01:54 PM
  #24  
heli_Rod
Senior Member
 
heli_Rod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fairmount, IN
Posts: 621
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

The key to faster drying wood glues is to fit better joints and pressure on the joint while it dries. If a joint does not fit well, most people simple apply more glue to fill the gap. However, the joints are not very strong and take longer to dry because of the excess glue applied. Take the time and get a tight, gapless joint. You only need apply enough glue to cover the glued surfaces. Wipe off excess glue that is squeezed out of the joint. Use pressure while drying. It doesn't take long to dry. It may never dry as fast as CA will cure, but it will be a higher integrity joint.

Rod
Old 07-22-2007, 12:17 PM
  #25  
quepasa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Golden Valley, AZ
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is "Wood Glue" dead?

For what it's worth when I got back into this hobby after 20+ years off, I went and got me a large bottle (7.65 fl oz) of Elmers Glue-All and some Devcon 5 min. epoxy. Never had a joint failure before, and don't expect to now. My friend said I was too "old-fashioned" & needed to try the CA's. I did, and still like the old stuff better. You may think that at least the joint where the main wings come togeather needs epoxy, but with a good fit, it does not! Elmers Glue-All will "get-r-done" tho it doesn't sand worth a hoot. I would never trust a CA in this critical area tho. If Elmers won't hold it, Devcon sure will, and the fumes don't make my head hurt!
For me, building is a labor of love, and like was said, I ain't in that big of a hurry. Still have a 25 year old 8# .60 powered bipe with over 200 flights hanging here built with Elmers, and it's still tight as a drum.

edit-Happy to see that so many others of you still like the old stuff too!

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.