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Rant - Sorry :/

Old 03-26-2009, 02:33 PM
  #1  
bzinfinity
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Default Rant - Sorry :/

I don't know where else to post this. I am so pissed off right now I can't see straight.

This is the only outlet I have to get this word out, I don't have blogs, or work for a radio station, nothing. This forum is the only group of people I talk to on a regular basis outside of my face to face contacts in which I have the chance to get a point across in any rapid fashion.

I have recently been "informed" of a change to PayPal/Ebay policy regarding the sales of R/C items which are considered by PayPal/Ebay to be "High Risk" items due to their nature.

I recently sold some stuff on Ebay. A Lost Mini LST2, An RC18R, A Trex 450sa, Losi 1/10 Desert Truck and a MGT 8.0. I was just making some space for some new stuff.

Since all of these items sold for more than 100.00, and are considered to be "High Risk," PayPal freezes the funds AUTOMATICALLY in your accounts until the buyer leaves Positive Feedback, or until 21 days go by with no dispute or chargeback, or until 3 days after shipment can be confirmed.

ALL of the items I sold have been delievered. I am not able to access a single cent of the money I was paid (over 1000.00).

So basically, right now, the buyer has the product, but I have no money. And if a dispute or chargeback is issued, I am required to pay to ship the item back to me, and they get all their money back.

And this is all assuming that they ever ACTUALLY send the item back. Why would you once you chargeback paypal? You have the item, and you have the money back in your account, and the only option I am left with is to pursue a Magistrate Court warrant in what will most likely turn out to be another state.

This is absolutely ridiculous. It's almost theft on the part of PayPal. PayPal is allowing buyers to basically get off scott free with Theft by Deception.

If (and I stress, IF) I ever get my 1000.00 from PayPal I will never again list an item or buy an item from Ebay. The day the money clears, both of my accounts with both businesses will be closed immediately.

I will not be part of this scam again.

And, I'm a Cop. If the money gets charged back and I don't get the item back, I will buy plane tickets, and personally request court orders for PayPal's records and work with the proper jurisdiction to file charges against the buyers for theft by deception.

Completely unbelievable. PayPal has turned into a giant Craigslist scam. You would never ship an item if you didn't have cash in hand.

And I am partially to blame, because as soon as I saw the emails that said "Notification Of Payment Received" from PayPal, I shipped the items, just like I always did. After all the payments were received and the items shipped out, I checked PayPal and the full balance was "Pending."

I have called PayPal and literally raised immortal hell, they refuse to do anything.

So, I'm issuing this warning to everyone here.

If you sell something that is an R/C product for more than 100.00 - DO NOT USE PAYPAL.

Or, if you do use PayPal - list the item in some obscure category like "Office Supplies" so that you don't get hit with the "High Risk" flag from the Ebay system.

Again - sorry this is off topic, but you guys are like my extended network of friends here. Just wanted to get the word out.

Old 03-26-2009, 02:51 PM
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Dale Gribble
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Here is a CNN news article on it. This is the first I heard about it.

[link=http://money.cnn.com/2008/02/08/smbusiness/paypal_funds_freeze.fsb/]http://money.cnn.com/2008/02/08/smbusiness/paypal_funds_freeze.fsb/[/link]

Not all eBay sellers are subjected to this apparantly. Here is the criteria from paypal directly. You must fall into one of these categories.

The most important criteria for sellers to understand is that PayPal doesn’t hold payments for eBay items if you meet the following:
• You have been an eBay member for 6-months or more, and
• Your total Feedback score is 100 or greater, and
• Your Buyer dissatisfaction percentage is less than 5%.
Or
• Your average Detailed Seller Rating (DSR) is 4.5 or greater, and
• You have received 20 or more DSRs in the last 12-months, and
• Your buyer dissatisfaction percentage is less than 5%
Old 03-26-2009, 03:08 PM
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241 racing
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Thanks for the heads up guy's very interesting,hope you get your money bzinfinity.
Old 03-26-2009, 03:27 PM
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bzinfinity
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

dude, that's what I don't get. Been a member forever. 100% positive feedback. Now they implement DSRs and suddenly I'm a high risk because I haven't sold anything until now after the DSRs were implemented.

