Chevelle

My Feedback: (2)

Oh sure. I read all the knocks against Hitec but figured, hey, that are a major brand and have lots of product out there. They are bound to upset a few customers and probably some of them are just over reacting to a very reasonable problem.

NOT SO. I regret ever selecting them and I will never do business with them again. Here's why:

PART 1: My letter to Hitec dated June 22...

PART 2 Hitec's Response dated June 23...

I packed up the receiver in all the orginal packing materials. I called and talked to Mr. Ohm. I expressed my concern that the turn around would take a long time. He assured me that they will look into it as soon as they receive it. I again expressed my concern that I may miss an event because of this issue. He assured me that they will do what they can. I asked if a replacement could be sent to speed things up. I provided a copy of the receipt that showed I bought the receiver in March. Mr. Ohm said that too much time had gone by. It did not matter that it did not go into the plane until June. (Note the file names on the pictures.) I specifically asked if I could receive it by Friday, July 2. Mr. Ohm assured me that they would look at it as soon as it arrived and would do what they could to get it to me by Friday. (He now denies saying this.)

PART 3 The result as of June 30...

The receiver arrived at Hitec at 9am on Monday. I called on Wednesday to check on the status. They had not gotten to it but was told that they would get to it by the end of the day. With my deadline approaching, I was not feeling to comfortable about all of this. I checked back later in the day. They were just getting to it. The bottom line is that the receiver was at fault. The oscillator was detuned which reduced the sensitivity.

This is of MAJOR concern to me. Obviously their quality control is poor to allow such a product to go out. I will never risk a $100 airplane on this kind of quality much less a $1000 1/4 Sopwith Pup that tookl six months to build.

Mr. Ohm said that the earliest it could go out Thursday. They would ship it FedEx if I paid for it. ME? I already paid $15 to send it to them 3-day express. (FedEx would have gotten it there on a Saturday would would have been a waste of money.) Now they want me to pay another $33 for overnighting.

Frankly, I don't want it. I want my money back but they will not do that.

PART 4

I will never do business with Hitec and I highly recommend that you do not either. They quality control is obviously poor and their customer service is just as bad. DO NOT RISK YOUR PLANES on their stuff.

Good Luck.

Volture

My Feedback: (1)

I've seen bad receivers and servos fresh out of the box from other manufacturers. My Dodge Ram stranded me when almost new due to a bad sensor O2 connection. Could have just as easily happended with a Ford or Chevy. I got over it.

My service experience with Hitec has been nothing but excellent.

The PIPE

Dear Chevelle:

The PIPE Here yet AGAIN...and so far I've had nothing but GREAT luck with Hitec's SERVOS!

The HS-225 (along with its metal gear version) and the HS-77 "low profile" servo are my STANDARD servos for four stroke powered models (remember ALL I fly with ARE four strokers these days) and when I eventually get into Giant Scale planes, most likely with a Bristol Scout C built from my old RC buddy HANK ILTZSCH's construction plans from the March & April 1981 Model Aviation issues (the plans build up into the later Model D Scout...I've got Windsock Datafile No.44 to help out with the Scout C version) I'll be using Hitec's DIGITAL servos in THAT one! (Power will be an RCV 120SP four stroker on the Scout C...and the NEW Saito FA-220 Zeus is an UPCOMING 36 cm3 displacement [read "real Giant Scale" here!!!] four stroker I'm VERY interested in seeing out on the market!)

I DO use Hitec's "shift-selectable" model 3800 receiver for my 72 MHz flying needs with my old Ace RC Silver Seven knobby radio, and will soon start using a brand new PAIR of these on Ch.47, along with my pair of "still-to-be-encased" FMA Ch.03 Ham band receivers, with my "always-ready" new Gordon Anderson MICROSTAR-based homemade COMPUTER knobby radio!

I'm VERY sorry to hear your Zenoah gasser's ignition was playing havoc with YOUR Hitec receiver...did you take the time to send your JR Tx out, along with the Hitec receiver, to a service bureau like DuMond or Radio South to get the Hitec Rx "match-tuned" to the JR Tx you wished to use it with? The FMA Ch.03 Tx RF deck in my MicroStar these days was sent back to FMA when I ordered the Ch.03 Quantum-8 receivers from them to be "match-tuned" to that Ham band RF deck, and VERY soon I'll be doing the ground range checks with my dear old Balsa USA Swizzle Stick USING those two FMA receivers to see HOW well they'll work with my new computer "knobby box".

People that HAVE had bad experiences with Hitec's servos COULD have had bad units, but I always "burn-in" newly purchased servos on a modified Ace DataMaster unit that has the PC board from an old Ace Servo Cycle added in-to it, to provide a way of "automatically" cycling servos on the bench...after a good 30 minutes of cycling on the bench with my tester, IF a servo is still working just fine, it goes in my Swizzler for the in-air tests...THEN if it's working all right, it goes in a "really NICE" plane!

Again, VERY sorry to hear about your Hitec Rx migraine...MAYBE an FMA receiver WOULD work better...and best of luck in resolving your problem!

Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE!

XJet

Your experience is unfortunate but let's face it -- no manufacturer is perfect.

The freight issue is undoubtedly an issue but with all that investment in your plane, engine etc -- why, when you were told the receiver was faulty, didn't you just rush out and buy a new one then, when the faulty unit was fixed and returned, keep it for a spare or use it in another plane?

If you'd asked nicely, Hitec might even have simply kept your original unit and provided you with a credit to cover the cost of the replacement.

Having worked in an electronics service role for quite a few years I know exactly how hard it is to balance the many demands on your time and resources. I think you should cut the Hitec guys a bit of slack -- they may not be perfect but they're *far* better than most.

NavyE6FE

I don't like it either when something new doesn't work right, but I let the shop or the manufacturer take care of it and I try to be reasonable. When your car/truck first had something go wrong, did you take it back and tell them to keep it and you were never doing business with them again because they didn't take care of you right then? It takes people and machines to build components so there is a possibility for error. Then they probably don't test every single item and if they do they can't predict every possible senario that the item will be exposed to. You even said it yourself that the rcvr worked fine except when you pointed the TX ant directly at the plane and you said yourself that energy distribution from the tip is lower and now you know that the rcvr had a tuning problem. Give 'em a break not everything is perfect all the time. Who at Hitec received it? Probably receiving, so it probably sat there for some time before finding its way to the shop. Now its in the shop, you probably aren't the only customer that is needing something worked on and like most places its first come first served. As for the service manager, he probably doesn't know every little thing that is going on every minute of every day in the shop, he has a good idea but not the exact specifics. Maybe some test equipment broke or another service order took longer than expected, stuff like that happens. Give them a second chance at the least, okay so you missed flying that weekend, the world is not coming to an end, there will be more days to fly.

XJet

That's not a silly idea. As I've said before, Hitec's FM receivers are showing their age these days and most of mine are now sitting *under* the workbench rather than in models. For the same price as any Hitec double-conversion receiver you can pick up an FMA-M5 or Berg unit that has smart decoding which makes a *huge* difference if you fly in a noisy environment or unlucky enough to get hit by interference.

I'm sure Hitec will add this type of functionality to its FM receiver product line eventually and when they do I'll probably buy some - but in the meantime I only use their servos and transmitters.

Chevelle

My Feedback: (2)

Let's get a few things straight.

#1. My Zenoah had nothing to do with the Hitec receiver problem. The tests that I ran after seeing the problem in the air were with the engine off.

#2. Hitec's evaluation was a detuned oscillator. That reduced the sensitivity of the receiver.

#3. I did ask nicely. Several times, exploring several options. It was clearly a receiver problem so I asked for a replacement. They said no. I asked for a refund. They said no. I asked for express delivery. They said no.

#4. Yes, the problem manifested when the antenna is pointed at the plane but NOT at extreme range. The problem occured when the plane was in the standard pattern around the field, maybe a thousand feet away. All receivers should have no problem with that irrespective the antenna orientation.

#5. Sure, I have a lot invested in this plane but my budget is quite limited. The cost of this project was stretched out over six months. I have just two planes. I really don't think it should be necessary to go out and buy an extra receiver in the eventuality that the one that I just bought would be defective and that the manufacturer would not provide the minimum of accommodation for the trouble they caused.

#6. I know manufacturers in all fields have issues but this one points to poor quality control. No excuses. I followed all the recommended steps for preflight. What if I had lost the plane? Oh well. Too bad. **** happens?

#7. All I asked for if for them to minimize the impact for their defective product. Virtually no cooperation.

#8. I never would have written this if only they had just apologized for the defective receiver, apologized for the inconvenience, and overnighted the fixed unit or a replacement. Was that too much to ask for?