Can't believe it made CNN.

Just found out (while repeating this to the LHS owner) that paypal has 20k of his money pending.
Old 03-26-2009, 03:28 PM
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yoster
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

I'm sure you will get your money, just allow the process to flow.

I honestly think this is a step in the right direction. It's almost always the buyers that are getting ripped off.
Old 03-26-2009, 03:37 PM
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transam388
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Sorry for what happened but they are just trying to protect themselves as well as buyers. Unlike a war hero they do not dive onto grenades (Or lack of goods / payment) to save others, they try to save themseleves. The main issue is usually sellers get the money and then just disappear so they want to try and make sure you are who you say you are and that you are a good seller with some positive history.

Not saying I agree with the entire way this has been done but I guess just trying to cool you down and just say have a cold one and see that life could be worse. This does suck but it could be worse! I am sure you will actually get your money just is taking longer than it should.

If people in general would just do the right thing and quit stealing, decieving, scamming, then all this type of BS would not be needed. What is bad though is when it happens someone is going to take the hit. Seems like in this day and age you have to enforce morallity and that really does sadden me. []

Sorry and I do hope this all works out for you. Also, thanks for being an officer and helping to keep some of this type of stuff from happening!!
Old 03-26-2009, 04:35 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Bz,

I noticed this too when I sold something that wasn't RC related. Same thing, rather annoying. I can say that in my, albeit limited, experience that it does clear and I didn't have any problems. However, it has given me some thought to listing an T-Maxx on eBay.
Old 03-26-2009, 05:00 PM
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flyexperimental
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Skip paypal next time and do postal money orders.That way paypal makes 0.
Old 03-26-2009, 05:09 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Why is it THAT big of a deal... Yes you have to wait for your money which sucks but it's not a scam. They are doing this to stop scams.
Old 03-26-2009, 05:32 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

I never sell anything on Ebay. Too many issues like the one you described. I order something every now and then but just affordable or cheap items that I can't find anywhere else.
Old 03-26-2009, 11:10 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/


ORIGINAL: fabrimacator21

Why is it THAT big of a deal... Yes you have to wait for your money which sucks but it's not a scam. They are doing this to stop scams.
It is that big of a deal because the last time ThunderbirdJunkie sold something on ebay, it took A MONTH for the guy to leave feedback
Old 03-27-2009, 01:07 AM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Id still use ebay, just skip paypal and do money orders.
Old 03-27-2009, 02:19 AM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/


ORIGINAL: cummins driver

Id still use ebay, just skip paypal and do money orders.
If your buying the new setup makes it more safe. If your selling you just have to wait for your money.
Old 03-27-2009, 02:48 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

I don't know what to think about this. Personally I think paypal is going crazy, all the new implemented fees have reached crazy highs. Now they take away 15% of your total sale and thats without insertion and other fees. Hell if there was any other auction site other than craigslist then I'd use it, but I've pretty much stopped selling on ebay. Now I wonder what the heck I'll do with my T-maxx thats collecting dust in the basement.

Tom.
Old 03-27-2009, 04:48 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Well this is what free market is about. You now see a need to provide both sellers and buyers a way to send and recieve money quickly while still making some money for yourself. Set up a new one system for this purpose!

The one thing most people fail to see is the true scale of these services and companies. To us it is 30 dollars or even a thousand. Now image that times 15000 minimum. When you have that many transactions ocurring and so many jerks who try to scam and not pay or send items while you are the middle man it becomes much more complicated than most people understand and you do need to protect yourself as well as the others. Not saying I don't get upset at this type of thing also but you have to understand that when one person does not pay it may not be a big deal but when you deal with thousands of transactions a day or more this just quadruples!