You want to do business with them, fine. Good luck. Not me. I have heard nothing but good things about JR's product support. They made my transmitter so that's where I'm going for my receiver. I've heard they stand by their products. It has already cost me more for the Hitec than for the JR receiver thanks to the shipping costs.

NavyE6FE

#8. Yes, Do you have a contract with them that states that Hitec will provide you with a perfect product 100% of the time and replacement instantly and under your terms or else???? For crying out loud if you want that kind of product and service the price of the rcvr is going to be a couple of hundred dollars. Nothing is perfect 100% of the time. As far as JR rcvr's go, make sure that they work at the field you fly from. There is a club field here that can't fly JR rcvr's due to interference, Hitec and Futaba work great. The field I fly at only has ch 20 restricted and all brands work so far. What are you going to do the first time you have a problem with JR??

Chevelle

My Feedback: (2)

Well then I hope that you are that understanding if you lose a plane to poor workmanship or poor quality control.

No one asked them to do anything under MY terms. I asked for some way where my down time can be limited because of an upcoming event. I was assured BY THEM that they would address the problem as soon as they received it (they did not) and that they would do what they could to return the receiver by Friday (they did not.) All they had to do was to send a replacement which would have cost them NOTHING.

MustangFan

Well it's unfortunate that you had a bad experience with them.

let's do some math.
Hitec Supreme receiver Tower price $55.00 ... Really a good price for an 8 ch. receiver.

Shipping to Hitec ... $18.00
Shipping from Hitec .... $33.00
Total .... $48.00

My cutoff point for repair is 50% of new purchase price or $27.50 in this case.
So just shipping TO them approached this limit !

For $55.00 I would not have risked ANY plane ... just the build time alone is worth more than that. ($25.00 per hour at least)

Sooooooooo ... if I had an important date to meet ... and the receiver wasn't working properly ... I may have taken one from another plane, or if that wasn't possible ... order from either Tower or Don's hobby (normally better pricing and shipping charges).

But I would not have let $50.00 add that much frustration or grief to my life. Life is too short for that in my opinion.

I'm not sure what you expected them to do for a $55.00 receiver when the profit is not that much.
I'm amazed that they can build, market, ship and repair and keep the price to that.

Again, I'm sorry you are so upset at them, but there were more alternatives to consider.
Don't let this one experience throw you!

Chevelle

My Feedback: (2)

Your logic is perfectly sound. I agree. Up until the possibility of a return shipping cost, I felt I had little choice. I had a $55 receiver that didn't work. I could have ordered another for another $55 thus spending $110 for one working receiver. Or I could have spent the $15 to send the broken one to them. That seemed to be the better way to go, especially since they initially stated that I would receive it in time.

SMALLFLY-

My Feedback: (19)

Can I have some whine to go with that cheese? If you think you were treated badly quit buying from them, but you dont have to P&M about it and try to convince the many of us that use there products and like them that we are making big mistakes as evidenced by your subject line.

bkf

My Feedback: (5)

And Futaba, Jr, Airtronics don't crash and burn out of the box either?...... Cut em some slack. You don't know what shipping is till ya deal with some of the other vendors out there. Mike Rock's, Bends over backwards through hoops to help.

Mike in DC

Chevelle, do you have any evidence that any of the other manufacturers would have been more generous in fixing a $55 device? I'm just curious. I've used both Futaba and Hitec service and I'd give Hitec the edge, though neither were particular fast. I get the impression we're not talking big operations in either case.

Johng

My Feedback: (4)

If you followed all the recommended steps for preflight, why was the glitch only found on a ground check done AFTER you flew it? Did you not perform a range check beforehand or wasn't it thorough enough?

Things happen, and getting it turned around the same week is good service. You will have to go a long way to find any mfr of anything that will overnight it to you on their nickel after a warranty repair. That includes JR, Futaba, Nike, Maytag, Dell, etc.

I used to work in a customer service position, and the only way we were allowed to send something overnight was in the case of a customer that spent 6 figures with us.

MustangFan

Chevelle

I just don't think you can expect them to spend $33.00 to ship a $50.00 receiver.

Check some other hobby sources, most charge $25.00+ for overnight shipping.

It's just a lot to ask for ! That is over 60% of the cost of the receiver.
This receiver can be purchased for under $50.00, but if you want it overnight ... then add another 50% to that.

Makes you wonder about the cost of shipping ... must be more lucrative than building 8 channel receivers !!!