So whenever you see someone doing this type of BS by not shipping or paying....give them all sorts of hell and try to show them how to be a responsible person. Do unto others as you would have done unto you!!!
Old 03-27-2009, 10:36 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Uh oh, a cop gets a bit of his own forces' medicine; not really, but you get the humor, not agreeing with the "law." You out of all people should understand that
Old 03-27-2009, 10:51 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

BZinfinity
Thanks for the heads up.
I have never bought or sold anything on Ebay or dealt in any way, shape or form with paypal
Now I have another reason not to have anything to do with them
Old 03-27-2009, 10:54 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/


ORIGINAL: usmc_VTOL_mech

BZinfinity
Thanks for the heads up.
I have never bought or sold anything on Ebay or dealt in any way, shape or form with paypal
Now I have another reason not to have anything to do with them
That's like saying you're not going to drive because there are cops out there patrolling the road.
Old 03-27-2009, 11:20 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

looks like selling on the fourms is the way to go..
Old 03-27-2009, 11:49 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/


ORIGINAL: bzinfinity

Since all of these items sold for more than 100.00, and are considered to be "High Risk," PayPal freezes the funds AUTOMATICALLY in your accounts until the buyer leaves Positive Feedback, or until 21 days go by with no dispute or chargeback, or until 3 days after shipment can be confirmed.

Seems like the "3 day after shipment can be confirmed" thing might be the best way to get your money faster.

What does e-bay/pay-pal consider confirmaton of shipping?

Also, aren't there other payment services like pay-pal that can be used? Or does e-bay limit their usage too?
Old 03-28-2009, 12:06 AM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

ThunderbirdJunkie is pretty sure the only payment option with eBay anymore is paypal. Kind of stinks, but

RCU has a fantastic trading section...which We think will become more flooded as a result of all this.
Old 03-28-2009, 12:42 AM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

How come (this thread for example) the last post says Thunderbirdjunkie but when i open it his post is never in here....Been seeing this alot. Is he on mod watch or something.
Old 03-28-2009, 01:39 AM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

Man i completely feel your pain, its not jsut the money being held in escrow that drove me nuts, it was the fact there was no notice of it, this rule change isnt actually new, the same thing happen to me back in november of 2008, i sold a spare nitro motor and was shocked when i could not get my money out and had to wait on the seller.

Another thing that really pist me off is that its a known fact 90 something percent of the times paypal will always side's with the seller so its very scary thing. Luckly the guy give me a possitive feedback ASAP and i got my money quickly but the fact ebay/paypal thinks that this type of policy is ok made me refuse to EVER use there service again.

I DON'T BUY OR SELL ON EBAY ANYMORE I REFUSE TO SUPPORT THERE SERVICE. Ive seen the amount of item on ebay drop drastically over the years, its just a matter of time before they go under.
Old 03-28-2009, 12:03 PM
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/

ORIGINAL: usmc_VTOL_mech

BZinfinity
Thanks for the heads up.
I have never bought or sold anything on Ebay or dealt in any way, shape or form with paypal
Now I have another reason not to have anything to do with them
I have bought several hundreds of USD worth of RC stuff from ebay in the past, before this $100 cap limit thingy. Then, this past x-mas, I tried to buy a some hop-ups and they had the gall to tell me that I cannot purchase or pay until I get verified!!!!! The qucikest way for me to gte verified is to sign up for a PayPal credit card with rather outrageous intrest. (I will never use that damn card, I will actually cancel it now since I have not used it since I got it in the mail).

I no longer buy anything from fleabay or ever pay with PayPal anymore. I would much rather pay the extra $20 to like A-main, Tower, or any other repuatable place that directly takes credit card.

BTW, Semper Fi!
Old 03-28-2009, 12:24 PM
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bzinfinity
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Default RE: Rant - Sorry :/


ORIGINAL: PrjctStrtFrce

Uh oh, a cop gets a bit of his own forces' medicine; not really, but you get the humor, not agreeing with the "law." You out of all people should understand that
I cannot recall the last time I gave someone a ticket and held their car in impound until 3 days after I verified the ticket was paid, or until they left a positive comment on my work history file.

Not even close.

And PayPal is not "law."

PayPal has implemented a policy that is a MAJOR loophole in FDIC regulations. One that should have been closed about 20 years ago due to people like Bear Stearns, Charles Schwab, etc, etc, etc, etc.

If a normal bank did this they would get sued, and would lose. PayPal is arbitrarily placing a hold on VERIFIED funds. Unlike cashing a check in which the bank has to verify the funds, which is why checks over 500.00 get held.


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