Hang in there ... s*** happens !

ghee-grose

I see your problem and think the main aggrevation arose from trying to meet a dead line. If you hadn't been in a hurry you wouldn't have had to send it and get it back so urgently. You might just have to miss an event. You high shipping cost was your choice.

I am currently grounded with my Hangar 9 Twist due to a faulty carb on a new engine. I shipped it priority USPS for less than $5. That was 10 days ago and still no engine has showed up on my door step. I know it's crap waiting like this...but I just get over it. It's also crap when you get bad product...I just have to get over it.

Highflight

My Feedback: (4)

Chevelle Bob, let's cut to the chase:

The airplanes we build and fly consist of LOT'S of various and technically advanced systems. On top of that, each builder does things in different ways, and usually, it's how these systems are installed by the builder that are the problem.

In those rare cases where the equipment fails, it is almost always as a result of builder induced damage (vibration not properly accounted for, metal on metal contact somewhere; stuff like that).

For the very rare remainder of cases where a defect in the original manufacture of the product accounts for the problem, well, tough.
Every, and I mean EVERY manufacturer of ANY and EVERY kind of product is going to have an "expected" failure rate. That's life.

So the bottom line, Bob, is that you are in the wrong hobby.
Perhaps you should try some other hobby where equipment used in that hobby NEVER fails like:

Skydiving - oops, no, bad idea. People have spent 2 grand on parachutes that failed. I wonder who sends the chute in for warranty repair?
Motorcycle Racing - ahh, nope. Been there, done that.
Photography - doggonit, no. I just had to send an 8 month old Hassleblad in for warranty work so that won't work for you either.

I think, Bob, you might want to get into collecting little figurines or something like that with no moving or electrical parts. And if you drop one, you can always send it back to the manufacturer and complain that it wasn't made strong enough.

Here's the deal: If you suspect the receiver is problematic, PUT IN ANOTHER RECEIVER FOR GOD'S SAKE! If that doesn't fix the problem, then look elswhere at your installation for possible glitching causes. If trying another receiver fixes the glitching, then don't send the other receiver back for work, just replace the crystal because the crystal is the most fragile thing in a receiver and is most often the cause of a problem.
If replacing the crystal doesn't fix the problem in that receiver, then just throw the d*** thing away. Why would you be so willing to risk a $1000 airplane on a questionable electronic part even IF it's been declared "good" by anyone?

By the way, in your photo of your engine; it looks like the engine mount is barely touching the metal washer of the engine mount. Any vibration between the two can cause RF. And I wasn't even looking hard to spot that. What else might you have "set up" to cause vibration induced, metal on/with metal RF?

Also, if you get glitching at 75 feet on your range check, YOU SHOULD NEVER HAVE FLOWN THE AIRPLANE!!!
That's terrible even if you'd had the antenna fully collapsed (you say it was 1/3rd extended), and if you had lost the aircraft after flying it with such a lousy range check, that would have been YOUR fault, not ANYONE ELSES.
With my EVO12, I range check out to WELL OVER 150 feet away and still have FULL control of my aircraft (antenna fully COLLAPSED) and only quit there because I get tired of walking.
How can you say that: "No glitching was experienced during the normal ground checks", and then one paragraph later state that you got range check glitching at 75 feet?

And let me also ask: It looks as if you have the entire fuselage behind the engine wrapped in metal. Is that right? You might want to take a look at ANYTHING that comes in contact with that, and also keep in mind that that area is serving as a large antenna in it's own right that could interfere with the receiver.

The more I look at your photos, the less I suspect that the receiver itself is the problem.
You also say the it's just the elevator that "bumps up". Change out the elevator servo and see what that does. Glitching on just one channel is not normally indicative of a receiver problem. In fact, other than the servo and the connectors between that servo and the receiver (try unplugging and replugging the connectors several time to promote better contact at the connectors), I'd wonder more if the transmitter might need tuning. It's interesting that you immediately suspect a NEW receiver as being the problem rather than a year old radio.

But then evidently, in the end, Hitec tells you that the receiver needed tuning. So there ya' go. Good warrantee work. Now what's your beef?
And even with the receiver back in the plane, you STILL appear to have some other things you might take a look at on your aircraft.

Highflight

Chevelle

My Feedback: (2)

Well don't we think a lot of ourselves! I'm sure glad you pointed me away from this hobby. I'm sure that I'll check with you when I need to make the rest of those important life decisions.

"Tough"? "That's life?" I'll be sure to pass your sentiments on to those that make full scale aircraft engines if a 757 goes down with you in it do to the "expected" failure rate. Or how about that pacemaker that you may have some day or that laser eye surgery instrument that has an unexpected burp in engery output or the manufacturer of your car's brakes.

Sure. I do understand if a part fails. It does happen. This one didn't. If was bad right out of the box with something so fundamental to a receiver's operation. The oscillator was not properly tuned. Bad manufacturing process for doing it and bad QC for not catching it. Even so. I did catch it before a catastrophe. Good for me. So how about a little cooperation from the manufacturer to help with the inconvenience and down time? Nope. Your snide comments aside, I didn't drop it, mishandle it in any way.

Now on to my building and testing..

Maybe you should have looked harder. It's a vibration mount. Hard rubber spacers between the plywood and the washers and the plywood and the firewall.

The many range checks I did before I flew the plane were fine. They were done like everyone does them. They were fine. The difference between them and the last ones after I saw the problem in the air is that I intentionally moved the transmitter up and down so that at some point the transmitter antenna was pointed at the plane. THEN I got the problem on the ground. By the way, those tests were with the engine OFF. No ignition or RF noise.

Thanks for the tips. You must be an electrical engineer with close to thirty years of design experience, just like me. I'll also bet you are an RF expert. Sure sounds like it. And I'll bet you didn't even have to think too hard to come up with that.

As the post states, the aluminum sheeting is GROUNDED to the engine case. So is the aluminum cowl and the rest of the sheeting. I took advantage of the scale features of the airplane to completely eliminate the possibility of RF problems. Even the suspension landing gear has a plastic sleave over the axle so that there is no axle to bracket rubbing. I'll be sure to check with you on my next build. I'm sure you have a wealth of other tips.

So why bother poking at the construction and testing. It was clearly a defective receiver. If my building quality hadn't been as good as it was, any interference, coupled with a bad receiver would have surely resulted in a crash.

Not wanting to risk the plane on Hitec again, I went and got a JR700. In spite of my "shoddy" building, everything is as it should be and now works great.

I sure hope your don't charge for your advice. It was certainly worth what I paid for it.

Scott Claboe

My Feedback: (9)

Thanks for the heads up!I want to hear any information about any product that fails or is defective.The reciever should have been replaced.Nice to hear everbodys willing to crash $1000 airplane due to a bad reciever.


ScottC

PlaneKrazee

My Feedback: (14)

You didn't have another receiver you could have used for the event? You could'nt send it Priority Mail, Delivery Conformation for $3.55?
Hitec was going to check it and repair or replace it for you, does the warranty include express shipping? Why didn't you return it to Tower?

Hitec makes many excellent products as do other companies but S__T happens. You don't hear me saying, "Don't buy Futaba because two of my 9202 servos have bad feedback pots new out of the package. Oh my, this could crash my plane if I install them on the elevator." No, I chose not to use them.

Get a grip.

Chevelle

My Feedback: (2)

No. I didn't have another receiver.

I spent $15 shipping it priority mail. (FedEx would have been faster but would have gotten it there on Saturday.) If they had looked at it when they got it like they said they would, they could have returned it in time without express mail or overnight. Their other alternative would have been to send me a replacement.

So the point is, they could very well have taken care of this problem as they said they would. They did not. Sure stuff happens. I can work with that. That's why I called them ahead of time. I was just looking ffor them to do what they said they would.

Thanks anyway but my grip is fine.

Panzlflyer

My Feedback: (15)

You dont have to be an engineer or have a degree in anything to know that Aluminum wrapped models are a major pain when it comes to glitches.!!!
You may have shock mounted the motor but what Highflight is saying is that if one of those bolts touches your backplate then you will most likely have a source of interference. (vibration caused by the iso mount).
For instance a metal pushrod touching the cyl head and THATS ALL is enough to cause glitches.
If your receiver was slightly out of tune then this will all help the problem.

Panzlflyer

My Feedback: (15)

One further thing is that quite a few of us here have had major problems with Flying wires causing glitches as they vibrate.
In fact on my Pitts I didnt bother to use them for that reason rather fly than scale!!

dhooks

My Feedback: (24)

I dont think its going to help to start a pissing match. I got a good idea what everybody thinks just by scanning over the thread. Maybe we could discuss potholes or something so this thread doesnt get shut down ? Hey not trying to be a pain ....just observing.

Dan